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Post subject: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:48 pm
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Do you do it or do you take it in to the shop? I'm curious as to what a repair guy charges to have things like intonation, height adjust, neck tweek , pickups installed. new tuners, pots etc.? I haven't taken a bass in for anything except to have bone nuts put in and that was right about $90 + tax here in my neighborhood. A full paint job is 100 to 150. The painter is a buddy of mine. I have no idea what a shop would charge to refinish a bass body.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:55 pm
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Most people that tell you to take the bass in to a guitarshop for a setup are usually trying to make money for themselves. If you take it slow and follow directions it's hard to mess up a bass on your own.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:21 pm
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To those who say that having a tech do your setup is a stupid waste of money because you can set it up yourself, I say that you have never had a decent tech. Some of them, not all of them, can actually do it better than I can and I've done setups since 1968. I don't do them daily or even weekly. They do. Some people are just more gifted at it than others. I can also paint my living room, but a professional painter is going to do a better neater job faster. When you find a bass setup tech like that you'll know and won't ever again say such silly things, unless of course you are that gifted bass tech and then you should take in work since you are so gifted and charge $65 to do it. I'm not that guy.

Prior to moving to Nashville about 6 or 7 years ago, Tim Galloway was working at The Music Mart (Fender dealer) here in Albemarle, NC and he did my setups for 5 years or maybe more. He now plays lead guitar and is band leader for Josh Turner (multi-platinum MCA artist) plus he does tons of session work for others and has co-written a top 5 country hit. I had no idea he was such a good country guitar player but I sure loved his bass setups. I'd actually heard him play very little guitar at the shop because he was always working, but never seemed particularly happy about it. His bass setups eventually became what I'd say was fairly pricey for a small town tech but it was still worth every cent. A setup from him went from $25 at first about 12 years ago to $55 near the end of his tenure at The Music Mart. He eventually setup all the basses I had or bought no matter where I got them until he moved away.

The younger man who took Tim's place only charges $15 to $25 depending on time consumed. The new guy does OK, but obviously no better than I could do myself and I usually have to do a few tweaks behind him. So now I usually do setups myself and I only visit the shop if I run into an issue like frets or nuts which has happened. I might try him again sometime in the near future to see how he's coming along on my next purchase which i'm contemplating a lot. Tim Galloway's setups though I couldn't improve upon and they have needed only tiny tweaks since and he's been gone for nearly 7 years. I just change out the exact same string sets one string at a time and haven't had to touch much else. I take good care of my gear and don't expose them to extreme temperatures and they are in AC almost 100% of the time.

ALWAYS ASK ABOUT FEES IN ADVANCE. FEES CAN VARY WILDLY! (Apparently even in the same shop by different techs!) Also the price you pay is not ALWAYS indicative of expertise! I paid $50 for a setup at a "leading" Charlotte shop about 2 years ago that was actually a much worse setup than the $25 setup by "the new guy" that took Tim Galloway's place at the local shop. I basically had to do that setup over myself changing every string height and intonation setting and putting some relief back in the neck which they cranked too straight for my style of play.

Would I pay $55 or $75 for another Tim Galloway setup? Absolutely. He set them up perfectly every time and much better than I can do. He was nothing short of a miracle worker. I found out about his setups when I bought an instrument there and he said as a deal closer, "I'll do a real good setup for you on it free with whatever strings you want," and from then on I always got him to setup all my instruments. That went on for like 5 years or so.

A huge factor in a professional bass setup has to do with how the player is going to play it and tailoring the setup to the player's style. How you play is something your tech should ask or better yet the tech should watch you play something or be familiar with your personal style. A good pick player setup can be very different from a forceful fingerstyle setup which is also different from a fusion setup. At least in my case what works "by the book" is less than ideal. Therefore following "the book" doesn't work as well for me.

Anybody can set it up "by the book" with the feeler gauges, capos and all that stuff. But a really good tech can do it by knowing how you are going to use it and then do it by FEEL to fit you personally like a tailor made suit. If you are ever lucky enough to find a tech like that, know it is a rare thing and something I really miss now.

Tim Galloway isn't the only successful picker from Albemarle NC. Unknown Hinson a Nashville studio semi-regular for a long time now was a guitar teacher in Albemarle when I moved here in 1980 under his real name of Stuart "Danny" Baker operating Baker Guitar Studio. Everyone here knows him as Danny Baker. He still actually lives here! Until his recent "retirement" Unknown Hinson toured North America for months at a time playing his "Unknown Hinson" signature Reverend brand git-tar. If you ever had a chance to see his show live you no doubt realize it is something you will never ever live to forget. Hank Williams III certainly can't forget because Hank Sr's grandson had Unknown's face tattooed on his arm. Baker under the name Stuart Baker plays guitar and bass in The Boxmasters which is Billy Bob Thornton's Band for just one of his studio projects. When the Boxmasters play out he isn't in the Unknown Hinson role but is slightly more normal but not completely normal and yet still one heck of a picker. I swear this is the truth, Danny Baker/Unknown Hinson is also the voice of Early Culyer on the animated TV show "The Squidbillies" which airs during the Adult Swim portion on the Cartoon Network. So he's got lots of things going on all because of the Unknown Hinson persona and the fact that he can play the behonkus out of a git-tar.

So I guess we have sort of a studio guitarist and cartoon voiceover breeding ground going here now. Unknown Hinson alone makes up some for everyone associating Albemarle, NC with ditzy Kellie Pickler. Now they can associate our town with a full blown lunatic who thinks he is a hillbilly vampire. Actually Ms. Pickler is not from Albemarle, NC. She's from Palestine which is a rural community outside Albemarle. She did not attend Albemarle High School but went to the rural North Stanly High School which is where people from Palestine go. Yet for some reason she always claims she's from Albemarle when she in fact is from near Albemarle but not actually from Albemarle. That's like saying you are from New York City when you are really from Jersey. She did work at the Albemarle Sonic Drive-In for a while though. I was eating there a lot more during her employment as a curb hop and re-ordering to get a sundae for some reason. This happened like 3 days a week. We don't have a "Hooters" here and that was the next best thing at the time I guess. Perhaps Kellie is one of the "sexy womerns" Unknown was singing about for all those years.

Refinish fees vary wildly. Gord Miller charges one thing, Lay's charges something else and Mark Jenny undercuts them all. I wouldn't let anybody around here do a refinish other than this one larger auto body shop where the owner is also a player. They have a regular weekly guitar jam right there in the body shop. There is a Rickenbacker branded bass amp stack there that looks like it is from the late 1970's or early 80's maybe and probably should be in a museum because it is the only one I've ever seen. While the local body shop has state of the art paint gear I still think I'd go for Gord Miller for anything beyond maybe a Squier or a MIM Standard but really I have never felt I just had to have one refinished. I like the wear. Of course if I ran across say a 62 Jazz with a terrible Krylon refinish for $300 at a yard sale I'd probably give Gord Miller some business.

Tim Galloway of the Josh Turner Band (From Albemarle)

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Unknown Hinson (From Albemarle)

Image

Early Culyer (Also from Albemarle)

Image

Kellie Pickler (Not actually from Albemarle but claims to be)

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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:03 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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Anyhow..I do my own setups, been playing for 20 plus years and know from experience. Plus..I just don't trust people with my bass. *I'm only talking about intonation and neck adjustments...that stuff. I don't know finish work.

Now, Rickenbackers are a mystery to me. I'll also go ahead and admit to butchering a couple Leo Quan bridges.

That's a good pic of Kelly.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:38 pm
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Yeah it is a good pic of Kellie. I can still see her bringing my foot long cheese coney and tater tots.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:55 am
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A good set up by a good tech is worth every penny, a large percentage of people/players I know do their own and a lot of them say the same old of how they can do it better blah blah, truth is we can't. I do a lot of my own work, but I also tend to have a lot of setups done now, there are two excellent guys/shops in my area, with strings £45-55 is the going rate.


I don't think there is any black magic to it but as Bro Dave said and I totally agree when you have good tech doing the job daily he is going to be a lot better at than we are and will do a much better job, and I have found this to be the case and you really can feel the difference, I would add the caveat that you do need to find a good tech, as sadly there are some butchers out there and they can sometimes lurk in big name shops, that really trade on a reputation that may not be all its cracked up to be.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:20 am
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I started back in the 70's doing my own work (within reason). It was all about money. Musicians didn't have money back then and neither did I.
Now it's about money . I'd go broke . Too many guitars.
I set up my friends' guitars for them for zip.
I've read books about repairs and set ups. That really helped. All the trial and error helps too. I doubt I'll ever change.
I really love working on guitars and building them. I'm not a luthier (spell) though.
If Oxfan wants to drive over down here I'll only charge him 150 to do a set up. HA!!!!! Naw- he prob can do his own !

It's interesting to hear the prices for stuff in different parts of the Globe.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:48 am
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I just took my new ASP5 in yesterday to have the tech at a local shop do the set up. $35 plus I provided the new set of strings. I agree with what most are saying, I can do the set up, but not nearly as well as the tech I took it to.

Hey brotherdave check out this old youtube clip; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trf4CxKFUBw

The lead guitar player is Greg Jennings. He wrote the song Hummingbird.

Image

I went to school with him 9th grade to 12th. I still talk with him from time to time and catch their shows when they are in the area.
I visited him in Nashville for about a week in '91. He handed out guitars to me and another one of our old school mates. He played about 8 bars on one and said this thing is off. He then set the intonation by ear. I didn't check it with a tuner, but I bet he was really close if not right on.
In the 9th grade he was playing solo guitar at the rich folks cocktail parties in OKC and was also giving guitar lessons. He would come to school on Monday mornings and tell me about it. Usually something like,"I got paid $35 bucks and thay slipped me a couple of martini's."
He always amazed everyone with his guitar playing back then. Hendrix was his hero and still is. He is one of the nicest people you will ever meet. Back in school he didn't have much choice, but he would sit down and play guitar with anyone. Today he can play with just about anyone he pleases, but if he has the time he'll still sit down with you or me or anyone else who's wanting to do a little picking.

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2012 American Standard Precision V - Candy Cola Red
2012 Squier Vintage Modified Jazz V - Surf Green
2011 FCS Custom Classic Special Jazz Bass V - Violin Burst
1996 MIM Stratocaster HSS - Black
1975 Precision Bass - 3 Tone Sunburst


Last edited by grho50 on Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:50 am
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No paid guitar tech could ever possibly set up my guitar better than I can. I don't care how wonderful the tech is.
I am the one who plays it. I am the one who feels it. I am the one who spends time with it.
I am the one who owns it and has access to it day in and day out.
I am the one who can make it perfect because I can get it really really close, play it for a few days and then make the tiniest of changes, play it again and repeat until it's absolutely perfect. If it takes two weeks and fourteen adjustments ... so what?
I've sometimes made changes so slight that I only turned a saddle screw less than half a flat ... and that's on one end only.
I get my guitars perfect.
Absolutely perfect.
Perfect for me, for my hands, for my style, for my preference.
No paid guitar tech in the world can ever do that.
He can only make it perfect for him.
Only I can make it perfect for me.

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Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:57 am
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BMW-KTM I don't doubt you a bit. Unfortunately there are people like me that just don't seem to be as talented at setting up guitars/basses. I can do an OK job, but the tech I take it to knows how I like it and does a really good job.
But I do envy people such as yourself, but as for the rest of us, taking it to a good tech is not always a bad idea.

_________________
2012 American Standard Precision V - Candy Cola Red
2012 Squier Vintage Modified Jazz V - Surf Green
2011 FCS Custom Classic Special Jazz Bass V - Violin Burst
1996 MIM Stratocaster HSS - Black
1975 Precision Bass - 3 Tone Sunburst


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:21 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
No paid guitar tech could ever possibly set up my guitar better than I can. I don't care how wonderful the tech is.
I am the one who plays it. I am the one who feels it. I am the one who spends time with it.
I am the one who owns it and has access to it day in and day out.
I am the one who can make it perfect because I can get it really really close, play it for a few days and then make the tiniest of changes, play it again and repeat until it's absolutely perfect. If it takes two weeks and fourteen adjustments ... so what?
I've sometimes made changes so slight that I only turned a saddle screw less than half a flat ... and that's on one end only.
I get my guitars perfect.
Absolutely perfect.
Perfect for me, for my hands, for my style, for my preference.
No paid guitar tech in the world can ever do that.
He can only make it perfect for him.
Only I can make it perfect for me.


I agree that is true to a certain extent, however I don't do nut or fret work. Usually after a setup I wind up making some tiny adjustments. Dressing and leveling frets is something I just don't do. As far as a basic setup goes, this one guy was extra good at it and did it perfectly for me but is gone now. Neck relief is something I have a great deal of difficulty getting just right and apparently that is also a weak spot with some techs.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:26 am
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grho50 wrote:
I just took my new ASP5 in yesterday to have the tech at a local shop do the set up. $35 plus I provided the new set of strings. I agree with what most are saying, I can do the set up, but not nearly as well as the tech I took it to.

Hey brotherdave check out this old youtube clip; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trf4CxKFUBw

The lead guitar player is Greg Jennings. He wrote the song Hummingbird.

Image



Wow, "time marches on" your face.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:35 pm
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I think setup work can be completely different from one brand of bass to another. My theory is the neck should be as straight as possible...and it's a dud if it isn't.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 2:10 pm
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I have never encountered a Fender nut that was improperly cut. I had a Sigma acoustic guitar (DR41) about 30 years ago that needed some nut work which I accomplished myself without incident although I admit I did not touch the slots themselves but only shaved the bottom of the nut because it was too high.

I bought some fret levelling tools from StewMac about 7 or 8 years ago because I had a 2004 maple top Strat (rear load) which had one fret (18th I think) that was slightly higher than the others and it impeded my setup process. I eventually got frustrated enough with it to do something. It was an interesting job. I took it slowly and everything worked out quite well.

I've never really been afraid to wade into unknown waters when it comes to working on music gear. I take an extremely cautious approach. I examine everything carefully, take notes, pictures sometimes and I reason out the logic of a repair attempt before attempting it. When I was a younger man and had a pair of unfortunate results that ended up costing me a small amount of money but I learned from them and they were both on cheaper guitars which is likely why they needed work in the first place.

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Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.


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Post subject: Re: Who does the set up on your bass ?
Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:58 pm
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That's the way I go about it BMW. Slow and carefull. I can take all day to file a fret if I want.

Some jobs are still ones I don't want to mess with- like bone nutz. I've done a nut before and it worked but I had to use 4 or 5 blanks before I got it right. I'm lazy on the nut. I'll let my dude do that for me. He'll set up the bass when he's done installing the nut. . I get it back home and change it to the way I like it - and then it's on. :)


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