It is currently Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:09 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
Post subject: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmaster
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:27 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:15 pm
Posts: 3
I have a Fender Thin Skin Jaguar and while I absolutely love the guitar, I find the universal issues with the bridge, vibrato unit, and neck pocket angle very annoying to deal with. Everyone who has owned a Jaguar or Jazzmaster has experienced these exact same problems.

The bridge buzzes, strings slip in the saddles, the low E string buzzes and breaks often because it sits on top of a screw on the vibrato unit etc etc. You practically have to join a cult to understand the intricacies of the vibrato unit and set it up properly. Then you need to buy obscenely expensive aftermarket parts and you still end up having to modify and shim your guitar anyway.

It's been nearly 60 years since they introduced the Jazzmaster vibrato yet they have not addressed the basic flaws with the system. Why can't Fender re-engineer their parts and solve these issues? Make a Fender style bridge that works with different radii and string sets, cut a 1 deg angle in the neck pocket, fix the sloppy tremolo arm, and modify the vibrato plate and or flatten the screws so they don't contact the E string. These are relatively easy fixes that should be implemented on all offset guitars including the 1965 AV series.

Legions of offset guitar fans would be very happy if Fender simple made parts available for a reasonable cost. Give us a drop in bridge that works, a vibrato unit with flat screws and an arm that doesn't flop around.

While you're at it put together a Johnny Marr Jaguar control plate switch kit. Fender makes this for the JM Jaguar but you can not buy this part from them or any major aftermarket retailer.


Please, Fender I want to give you my money.

agree or disagree?


Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:44 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:48 am
Posts: 26416
Location: Tombstone Territory
Fender is too busy choosing new designer colors for its upcoming line of amplifiers intended for those fashionista's who happen to play guitar. You can't expect a vast multi-national conglomerate to actually fix something wrong with one of their products.

:mrgreen:

Arjay

_________________
"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:19 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:45 pm
Posts: 2770
Location: Kansas
Well you could also conduct a séance and tell Leo Fender what he did wrong when designing these. :mrgreen:

If you look at the more modernized offset-bodied guitars they have at least replaced the bridge with a tune-o-matic type bridge - but if any of those models have a trem they still have the old trem unit with the known problems.

But you're also talking about a niche guitar that Fender killed off in the 1970s. Since Fender doesn't sell a boatload of these (in comparison to Strats and Teles) there isn't a huge incentive to create an "American Standard Jazzmaster" or "American Standard Jaguar" model. If demand gets to that point then they might just decide to create that kind of model and redesign the bridge/trem units.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:06 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:48 am
Posts: 26416
Location: Tombstone Territory
John C wrote:
Well you could also conduct a séance and tell Leo Fender what he did wrong when designing these. :mrgreen:

If you look at the more modernized offset-bodied guitars they have at least replaced the bridge with a tune-o-matic type bridge - but if any of those models have a trem they still have the old trem unit with the known problems.

But you're also talking about a niche guitar that Fender killed off in the 1970s. Since Fender doesn't sell a boatload of these (in comparison to Strats and Teles) there isn't a huge incentive to create an "American Standard Jazzmaster" or "American Standard Jaguar" model. If demand gets to that point then they might just decide to create that kind of model and redesign the bridge/trem units.


+1, John

Fender sorta did that with the CP Jazzmaster edition, insofar as correcting the break angle going over the bridge saddles. I suspect it wouldn't take a lot of engineering man-hours to re-design the tailpiece so it actually functioned in a usable fashion yet retained its visual vintage vibe. Then if they'd only add a few more available colors (Ocean Turquoise Metallic anyone?) and assemble it in Corona I believe they'd have a winner.

(wistful sign......)

Arjay

_________________
"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:29 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:15 pm
Posts: 3
John C wrote:
Well you could also conduct a séance and tell Leo Fender what he did wrong when designing these. :mrgreen:

If you look at the more modernized offset-bodied guitars they have at least replaced the bridge with a tune-o-matic type bridge - but if any of those models have a trem they still have the old trem unit with the known problems.

But you're also talking about a niche guitar that Fender killed off in the 1970s. Since Fender doesn't sell a boatload of these (in comparison to Strats and Teles) there isn't a huge incentive to create an "American Standard Jazzmaster" or "American Standard Jaguar" model. If demand gets to that point then they might just decide to create that kind of model and redesign the bridge/trem units.


This isn't the 70's. Take a look at almost any band that fits a younger demographic. More of them are playing Jaguars and Jazzmasters than Strats and Tele's. Fender knows this and they have slowly been pumping out more and more Jaguar and Jazzmaster models. In 1999 they had 2 guitars in this series. Today there are almost 30 models for sale. Let's not forget that the Stratocaster was a "niche" guitar in the 60's. It was far outsold by the Jaguar in that era. These things are cyclical.

Right now the Jaguar is popular, but IMO Fender is missing the mark. The way that Fender tries to fix the vibrato issue just creates more problems and sort of cheapens the instrument. Fender actually did create a psuedo American Standard model - the 50th anniversary Jaguar. Unfortunately it didnt sit well with the purists so it sold slowly. Fender needs to understand their market better. People do not want a Jaguar with the vibrato plate re-positioned or a tune-o-matic. What they want is a drop in replacement bridge and vibrato unit that is easily available and doesn't cost 3 to 4 times as much as the original parts.

and while we're at it stop making so many Candy Apple Red and Sunburst guitars. The only reason why these guitars sell more is because it's impossible to find any other colour at the retail level.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:44 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Tue May 15, 2012 2:49 am
Posts: 560
Location: Perth, Australia
I do agree that the fundamentals of a guitar should be in working order without requiring modification. I think most of the Jazzmaster issues are resolved by setting a high action, which was probably the norm back in the beginning days of electric guitar. It is us modern players that want low action that have introduced the neck angle, bridge slip and screw interference dilemma found on the Jazzmaster.

_________________
GUITAR: Fender USA JazzMaster.
BASS: Fender USA 58'AVRI
AMP: Fender USA SuperSonicTwin - Blonde.
Image


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:23 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:45 pm
Posts: 2770
Location: Kansas
arkivel wrote:
This isn't the 70's. Take a look at almost any band that fits a younger demographic. More of them are playing Jaguars and Jazzmasters than Strats and Tele's. Fender knows this and they have slowly been pumping out more and more Jaguar and Jazzmaster models. In 1999 they had 2 guitars in this series. Today there are almost 30 models for sale. Let's not forget that the Stratocaster was a "niche" guitar in the 60's. It was far outsold by the Jaguar in that era. These things are cyclical.

Right now the Jaguar is popular, but IMO Fender is missing the mark. The way that Fender tries to fix the vibrato issue just creates more problems and sort of cheapens the instrument. Fender actually did create a psuedo American Standard model - the 50th anniversary Jaguar. Unfortunately it didnt sit well with the purists so it sold slowly. Fender needs to understand their market better. People do not want a Jaguar with the vibrato plate re-positioned or a tune-o-matic. What they want is a drop in replacement bridge and vibrato unit that is easily available and doesn't cost 3 to 4 times as much as the original parts.

and while we're at it stop making so many Candy Apple Red and Sunburst guitars. The only reason why these guitars sell more is because it's impossible to find any other colour at the retail level.


I believe that is why most of the offsets are the lower-cost models like Classic Players, American Specials, etc. - it's easier to put them in the hands of the even younger players influenced by the current crop of younger artists. That being said if the trend continues then maybe there will be a enough interest at Fender in actually developing a true modernized Jazzmaster & Jaguar. This will be at least the 3rd time the offsets have gotten "hot"; the other two times (late 70s new wave, early 90s grunge) they cooled off after only a few years. If this time it is a long-term (i.e. more than 5-year) trend then we will probably see some movement in this direction.

There are quite a few builders out there doing the offset body with other hardware - there are a bunch of "Jazzmasters" with tune-o-matics and soapbars, and a few "Jazzcasters" with Tele hardware. Even Tom Anderson is doing an offset body these days - with a Strat trem and any pickup combo you like. To a certain extent Fender is following these companies leads and not doing a "true to the original concept" update of these models (and most people aren't touching the idea of an updated Jaguar with the 24" scale).

Now as for the colors - I think they will always keep the sunburst, but CAR has pretty much run its course; it's time for some new colors.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:34 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:14 am
Posts: 16
Your post gave me a warm and fuzzy feeling, due to the fact that I just picked up an American Special Jazzmaster... yup, with Tune O Matic bridge and Stopbar tailpiece. No problems, action is low, no buzzing, just plays great. I had heard some bad things about the Vibrato bridge on the "regular" jazzmaster so I was able to avoid all of those issues.

If I really need to bend some notes, I can just grab my Strat.

Did I say Tune O Matic? Of course I meant Adjusto-Matic! This is a Fender, not a Gi-*&^#*$&^*$&^*@#@)(**


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:00 am
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 4:31 am
Posts: 14047
Location: Province de Québec, Canada
Ken Shapiro wrote:
Your post gave me a warm and fuzzy feeling, due to the fact that I just picked up an American Special Jazzmaster... yup, with Tune O Matic bridge and Stopbar tailpiece. No problems, action is low, no buzzing, just plays great. I had heard some bad things about the Vibrato bridge on the "regular" jazzmaster so I was able to avoid all of those issues.

If I really need to bend some notes, I can just grab my Strat.

Did I say Tune O Matic? Of course I meant Adjusto-Matic! This is a Fender, not a Gi-*&^#*$&^*$&^*@#@)(**


Good guitar but it is not the real and original Jazzmaster with Tremolo !

But do we need tremolo ???


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 8:01 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:48 am
Posts: 26416
Location: Tombstone Territory
stratele52 wrote:
But do we need tremolo ???


For Ventures music and other surfy vibes, probably yes.

Other genres, perhaps not.

Arjay

_________________
"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:02 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:39 pm
Posts: 3399
Location: teh webz?
I love my 50th, but the trem reposition is absolutely goddamn infuriating. I can't install a buzzstop, and it does nothing to solve the issue that causes the E to buzz. I'm about to flatten the friggin screw myself.

Also, even now, with these guitars more popular than ever, it's nearly inpossible to find someone who knows how to set up the floating trem properly.

_________________
Favorite bands:

Melvins
The Jesus Lizard
Cows
Big Business
R***man
Minutemen
Flight
Minor Threat
Big Black
Shellac
Karp
Scratch Acid
Wipers
Pixies


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:44 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2012 12:45 pm
Posts: 28
cause believe it or not, the 'bad' stuff is what made the guitars sound the way they did... purists won't even use the Buzz Stop unit on jags or JMs, because it changes the fundamental dynamics of the harmonics created by the length of string between the bridge and tailpiece. sometimes you just gotta take the bad with the good, fix what you can and work around what you can't.

_________________
--guitars
2003 Fender Cyclone II
2011 Fender Jaguar Special
2011 Fender Mustang Special
2002 Squier 20th Anni Bullet, single humbucker, rebuilt from ground up
1999 Schecter CB-2000 http://www1.gitarrebass.de/magazine/0003/schecter.jpg


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:05 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star

Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:53 am
Posts: 4240
I agree the basic design has some flaws.
Still, the old school way (instead of replacing/upgrading the bridge) is
to shim the neck and
file (modernized: Dremel) string grooves to the bridge saddles.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Jazzmaster- tremolo bar falling out
Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:48 am
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:43 am
Posts: 1
I own a Japanese JM, retrofitted with a Masterbridge, which works great. The tremolo assembly is still Fender stock.
Can anyone tell me how to prevent my original Fender unthreaded whammy bar from falling out? I would rather not have to buy a supply of them or wrap them with tape!


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Why doesnt Fender fix universal issues with the Jazzmast
Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:59 pm
Offline
Amateur
Amateur

Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 6:44 am
Posts: 198
There's no question the original design of the Jazzmaster bridge is very weak and it's kind of like they're stuck with it now after all these years of history. In all fairness to Fender, they do offer other models for the Jazzmaster that feature hardtail bridges without tremolo and if you're not a purist this is a great option. I always wanted a Jazzmaster with a hardtail bridge without a tremolo bar and with a modern radius with a maple fretboard and simple controls...then Squier came out with the Jazzmaster special...perfect for a player like me. See the YouTube video of Steve Miller at NAMM playing an expensive American Jazzmaster and the strings keep popping out on him and he doesn't even use the trem bar once.. how embarrassing. He would have been better off with the Squier VM Jazz special model that would have suited him much better without the embarrassment of strings popping out.

If you can get past being a purist and accept that the guitar might be made in China or somewhere else other than the U.S., you could find yourself with a very nice playable Jazzmaster.

_________________
musicmatty67 on Youtube


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: