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Post subject: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or serial #
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 8:12 pm
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Hello fellow Fender 4-stringers,

I'd like some opinions about the probable date of this neck, based on only the headstock face and reverse. Reportedly the neck was badly refinished and the heel markings were sanded off.

It's about even money this is genuine vintage, but I don't actually care too much either way. I needed a neck for a "Frankenfender" and this came at the perfect time and price, even if it's not true vintage. (Sure seems like it though).

I am thinking it's got to be before 1975, given the combination of truss-rod, 4-bolt, and decal. But I am not an expert on the finer points.

It's been refinished, re-fretted, and the nut is new.

If you had to date this neck, what would your guess be?
Image

The tuners are original
Image

Thanks for any opinions!

Keep it low,

Tom


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:47 pm
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Looks like 1970-71


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:44 pm
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Late 60's to 1976 for the logo- tuners-early 70's to 77 if they have the circled "R" trademark stamp. Looks like my 74. Your guess of before 75 may be close.

I'd try to match up the fretboard- (the way it curves inward) with other basses--- OR is that just the photo making it looked curved in?


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 1:10 am
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I'm holding my '78 P=Bass in my hand and it has a serial number directly below the Fender logo. So I would agree that no serial number on your headstock would make it pre-1975. I'm holding "The Ultimate Fender Book" in my other hand which has info on every guitar made by Fender. Unfortnately, it doesn't mention anything about bass guitars. So disrespected!!


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:08 am
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After meditating on it - I can only come up with the year span of 70 to 75. I just think that's a fair assumption- without seeing it in person-- One last thing is the thickness of the fretboard.


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:29 am
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Thanks everyone. I appreciate the insights. I will take some better pix and post as a follow-up. I checked out "The Fender Book" (Bacon/Day) and "50 Years of Fender" (Bacon). Everything in these books puts the neck in the 70-75 range based on available evidence. As noted above, I might be able to narrow based on the appearance of the rosewood fingerboard. More to follow.

OT: after really perusing those two books, I have come to the following 2 conclusions:
1) Throughout its history, Fender has made some incredibly beautiful instruments
2) Throughout its history, Fender has made some incredibly ugly instruments

Love 'em all though


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:14 pm
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Here are some better (I hope) pictures:
Headstock face:
http://tomhuguelet.com/wp-content/uploa ... C00421.jpg

Headstock reverse, including tuners. (no circled "R" trademark stamp, wonder what that means )
http://tomhuguelet.com/wp-content/uploa ... C00451.jpg

Rosewood veneer profile at nut:
http://tomhuguelet.com/wp-content/uploa ... C00461.jpg

Rosewood veneer at the 20th fret
http://tomhuguelet.com/wp-content/uploa ... C00471.jpg

(I purposely did not embed these because I left them at high resolution and they come out too huge with this forum software. I don't think there's a way to resize using BBCodes, true?)

I was researching this and it looks identical to this ebay listing, which is from 1972. Except for two details:
1) The inlay dots on my neck are darker, more transparent, and more mother-of-pearl looking
2) The side dots on my bass do not touch the rosewood - there's about 1/16" of Maple visible between the dot and the rosewood


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:14 am
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I'm changing my opinion on the neck and I'm dating it to more like maybe a 68 or 69,70,71. The 74 or 5 should have the "R" trademark stamp on the tuners next to the stamped in Fender logo

After looking and reading the Hal Leonard (publisher) The Fender Bass "an illustrated history" by JW Black and Albert Molinaro . Check out in the back of the book "The Sum of it's Parts" pp94-105

Another thing I notice even though it is a minute thing is the "F" in( the decal )Fender is really close to the edge of the heastock. That caught my eye.

It's hard to date "parts" of a Fender bass with so little to go on. I could still be wrong and it could be a 72 . When they are vague in the Fender book that kind of tells me they have to be vague because noone can pin it down anyway.

Who is the real expert on dating all things Fender Bass???


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:35 pm
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The problem with trying to date this neck is that there are no date stamps and the neck was supposedly refinished, correct?

You are all correct with your date approximations and I think that is as close as you will get unless you can uncover some more information from a previous owner.

So it's appearing to be a '69 to '75 neck with original tuners.

The problem is that it was refinished.

Someone could have taken a later neck and refinished it with a 70's logo and installed a set of early 70s tuners.
The LOGO decal location( the Fender so close to the edge of the neck, looks suspicious.

It comes down to the question of : Do you like the neck? Is it functioning correctly and is
it going to be a good neck on the right body?

I am sure that its a great neck if it is not exhibiting any warping problems.

BTW - The veneer fingerboard started out as a slab board but it was milled to that thickness. This was a change that Leo made to the necks to make them stronger after seeing a lot of the original slab-board necks warp.

Good luck with your bass.

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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:57 pm
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I agree with your assessments.

After examining the neck VERY closely, I doubt that the headstock face has been refinished. If so, it would be one to those NCIS/art-forgery level jobs.

It has been refinished (except the headstock face) -- and the seller was never coy about this. And I purchased it based on the fact that I didn't actually want a "new" neck. This was priced very favorably - roughly on par with a good quality USA-made after-market neck.

I haven't mounted it on a body yet, but every indication is its the best precision neck I've ever touched. Even if it's not genuine vintage (I think it is though), it's a great neck for my purposes. (You guys are going to kick me out of this forum when I say this, but I am seriously considering mounting this on a Jazz body. :shock: )


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 3:37 pm
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Oh-- a Jazz with a P bass neck. Well... I can only think of the..... wait, ..I don't think I have experianced such sacriledge...... you must now take up your things and leave...


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 3:47 pm
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I know, I know.

Here's my thinking. 1) I have big hands. Tried the Jazz necks and they were a bit dainty for me. 2) The sound in my head is in the JPJ/Noel Redding neighborhood. 3) The bass I play most frequently (so far) is a dual single pickup active bass, so the Jazz config keeps me in a comfortable sonic area.

On the other hand, I've been listening to a lot of really good Precision bass lines recently. I could probably be talked out of it...

(really mostly depends on finding a good body to marry this neck with)


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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:01 am
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BTW- I like the look of your neck as opposed to the ebay listed neck.
If your neck has been refinished on the back, with lacquer, it is probably more comfortable to play than the stock polyurethane finish that comes on these necks.
Remember that thae headstock face on these necks is always done in lacquer in order to melt in the decal. That means that usually the headstock face yellows more with age than the rest of the neck. The ebay neck appears to be uniformly yellowed on the back and face of the neck. This looks unusual to me.

Anyway:
Putting a Precision neck on a Jazz bass is very cool in my opinion.

Often times you will find that a neck swap like that is a great idea. You can often get a better balanced and better sounding bass.

I did this in the 70s with my 1971 Jazz Bass. I actually bought a new P-bass neck with tuners to use on it before going on tour.

I worked out very well. I have since put my 71 Jazz bass back to stock specs and I used the Precision neck on another Precision body.

That looks like a great neck. Have fun with it.

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Post subject: Re: Help me date a Precision neck without date code or seria
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:53 pm
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Just got my recently-ordered copy of "The Fender Bass: An Illustrated History" Based on what's in there, I have to agree with Stroker Vance's assessment of 69-70.

Here's my reasoning:

    TV decal "i.e. Fender in large black letters", (which this neck has) didn't happen until 1969
    Schallers (which this neck does not have) were used on necks in 1976 & 1977
    Serial # (which this neck does not have) started appearing in 1976
    Walnut plug (which this neck does not have) for truss rod were used starting in 1972
    Cloverleaf gears (which this neck has) with stamped Fender started in mid-sixties
    The circled "R" (which this neck does not have) was added to the stamped Fender in the early 70's

So based solely on the physical attributes of the neck, it has to be between 1969 and 1972.

I can't wait to get this neck set in a body! :D Wouldn't you know it - it seems like all the many eBay auctions that had decent semi-vintage bodies have all dried up now that I have this neck. :( I don't really want to drop it into a new body, but I am coming up snake eyes on finding a good used body. Anyone familiar with sourcing just a body from the early 70's anywhere besides eBay? I am not worried about a pure vintage pedigree (in fact I'd prefer not to pay vintage prices, so refins or moderate mods would be fine...)

Thanks for all the tips so far!


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