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Post subject: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:06 pm
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Hey Gang,

Question for you all... I've got a new MIM Standard P-Bass in the new Copperburst paint scheme, which I really like.

I'm primarily a Telecaster player, but thanks to brotherdave's influence, I've picked up the bass as well. (Thanks brotherdave!)

Anyway, I have a "thing" for the ashtray bridge cover for my Tele's and most of the time I keep it on when playing. Mostly, I just like the vintage look.

Cruising around eBay last week, I bought the chrome bridge and pickup covers and a thumb rest for my P-Bass. Reason? Again, I just like the vintage look.

So today everything arrived in the mail. I've mocked up everything in place and really like the look, but before I start drilling holes, tell me the reasons I shouldn't add these to my P-Bass.

Thanks!

RickyD

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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:08 pm
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Congrats on your bass, that's a sweet color, which neck? Post some pics.

In my opinion, the only reason you SHOULDN'T add them is, they'll get in your way. I have them on my Precision and my Jazz, in the very near future, I'll have black ones for my Squier VM Jazz.

I Put thumbrests on too just because I like the look. It's a question of personal likes and dislikes.

Tell you what I did. I used velcro to put the covers on for a couple years before I drilled. I really wanted to be sure. The velcro came off easily and it was an alternative to doing something I'd regret later.


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:39 pm
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Another one joins us! Welcome to the Dark Side Ricky D, henceforth known as Darth Bassius!

Seriously though, on a new MIM Standard P-Bass there is no reason NOT to do this mod if you like the covers and thumbrest that I can think of. A MIM Standard Fender ANYTHING will probably never be worth much more than you paid for it in your lifetime because there are simply so many of them around, so a mod that requires drilling isn't such a no-no as it would be on a CBS or Pre-CBS axe. Just make sure you really want to do it

In addition to the freedom of movement Oxfan mentioned. some other disadvantages are that you can not play directly over the pickup or use the pickup as a thumbrest as many players do.

I don't use finger/thumb rests myself. I use the E-string as a thumb rest and only move my thumb off it when I need to play on it, then the thumb goes right back on the E-string. The thumbrest or fingerrest is about useless if you use palm muting or do any slapping.

I adopted the "E-String Rest" method because my first bass had a "TUGBAR" finger rest below the G-String, not a thumbrest above the E-string. And so did my second bass. I think my method makes more sense for me as it is a more compact finger spread. But if you like the thumbrest, or just the look, it is perfectly ok. If we were talking about some vintage instrument or one that might go up in value substantially, then I'd say STOP! But you will actually not be hurting value much if any. It might make it more attractive to others. The covers and rests have been coming back in vogue over the past 7 years. I'm probably not the only "E-String Rest" proponent but I'm the only one that talks about it much on this forum.

Some tips on installation. 1. Put MASKING TAPE in the approximate position where the cover screws are going to be and mark on the tape. Drill through the tape. I've found that the poly paint tends to chip off in chunks around the hole otherwise. The tape will help you get a clean hole with no chips and tape makes a better substance to mark on than your instrument. 2. Drill a tiny pilot hole FIRST, then drill a slightly larger hole as this also helps avoid chipping and gives you a more exact placement. 3. BEFORE DRILLING put the guitar on a stand and make sure it is exactly straight and check that the position of the hole marks will look straight before drilling. Check it again lying down from every possible angle. What looks straight lying on a bench may not be exactly straight when in playing position. You only get one crack at it so make sure it is the perfect placement. 3. The TUGBAR/THUMBREST moved! It was below the G-String as a finger rest "TUGBAR" from 1951 until June 30th, 1973 when it moved July 1, 1973 to above the "E" string and got the name "Thumbrest."

There are advantages to using covers too. The advantage to the bridge cover is that when on a stand people walking by your instrument can not catch their pants leg on the bridge adjusting screws or saddles and pull your instrument over, which is NOT good. Secondarily the bridge cover can be used to conceal muting devices such as foam or felt if you choose to employ muting. The pickup cover helps with shielding and prevents damage to your pickup. You can also ground both the pickup and bridge covers to improve RFI shielding. Besides they just look COOL! They are a personal preference of mine and I consider a pickup cover essential on a first generation P-bass due the fragility of the exposed pickup. If you use the pickup as a thumbrest on the early P-Basses you can pull the top of the flatwork off and the pole pieces fall out which makes the bass completely silent. I've seen this happen a lot with players used to using the pickup as a thumbrest on a post '57 P-Bass and then try playing a pre '57 bass with no pickup cover such as the 51 Reissue P-Bass or the Squier Vintage Vibe 50's P-Bass.


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:44 pm
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brotherdave, if you're able to, give me a call.


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:05 am
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Oxfan I can't right now. I'm out of town and my cell's battery is dead and I forgot my charger. I went to see Chuck Johnson and The Charlyhorse All Star Band tonight at a Club in Charlotte and I'm staying over. I have a gig Saturday night on the other side of the state so I'll be back home early Sunday morning...way early, about 2 or 3. I'll try calling you Sunday afternoon from home. Hey Chuck's band was awesome! Great show! The bassist, Tom Kuhn was playing a Lake Placid Blue USA 62 Jazz Reissue he bought from Skynyrd's bassist. Got me Jonesing for another Jazz, but don't worry I'll be over it by dawn.
Here's a link to Chuck's website: http://www.thecharlyhorse.com/fr_home.cfm


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:19 am
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I'm working the 8 at night t0 8 in the morning thing again. Anytime after 5 P.M. would work, if not, we'll catch up.


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:41 am
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The most common complaint about the Pickup cover is that it takes alot of getting used to for many people but for others its no issue and for myself its not a problem working around it w/it and does'nt take away from any of my playing or cause me to make mistakes.
The bridge cover is really non-detremental to playing styles and in some cases pick-players use it as a place to rest their hand,but can also get in the way when palm-muting near the bridge.
So are they cool looking ? YES,but they sometimes can get in the way, Also Installation can be hard if unsure of proper positioning,and drilling pilot/starter holes incorrectely can chip the finish when tightening down the little starter screws and it can also end up looking cock-eyed if not level.
Most genuine Fender bridge/pickup covers and thumbrests usually come with the templetes,sometimes the cover kit gets tossed into the case mixed in with a bunch of sometimes useful "case candy",and may end-up being found in the little useles compartments built into the hardcover case too small for anything else but useless stuff.
Goodluck

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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:44 am
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brotherdave wrote:
Another one joins us! Welcome to the Dark Side Ricky D, henceforth known as Darth Bassius!

Seriously though, on a new MIM Standard P-Bass there is no reason NOT to do this mod if you like the covers and thumbrest that I can think of. A MIM Standard Fender ANYTHING will probably never be worth much more than you paid for it in your lifetime because there are simply so many of them around, so a mod that requires drilling isn't such a no-no as it would be on a CBS or Pre-CBS axe. Just make sure you really want to do it

In addition to the freedom of movement Oxfan mentioned. some other disadvantages are players do.
that you can not play directly over the pickup or use the pickup as a thumbrest as many
I don't use finger/thumb rests myself. I use the E-string as a thumb rest and only move my thumb off it when I need to play on it, then the thumb goes right back on the E-string. The thumbrest or fingerrest is about useless if you use palm muting or do any slapping.

I adopted the "E-String Rest" method because my first bass had a "TUGBAR" finger rest below the G-String, not a thumbrest above the E-string. And so did my second bass. I think my method makes more sense for me as it is a more compact finger spread. But if you like the thumbrest, or just the look, it is perfectly ok. If we were talking about some vintage instrument or one that might go up in value substantially, then I'd say STOP! But you will actually not be hurting value much if any. It might make it more attractive to others. The covers and rests have been coming back in vogue over the past 7 years. I'm probably not the only "E-String Rest" proponent but I'm the only one that talks about it much on this forum.

Some tips on installation. 1. Put MASKING TAPE in the approximate position where the cover screws are going to be and mark on the tape. Drill through the tape. I've found that the poly paint tends to chip off in chunks around the hole otherwise. The tape will help you get a clean hole with no chips and tape makes a better substance to mark on than your instrument. 2. Drill a tiny pilot hole FIRST, then drill a slightly larger hole as this also helps avoid chipping and gives you a more exact placement. 3. BEFORE DRILLING put the guitar on a stand and make sure it is exactly straight and check that the position of the hole marks will look straight before drilling. Check it again lying down from every possible angle. What looks straight lying on a bench may not be exactly straight when in playing position. You only get one crack at it so make sure it is the perfect placement. 3. The TUGBAR/THUMBREST moved! It was below the G-String as a finger rest "TUGBAR" from 1951 until June 30th, 1973 when it moved July 1, 1973 to above the "E" string and got the name "Thumbrest."

There are advantages to using covers too. The advantage to the bridge cover is that when on a stand people walking by your instrument can not catch their pants leg on the bridge adjusting screws or saddles and pull your instrument over, which is NOT good. Secondarily the bridge cover can be used to conceal muting devices such as foam or felt if you choose to employ muting. The pickup cover helps with shielding and prevents damage to your pickup. You can also ground both the pickup and bridge covers to improve RFI shielding. Besides they just look COOL! They are a personal preference of mine and I consider a pickup cover essential on a first generation P-bass due the fragility of the exposed pickup. If you use the pickup as a thumbrest on the early P-Basses you can pull the top of the flatwork off and the pole pieces fall out which makes the bass completely silent. I've seen this happen a lot with players used to using the pickup as a thumbrest on a post '57 P-Bass and then try playing a pre '57 bass with no pickup cover such as the 51 Reissue P-Bass or the Squier Vintage Vibe 50's P-Bass.

BRILLIANT !! I could'nt have said it better myself,very informative old chap.

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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:54 am
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Not a 'clown', but perhaps this might help... I have posted this info in a couple places here at Fender Lounge in the past year and many other guitar forums over the years, but I'll just repeat it here because this applies to the original question in Post # 1 above...

Quote:

When installing a bridge cover to get that retro look, there is one step that many tech's and do-it-yourself bassists forget. An ungrounded bridge cover in close proximity to a bridge area pickup can cause 'hum' and 'pops' occasionally due to static buildup. There is a very easy fix for this and it also fixes a potential bridge grounding issue at the same time...

Before you even drill the screw holes for the new bridge cover, loosen the strings to take the tension off the bridge and remove the bridge. Set it aside and wrap it in a soft cloth so it doesn't scratch the guitar body. Most basses have a pigtail ground wire resting under the bridge that grounds the bridge to the common ground buss in the control compartment. That wire is subjected to corrosion from perspiration working it's way under the bridge. When the ground wire gets oxidized, it may loose contact with the bridge plate and create a bridge grounding issue and more hum.

The 'fix' is to get a small roll of electronic circuit solder removal braid called "Solder Wick" - Radio Shack stores have this available under their own brand name. It is a flat brass and copper braid that is normally used with a soldering gun to remove circuit solder from circuit boards so individual components can be removed for testing. However, the flat "Solder Wick" braid is an excellent product to update bass bridge and bridge cover grounding.

The guitar ground wire stub should be carefully scraped clean with a pen-knife. Carefully solder a 4 to 5 inch long piece of "Solder Wick" braid to the clean pigtail. Take some 400 grit extra fine sandpaper and remove any surface corrosion on the underside of the bridge plate. As you re-mount the bridge, make sure that the braid extends out to the control side of the bridge by a couple inches past the edge of the bridge plate. Once the bridge screws are secure, re-tension your strings and then position the new bridge cover over the bridge and check for clearances. Carefully mark the hole locations and drill the screw holes with a 5/64 drill bit to a depth of just under 1/2 inch. As you mount the bridge cover, position the braid pigtail coming out from under the edge of the bridge plate and place it under the bridge cover close to the control side bridge cover mounting screw and secure the bridge cover screws. The compression of the screws on the bridge cover grounds it to the braid pigtail and the bridge screw compression over the main part of the braid pigtail gives much more surface area under the bridge to make sure it stays grounded. This procedure can be used to ground pickup covers as well with some pre-planning on braid location.

If you do not use bridge or pickup covers, this extra braid soldered to the guitar ground pigtail wire can still be a preventive maintenance procedure to keep the bridge properly grounded and to reduce hum, pops or static arcing.


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 12:02 am
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That is a very good tip from PaduahLuke. I'm gonna do that as soon as I can on my single coil gigging P-Bass.


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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:41 pm
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oxfan wrote:
Tell you what I did. I used velcro to put the covers on for a couple years before I drilled. I really wanted to be sure. The velcro came off easily and it was an alternative to doing something I'd regret later.

OXFAN: Excellent idea! I’ve toyed with the idea of getting a bass and mod’ing it to be exactly what I [think] I want, but have been VERY reluctant to do anything permanent.

BROTHERDAVE, LAWSUITBASS, and PADUCAHLUKE: thanks also to you for your additional help! I’ve been missing posts here that are focused on being helpful, and having fun without trashing other people, especially newbies.

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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 8:01 am
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oxfan wrote:
Congrats on your bass, that's a sweet color, which neck? Post some pics.

In my opinion, the only reason you SHOULDN'T add them is, they'll get in your way. I have them on my Precision and my Jazz, in the very near future, I'll have black ones for my Squier VM Jazz.

I Put thumbrests on too just because I like the look. It's a question of personal likes and dislikes.

Tell you what I did. I used velcro to put the covers on for a couple years before I drilled. I really wanted to be sure. The velcro came off easily and it was an alternative to doing something I'd regret later.


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ox, this is what i did too, but i was to impatient to wait before i drilled...

to the OP there is no reason you shouldn't drill these on, it doesn't affect playing that much after you learn to go around it.

Image
Image

i added the ashtrays on both guitars, and painted the pick guard on the pbass.

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Post subject: Re: P Bass mods - will you clowns help me out?
Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:58 pm
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josey wales wrote:
oxfan wrote:
Congrats on your bass, that's a sweet color, which neck? Post some pics.

In my opinion, the only reason you SHOULDN'T add them is, they'll get in your way. I have them on my Precision and my Jazz, in the very near future, I'll have black ones for my Squier VM Jazz.

I Put thumbrests on too just because I like the look. It's a question of personal likes and dislikes.

Tell you what I did. I used velcro to put the covers on for a couple years before I drilled. I really wanted to be sure. The velcro came off easily and it was an alternative to doing something I'd regret later.


Image



ox, this is what i did too, but i was to impatient to wait before i drilled...

to the OP there is no reason you shouldn't drill these on, it doesn't affect playing that much after you learn to go around it.

Image
Image

i added the ashtrays on both guitars, and painted the pick guard on the pbass.

That's a "Pretty Blue Bass" you have there....

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