It is currently Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:42 pm

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3 posts ] 
Author Message
Post subject: I'm new here, quick question...
Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 5:31 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2012 5:17 pm
Posts: 2
Hi All,

I Vince, from Montreal, Canada! I'm new here as I just picked up a "perfectly new" used black P-bass American deluxe 2011. It's an amazing bass! What a tone! I alsoplay a Musicman Sterling 4H and I just needed this P-bass tone, so I got this deal!

But there is 2 things about the P-Bass that you might be able to help me!

First, I noticed a BIG difference on the output power of the bass. The musicman (bass, mid and trebble at 0, so bass is flat) is much more powerfull on the output than the P-Bass.. Even with active mode, all pots to the top, I have to crank up my preamp to get the same input volume in amp.... Is this normal? Anyone experienced this?

Secondly, I did notices that I have to boost up the High in order to get some clarity in the sound, and it comes with a "shhhhhhh" in the background. I'm really used to my Musicman Sterling with it's own bright sound without any background noise.

So, is this normal as a like-new P-bass? Or should I go have it checked? I did replace strings et batteries.

My actual setup is a SansAmp RBI preamp and a Markbass CMD210.

Thanks for yout help!
Vince


Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject: Re: I'm new here, quick question...
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 6:47 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:12 pm
Posts: 6355
Location: Albemarle, NC
Welcome to the Fender Forum Vince. We are primarily Fender users here except for the moderator and an occasional post by someone on the FMIC payroll. Now a not so quick answer to a quick question. Never was good at quick answers.

The tonal difference is probably normal. No Alnico P-Bass pickup is going to be as airy as the ceramic pickup MM especially when the MM is switched into single coil mode. The J-Pickup on this Fender is the DUAL COIL version which means it won't hum like a single coil but also doesn't have the more ample upper mids of a single coil jazz either, and on top of that the J is loaded down some by having the P-Pickup in the circuit even when the J pickup is soloed. Boosting the highs to make it sound as bright as a cranked treble MM or even an active single coil Jazz is probably going to generate some preamp hiss because you are trying to boost tones that are barely there in the first place. This hiss really isn't that noticeable unless you have a tweeter/horn in the cab which of course most gigable MarkBass combos do except for the Jeff Berlin model.

I've never compared the actual output volume of a 2011 American P-Bass Deluxe versus a MM but the MM has a higher output ceramic pickup so it would be logical to expect it to have a louder output after the active EQ. Still they should be fairly close. The ACTIVE part is the EQ, not the pickups. So what you get in active mode is primarily increased tonal control instead of just the treble roll off of a passive mode instrument. It will boost highs of course, but it is primarily good for boosting what is there in the first place. The inherent tonal quality when in passive mode is also what the preamp has to work with in active mode. When you try to boost things that are very faint or barely there in the passive tone, such as upper mids and highs, the result is the preamp hiss.

I think some members here have both a P and a MM but don't know if any have the exact same models to compare the output. I would think they should be in the same ballpark but I'm not surprised the MM is a tad louder due the hotter ceramic pickup output. I prefer the warmer Alnico tones myself, but if what you want is treble heavy clank the MM will do that better.

The tonal difference between the two is why they make different basses. Each has advantages and strong points. When setup to full potential the Fender should sound much fuller and richer in mids and lows with nearly perfect string to string balance. The properly setup MM should shine on brighter tones. The most common problem with MM instruments is usually string to string balance where either the D or G might not be as loud as the E & A no matter what I do. Usually it is the G but not always. Some people don't play the G string much so they don't really notice it, or use lots of compression to compensate.

So basically it is like comparing a Shelby Cobra to a Corvette in that they both are great but each has strong points where it trumps the other. In this case the Fender Deluxe will do traditional "old school" tones far better where the MM will do what I call an upper midrange heavy modern tone better. The right tool for the job is one way to look at it. Figure out which one suits the tonal requirement and grab it.

I'd consider compensating with the output volume control on the MM to balance the two output levels. As a tip I offer that I rarely turn the output volume or tone controls wide open on any active EQ instrument as I think active EQ instruments sound far more natural when the tones and master volume are rolled back from full on anyway.

Sure there are times when I'll crank the tones or master volume, but as a rule I keep the tone controls about center position and the volume from 70 to 90%. If you start out with everything cranked, you have just left yourself with nowhere to go but down. I use compression so all that really changes is not so much the volume but rather the density and sustain anyway.

Two compressor pedals I use and can recommend are the MarkBass Compressore which uses tube based compression and the Aphex Punch Factory which uses optical compression. Both are natural sounding but I think the Aphex offers more compression control and is simpler to setup. Either would be of benefit in your rig to balance the two instruments. They cost about the same. The MarkBass had a clear build quality advantage until a recent total redesign of the Aphex unit's assembly addressed every single build criticism I had of the original Punch Factory design while keeping everything I liked about it in performance. The only thing I don't like about the new Aphex design is one additional control knob was added that I think was probably unnecessary as it worked great with just two knobs and part of the beauty of the original Punch Factory was the amazing ease of setup to get it perfect. The Aphex is still easier to setup but there are now 3 knobs instead of just two. The MarkBass is far more involved to setup with 6 knobs. I'm using the MarkBass more lately but just know up front that it has a steeper learning curve.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: I'm new here, quick question...
Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 7:19 am
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2012 5:17 pm
Posts: 2
Wow, Thanks Brotherdave! The a "quick" answer for a quick question!! Lol!

Actually, I did buy a P-Bass to get that rich sound that I don't get with the MM. Well, I got something really good with the SansAmp RBI and MM, but still no good bass growling! But wow, with that P-Bass, it's just amazing! I can tell you, my MM will waste some time on my stand for the next few gigs!

As you said, the MM ceramic pickup has more output power. I did a quick mesurement with my console... both basses are flat EQ, full volume, active. And the input power in console had a good 10db difference! That's huge. So I found a good setup to balance my 2 basses, I put a footswitch on my Sansamp RBI Preamp to get it ON/OFF, and I turn down the MM input with it. So it's pretty flat, expect that now, when I switch back to the MM, euhhhhh, it misses a LOT of growling and rich lows.

Well, I'm really happy to be part of the Fender family! For the past few years, I was always looking at some Fender (Jazz and P-bass) but I didn't fell in love with one. My MM Sterling has a really quick and smalll neck, with a super low action, and it's sooo easy to play! But I did try a american Pbas deluxe in my local dealer, and I just fall in live with it! So I did look in the used adds, and found a nice "like new" p-bass... I couldn't resist!

I didn't have much time to play with my P-bass.. So I need to get around all controls and learn how to get some tones that I want. So far, I really like the Middle setup, in active mode. So it's a blend of the 2 pickups 50-50, bass flat (50%), mids and Highs a little boosted (60%). I get the good deep and rich bass, but I get also some good clear sound of the strings.

And, y the way, when you talk about the D and G strings, the P-Bass make a huge difference! When I play my MM, I barely hear my D and G strings when playing with my full band. Even on recordings! But now, with the Pbass, those D and G just cut in the mix!

The only downside I can tell so far (compare to my MM sterling) is that the neck is a little harder to play, action is a little higher. And my right tumb doesn't like to reste on that P pickup.... It's too sharp, and after 2-3 hours of playing, in getting painfull.

But for the rest, I'm more than happy with it! Really good sounding!

I'll probably give a try to some compressor one day.. I'm curious!

So thanks again for your good answer!
Vince


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: