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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 5:13 am
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Thermodyn wrote:
I played a Tele for two decades. I've got a -45dB notch in my in my right ear at 4k to prove it. :cry: In 2005 I switched to a Jaguar Special HH precisely because of the scale length (small hands). I'm a slow learner I guess.

This is completely unscientific, but I agree that the initial cost was the main reason and the complex switching a close second. I really miss my simple three-way selector. I suppose I could get a Blacktop, but the MIM thing bugs me. For me, MIJ is where it's at. YMMV.

I think I might like to try a Pawn Shop Special Mustang though. I dig the three-way switch on those.


I have a MIM Strat and Jazzmaster CP and I couldn't be happier! Fit and finish is superb, they set up nicely and feel good in my hands. Yeah, switching on the CP is a LITTLE confusing until you figure it out, and it could have been much simpler, but it's good. I had a Black Top Jazzmaster for about two days and brought back to go for the Classic Player. Glad I did.

Don't like switching? The Pawnshop Mustang is NOTHING but switching--15 different positions, combinations of coil taps and full humbucker modes combined with the three we. I messed with one at a Guitar Center and it was like a Swiss Army knife with all the choices! It was definitely fun! And if you like short formats, it's perfect for you!

Short, long format. Who Cares? as long as the format is right for YOU!


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 10:36 pm
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If Fender offered the Classic Player Jazzmaster in this color I'd be down at the store right fooking now writing a check for one instead of typing on this damn computer!

Image

:wink:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:20 pm
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Yanktar wrote:
Thermodyn wrote:
I played a Tele for two decades. I've got a -45dB notch in my in my right ear at 4k to prove it. :cry: In 2005 I switched to a Jaguar Special HH precisely because of the scale length (small hands). I'm a slow learner I guess.

This is completely unscientific, but I agree that the initial cost was the main reason and the complex switching a close second. I really miss my simple three-way selector. I suppose I could get a Blacktop, but the MIM thing bugs me. For me, MIJ is where it's at. YMMV.

I think I might like to try a Pawn Shop Special Mustang though. I dig the three-way switch on those.


I have a MIM Strat and Jazzmaster CP and I couldn't be happier! Fit and finish is superb, they set up nicely and feel good in my hands. Yeah, switching on the CP is a LITTLE confusing until you figure it out, and it could have been much simpler, but it's good. I had a Black Top Jazzmaster for about two days and brought back to go for the Classic Player. Glad I did.

Don't like switching? The Pawnshop Mustang is NOTHING but switching--15 different positions, combinations of coil taps and full humbucker modes combined with the three we. I messed with one at a Guitar Center and it was like a Swiss Army knife with all the choices! It was definitely fun! And if you like short formats, it's perfect for you!

Short, long format. Who Cares? as long as the format is right for YOU!


Well, all the switching on the P.S. Mustang certainly gives me pause. I have more than enough available tones with my standard Mustang. I don't need more choices. I just want Tele simplicity with a fixed bridge and short scale neck, but don't want to carve up my guitars trying to add three-way selectors.

At one time I had considered adding a three-way Tele selector to my Jag. I thought perhaps I could replace the lead circuit switches with a tele three-way selector, thus avoiding any body routing. That way I could always undo it and return it to original if I wanted to sell. But that seems like more trouble than just putting forth the effort to retrain my motor muscle memory to the new operative controls. I'm sure I'll eventually get used to the Jag's switching, in another decade or so. :lol:

Anyway, I'm glad you are pleased with your MIM's. It's been a while since I have examined one. Perhaps it's time to give them another look. Although I've been reading a lot of bad reviews regarding the bridges on the Blacktop Jags.

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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:35 pm
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Thermodyn wrote:
Although I've been reading a lot of bad reviews regarding the bridges on the Blacktop Jags.


Can't argue with this. I spent a couple of hours messing with one, because the B string intonation adjustment screw, when the saddle was getting close the to bridge, would start pressing on the string!. I eventually got it working OK, but I'm not impressed with it and much prefer the bridge on the Classic Player.


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 7:26 pm
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Floyd_The_Barber wrote:
I don't like Jags and Mustangs because they're "odd Fenders".... I just think Strats are ugly as hell.... >_>

strats are ugly as hell. dont particually like the tone either

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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 7:34 pm
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radio_friendly_unit_shifter wrote:
Floyd_The_Barber wrote:
I don't like Jags and Mustangs because they're "odd Fenders".... I just think Strats are ugly as hell.... >_>

strats are ugly as hell. dont particually like the tone either


Same... hell if anything it's that Strats are overused and generic, not that Jags and Mustangs are "odd". There's only so many tonal options one guitar can offer.....

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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:35 pm
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Boy what a fine mess I find here. In order for a guitar model to "catch on", it has to have a popular artist who sends people flocking to buy it. The Jazzmaster and Jaguar never really had that. They were popular during the surf/instrumental period, but that period was very short - killed by the Beatles and the British invasion. They are not high sustain guitars, and so did not suit the music that followed. They were also the two most expensive Fenders in the line.

For the style of tremolo effects popularized during the surf/instrumental period, the tremolo on the Jazzmaster and Jaguar puts the strat's tremolo to shame. The issues with the bridge are overexaggerated. Once you understand how it works, its essentially a non-issue. None of the aftermarket doo-dads and design mods that are commonly made to these guitars are really necessary. The original bridge and the ones found on the AVRI models work fine. These are great guitars, but they are also niche guitars. Great for surf, great for jazz too. The use of these guitars by alternative bands is IMO just a visual gimmick. The current offering of Jazzmasters and Jaguars (excluding the reissues) is a way of selling this guitar body shape to those only interested in how it looks.

I'm a big fan of the Jazzmaster in its original form, and I wouldn't mind having a Jaguar either. It will never be my main guitar but it is a guitar that I really appreciate for what it is (and what it was). Play these guitars on their own terms and you will find a lot of nice surprises.


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:35 am
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I don't agree. A friend who's been playing 30 years never played a Jazzmaster or a Jag, and the other day picked up my new JM CP and tried it. He said it surprised him: He really liked the balance and the way it felt--and he's been mainly a Strat player, with the occasional Tele or Gibson.

It's not just the sound and the shape. It's how it feels when you are playing it.


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 1:13 pm
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Yanktar wrote:
I don't agree. A friend who's been playing 30 years never played a Jazzmaster or a Jag, and the other day picked up my new JM CP and tried it. He said it surprised him: He really liked the balance and the way it felt--and he's been mainly a Strat player, with the occasional Tele or Gibson.

It's not just the sound and the shape. It's how it feels when you are playing it.


I've never understood that... people who buy a s***load of Strats and barely have any other guitars in the herd.... I mean I understand there's a TONE of Strat models so there's definitely variety, but how can one not get bored of the look? Or the neck? And so on....

Hell as much as I love the Pawnshop Mustang, I wouldn't buy it because I already have a Mustang..... No, next on the list is an aluminum beast 8)

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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:55 pm
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Guess I'm a little late for this post.

Meet Candy :)

Image


And her Custom Shop sister Lizzy:
Image



Who says they never caught on? I agree that the original bridge was a radical and poor design. Leo was known for over design and tweaking. Trem system is so, so. Lots of sonic variation. The original '62 pups were hotter than the Strat and Tele as well. 24 inch scale? I move between Jag, Tele, 6-string acoustic and 12-string all the time and it really doesn't affect me.

I think the two (or three) things that hurt the Jag and Jazz were the price (they were the top of the line models) and the 1meg ohm volume and tone pots. (Strat and Tele use 250K ohm in most cases.)

I have never tried it but there are those who swap the pots out for 500K ohm and swear by it. But then, it wouldn't be a Jaguar. Plug one of these babies in a Twin Reverb or Showman, and it becomes a moot point 8) :lol:

JMO


Art

P,S. @Arjay, yeah, if that color was available, I would be buying another Classic Player Jag and a CP Jazzy.


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:32 am
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I've had a 1971 Jazzmaster since 1988-It's a bit temperamental, but is a great utility git-Really good for slide and open tunings, and, yes, for jazz. I use it when I play solo/duo gigs and want to go electric. Also, the trem works very well when set up properly, and mine sustains pretty well, though it's got lots of hum and howl in the pickups. Never liked Jags, even with the 24 3/4 neck, even though I prefer Gibson dimensions and, sorry to say, guitars.


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:07 am
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Floyd_The_Barber wrote:
I've never understood that... people who buy a s***load of Strats and barely have any other guitars in the herd.... I mean I understand there's a TONE of Strat models so there's definitely variety, but how can one not get bored of the look? Or the neck? And so on....

Hell as much as I love the Pawnshop Mustang, I wouldn't buy it because I already have a Mustang..... No, next on the list is an aluminum beast 8)


He's actually owned, bought and sold all kinds of guitars, including clone strats like a Kawai (still has that one), Les Pauls, SGs, flying V's (I can't even stand to look at those), other brands, as well as Teles and Strats. Some of it's more collecting and collectible value and he KNOWS Strats.

I hadn't realized he hadn't even HELD a Jazzmaster (or Jag).

Some people swear by Fords, others say "Fix Or Repair Daily". Some people swear by Chevies...when they recommend restaurants I don't go there! :mrgreen:


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2011 1:47 pm
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In my opinion that classic vintage Jaguar tone is the quintessential Fender sound. I own a bunch of different Fenders, Gretsches and Rickenbackers and my '63 Jag has the coolest tone of them all! It sounds exactly like the intro to "Fun, Fun, Fun" and the solo on "I Get Around." For some people Fender = Hendrix and Clapton, for others classic country and western swing, but for me, Fender = Southern California, beaches, babes and surf music. :D

I mean, my CS 52 Tele sounds killer with a Hot Broadcaster and a Twisted Tele (the ultimate twang-machine) but you hear this sound everywhere. The same goes for the ultimate vintage Strat tone. The Jaguar tone, while similar, is definitely unique and you certainly don't hear it every day. I can understand why the Jaguar never really caught on. Its range is very narrow and it is nowhere near as versatiles as a Strat or a Tele, but therein lies the charm.


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2011 4:28 pm
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audiodrome wrote:
Fender = Southern California, beaches, babes and surf music. :D

but therein lies the charm.


+1

8)

Art


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Post subject: Re: Why didn't Jaguar's catch on?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:00 pm
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I imagine that Jaguars were also big on the punk scene. My '63 can certainly attest to that! I just wish I knew who owned it before me because I would love to know what the hell he used it for, besides playing. I mean, I couldn't get dings like that if I tried!

Image


Last edited by audiodrome on Tue Aug 23, 2011 5:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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