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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 5:47 pm
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BAH! This is quickly falling into $@!& IT territory! How about a neck swap between a standard 1.75" body and a lame $@! 1.5"? Will that also not fit properly? I think someone mentioned something above about the cavity sizes being different. Thanks.


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 12:33 am
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Time to decide if you want a decent guitar now (the easy way is to get a MIM, Classic Vibe or something like that) or develop your skills in modding (continue reading, don't panic) :wink:

On Squier body thicknesses (although we're getting dangerously close to "this should be in the Squier section"...), the SE's, Standards, Deluxes, Vintage Modifieds, Classic Vibes are in the "normal" "about" 1.75"/45mm zone. Bullets, Affinities and other low end models are thinner. And that's just a general guideline; there may be exceptions (remember that Squiers have been built in numerous countries/factories...).

As another general rule, Strat necks are interchangeable without modifications. Of course, the 3bolt and the contoured heel only fit the like. And there may be differences in tolerances so you may have to do a little fitting.
The neck pocket depth is worth checking; the standard is 5/8" = .625" = 15,88mm (=~16mm).

On switches, check out the Schaller versions, they are a couple mm's shorter. And nothing wrong with mini size pots, if they are well made (= reads CTS, Bourns, Alpha).


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:36 am
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These are just my own personal opinions as always...please treat them as such and use them only for what they are worth to you.

As usual, I'm the odd man out here in that I just don't look at guitars in terms of a specific financial investment. -If- it's a guitar that you otherwise enjoy, then do as many mods and put as much money into as you feel comfortable with. To give you a specific example here, I have a '93 Fender black label "Squier Series"...got it in trade for a set of used Rototoms. Equivalent value; around $70. The first thing I did was replace the low end bridge with an MIM Standard, along with a steel GF trem block...we'll call that upgrade about $45 total (I snagged a new MIM bridge off Amazon for $20 and the GF block was $22 something). I then replaced the dime store tuners with some vintage knockoffs...another $25. I also I picked up a set of GF pickups that were a special purchase for a whopping $15 along with some CTS pots and a decent switch, which we'll call it another $25(ish). $110 in upgrades for a guitar that was only worth $70. I could even go so far to say $180 investment in a guitar that I doubt I could get $100 for on Craigslist. But here's the big catch - I -LOVE- that guitar! For a beat up, "cheap" guitar, that sucker is just an absolute joy to play and she's got more vintage tone than a lot of the genuine vintage instruments I've played. It didn't break the bank and -for me- it was VERY well worth it. I didn't buy this guitar or upgrade it with the intention to sell it - I'm a guitar player...I did all of this to PLAY IT!

So on that singular note alone, if you otherwise enjoy the guitar in question, my personal advice is to simply put as much into it as you need to in order to get the most out of it. If you're really more worried about the "investment" aspect of the instrument...honestly, you probably own the wrong instrument to begin with.


Now since we're talking an 1 1/2" body and since the OP said "bottom of the barrel", I could guess that it's perhaps a Squier Bullet (although there's other models that could fall under those specs as well). That said however since I don't know exactly which model Squier we're talking about (many Squier models are in fact very decent instruments for the money, including many of the CIC's), I'm only going to provide some general comments here regarding potential upgrades...and I will certainly keep the "budget minded" aspect of this firmly planted in my brain...

This is again just my own personal opinion, however the two biggest places where most inexpensive Strats suffer (regardless of lineage or even brand) is the pickups and the trems. First the pickups...my experience with the Guitar Fetish pickups has been hit and miss. Again the "super hot" single coils I put in that '93...seriously...love them! I'm normally a Duncan guy myself, but I have to say that I'm really floored by how great those pickups sound...I've played instruments with pickups costing $150 - $200 or more that just don't sound THAT good. On the other hand, I also bought a set of of their Lil Killer's and I have to say that I was very disappointed with them...even the low end Duncan "Scorcher Rails" sound SIGNIFICANTLY better. That said, it's also well worth noting that pickups are a HIGHLY subjective thing regardless of brand or price...the genre of music you play, the amp, your effects and especially your playing style are all contributing factors. Very simply, what may sound great to my ears, may sound like total crap to yours (and vice-versa). If the guitar in question is in fact a Bullet or even one of those department store "Squiers", I suspect that ANY decent pickup will likely sound like an upgrade, however please remember that results CAN vary. It's been my experience that sometimes you have to try a few different sets of pickups before you find the sweet spot.

BTW, if you haven't tried this already, BEFORE you order new pickups, regardless of which brand/model you choose, try adjusting the height of the pickups! It's a stupid simple little trick, however many people don't realize just how much of an impact this can have...and it doesn't cost a penny! Once you've tried this, if you're still not happy with the sound, THEN start looking at getting replacements.

Next to the pickups, while I do generally consider myself to be VERY open minded when it comes to guitars, the bridges on the low end Squiers (Bullets and such)...ummm...suck. How much you need to upgrade there REALLY depends on which model you have and what it came equipped with. For example, if your guitar has some decent bent steel saddles, then you can probably get away with just replacing the trem block...and I have GF steel trem blocks on a couple of Strats - they're quite decent for the money (I didn't care for the brass, however that's a personal taste thing). On the other hand, if the bridge has the cheaper pot metal saddles, it's probably better (if not cheaper) to just replace the whole bridge. Again here I can whole-heartedly recommend Guitar Fetish...I have one of their "upgrade" bridges on a '99 MIM Standard and I have no complaints at all.

Also, I might suggest some new tuners here as well, depending on what your instrument already has. Affinities and Standards for example usually have pretty decent tuners (mostly Ping if I'm not mistaken) and if that's what yours has, keep them, however many of the lower end Squiers have the really cheap "chrome covered" tuners. I will admit to some degree of biased snobbery here, however I -really- hate those damn things...not really worth the metal they're stamped from. In this case, while Guitar Fetish has some very good options, I'd actually suggest keeping an eye on Ebay. It's been a while, however I've gotten decent Ping tuners for as little as a buck a piece of Ebay...if you figure 6 tuners plus a few bucks for shipping, you can sneak in right around $10 - $12 there.


As far as purchasing and installation goes, as others have already suggested, measure BEFORE you buy! I wouldn't be TOO worried about the pickups...I have yet to find a pup in a single coil package that won't fit in the route of a Strat styled body regardless of brand (unless you're going to a regular humbucker, in which case you'll want to check the body route as well). Bridges on the other hand...measure, measure, MEASURE...then measure again! If the guitar in question is in fact a Chinese Squier, then it should be compatible with what Guitar Fetish has to offer, however I'd still measure...and measure again. Sitting there with the guitar torn apart only to find out you ordered a bridge with the wrong screw spacing just SUCKS.

Last but not least, once you've done your upgrades, particularly if you decide to replace the bridge, REMEMBER TO DO A FULL SETUP! This is probably a bit subjective, however it's been my experience that more cheap guitars get ragged on because of a poor setup more than anything else. Simple fact of life; a cheap guitar can play very well with a proper setup, however even the most expensive Custom Shop instrument is gonna play like CRAP with a poor setup.


So again, these are just my own opinions...and certainly I go against the crowd on this one, however if you enjoy the guitar, then it could well be worth a few pieces/parts here and there to get it where you want it. As already stated, inexpensive guitars certainly make a GREAT platform for learning a lot of this stuff. If ya screw it up, it's not a major loss and as others have said, you can often use the upgraded parts on other instruments down the road...I suspect there's more than a few of us out there who have parts bins of stuff we've hung on to over the years :lol: .

Good luck!


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 5:08 pm
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Lomitus, what did u think of the GFS trem block upgrade?

Upon closer inspection, the 1 1/2 body is an Affinity. It's written so small I never even noticed it. The 1 3/4" body (w/ the Lil' Killer pup set) is a Standard. I've had the Standard in my possession for so long that it's basically mine. The Affinity has a Rosewood neck, which I like much better than the Standard's Maple neck. I'm guessing that a swap isn't possible because the neck cavity is too deep on the Standard. I'll have to speak to someone over at Fender.

I've made the desicion to scrap the upgrades on the Affinity. If I can swap it's neck over to the Standard, w/o any major modification needed, I'll give it a go. I'm also gonna upgrade the trem block; I have to decide on either a Brass or Steel one. This means I'll also need a new trem plate and bar, right? I'd rather put the money it'd cost to fix up the Affinity towards a new axe.

Thanks for all the help.


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2015 8:35 am
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Adam O'Blivion wrote:
Lomitus, what did u think of the GFS trem block upgrade?


The GFS blocks are actually very good, particularly considering the price. I do in fact have these blocks on a few of my Mexican Standards, as well as my CIC Squier Standard and I have no complaints about them...compared with those half-size zinc alloy blocks, the GFS blocks are a MASSIVE improvement! Given a choice, I do actually prefer the blocks from Callaham...I really don't know what they do differently with their "cold rolled" steel, but the Callaham blocks are (in my not so humble opinion) totally superior to ANY trem block I've tried and they are well worth the added cost. That said, the folks at Callaham also have a very bad tendency to get bent into a snit when they hear the name "Squier" and for the cost and any effort you'd put into trying to get them to cut a custom block for you, the GFS block is likely the better choice, especially when we consider the budget aspect of this.

Seriously...I have the GFS blocks on a few of my instruments and I wouldn't hesitate to use them again.




Quote:
Upon closer inspection, the 1 1/2 body is an Affinity. It's written so small I never even noticed it. The 1 3/4" body (w/ the Lil' Killer pup set) is a Standard. I've had the Standard in my possession for so long that it's basically mine. The Affinity has a Rosewood neck, which I like much better than the Standard's Maple neck. I'm guessing that a swap isn't possible because the neck cavity is too deep on the Standard. I'll have to speak to someone over at Fender.


Yes, do double check that...I can't speak to all breeds and vintages of Squier necks, but generally speaking, they are in fact usually compatible. I'd measure the heel of both necks...both width and depth...and I'd certainly line them up side by side - you may very well find they're interchangeable.

Now that said, I do feel compelled to offer a word of caution; just because you've had the instrument "in your possession", don't assume that it's yours until the previous owner say so! I had a bass amp that a guy had left in my basement studio for over a year...never heard a word from the SOB until one day he showed up at my door with the COPS claiming that I refused to return his property! Sadly, people just suck...MAKE SURE the guitar is really yours so you don't end up getting burned!

Quote:
I've made the desicion to scrap the upgrades on the Affinity. If I can swap it's neck over to the Standard, w/o any major modification needed, I'll give it a go. I'm also gonna upgrade the trem block; I have to decide on either a Brass or Steel one. This means I'll also need a new trem plate and bar, right? I'd rather put the money it'd cost to fix up the Affinity towards a new axe.


Before I get into this, regarding brass - it's been my experience that this is one of those things that people either love or hate! I've not only tried one of the GFS brass blocks, I also used to have an '04 "Lite Ash" Strat with the factory brass block and in both cases I found them to be WAAAAAAAAY to bright for my own personal tastes. To me, the brass blocks made the guitars sound really thin and tinny...I ended up trading off the Lite Ash and I put steel back on the other MIM Strat and called it "lesson learned". That said, it really is a taste thing...you may in fact love them. On that issue alone, my advice would be to get the steel block FIRST...I suspect you'll find it to be a significant improvement, then later you can get a brass block and give that a try...if you don't like it, you'll already have the steel block to put back in.

Now as far as needing a new plate and bar...it depends. Regarding the plates specifically, the Squier plates (in general) aren't quite as thick as say, a Fender MIM plate is, however they are still very usable. The only real reason I would replace the plate itself would be in the event that the hole for the arm doesn't line up with the hole in the trem block (more on this in a bit). As far as the arm goes...well...I gotta admit that yea, I've bent a couple of the cheaper arms over the years, LOL! If you're not too heavy handed with the trem, you should be fine, however those import arms just aren't as heavy duty as the Mexican or American arms are. It's NOT something I would make a big issue of at this point as much as something to simply be aware of. -If- you should decide that you need a new trem arm, you can usually go into any guitar shop that carries Strats and chances are they have a box of the damn things behind the counter...I don't think I've ever payed more than $3 or $4 for a trem arm. Beyond this, what you'll need will probably depend on the guitar itself...

-If- the Standard in question is in fact a typical CIC Squier Standard (2 point trem), then you should be able to get away with just the new block. My CIC Squier Standard is an '09 and the GFS block fit like a glove! It only took me about 20 minutes to install during a string change...screwed on to the original plate and I was able to use the original trem bar with no issues at all. I also used one of the GFS blocks on an older Indonesian made Squier Standard and again, no problem there at all...the block screwed right on to the original plate with no issues. That said however, I would reiterate - measure, measure, MEASURE! If you're still not completely sure, contact the folks at Guitar Fetish...I've only dealt with their customer service once or twice, but they seemed most willing to help.

Now -if- this Standard is something other than your run of the mill CIC or Indo, things can get a bit more complicated...Fender Mexican Standards for example, while still metric, use a different spacing than Squiers do (not to mention they're a 6 point trem like the Affinities). To make things more complicated, I've also met a couple of older Japanese Squier Strats that actually use vintage American spacing. I've also ran into the occasional one or two Strats (or knock offs) over the years where NOTHING seems to fit right, beyond simply replacing the entire bridge (some of the early 90's Korean Squiers can be nasty about this). Again, as I said above, your best bet it to simply measure what you have...then measure it again.


BTW...for what it's worth, I'd still hang on to the Affinity. For what they are, they're usually pretty decent little budget guitars and if nothing else, they make wonderful backups and beaters. I have an '09 Affinity Tele and I have to say that I'm actually quite impressed with the over-all quality of this instrument. I did swap out the pickups (which I tend to do with most Fenders regardless of pedigree) and I drilled mine out for an upgraded string thru bridge, but she's actually a wonderful little axe...I'm not too crazy about Tele's as a whole, but I've even used my "Lil' Dragon" on stage a couple of times.


Quote:
Thanks for all the help.


No problem...hope you find this useful!


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2015 9:57 am
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Lomitus, can u please send me a link to the GFS trem block that "fit like a glove" in your Squier Strat Standard? I want to go with that one, as it sounds like our Squier Strat Standars are same guitar (w/ same specs.. 1.75" body, etc.)
Thanks again for all the info.


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2015 11:46 am
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Adam O'Blivion wrote:
Lomitus, can u please send me a link to the GFS trem block that "fit like a glove" in your Squier Strat Standard? I want to go with that one, as it sounds like our Squier Strat Standars are same guitar (w/ same specs.. 1.75" body, etc.)
Thanks again for all the info.



It's been a while, but I'm pretty sure that this was the block I used on my CIC...

http://www.guitarfetish.com/Solid-Steel ... p_688.html

That said, please note in their description that will need a replacement arm...I honestly don't remember having to do that, however again it's been a while and I have a drawer full of trem arms either way. Also please note that their description says "fits most imports"...again always measure to be sure.

BTW...just as a matter of curiosity, your Standard...it does in fact say "Standard" on the headstock, yes? You had mentioned earlier that you had missed the words Affinity Series on the other guitar. I just wanted to mention this as I do believe the Affinities and Bullets have different sized bodies from the Standards. I didn't break out a tape measure, but I did a quick visual look and my CIC Squier Bullet appears to have the same body dimensions as my Fender MIM Standard (I have a lefty MIM Standard and when compared directly side by side, the bodies appears pretty nearly identical in size and such). If your instrument doesn't actually say Standard or Standard Series on the mouse ear of the headstock, you'll want to check your measurements against the block depth before you order.


Okies...good luck!


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:46 pm
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lomitus wrote:
Adam O'Blivion wrote:
Lomitus, can u please send me a link to the GFS trem block that "fit like a glove" in your Squier Strat Standard? I want to go with that one, as it sounds like our Squier Strat Standars are same guitar (w/ same specs.. 1.75" body, etc.)
Thanks again for all the info.



It's been a while, but I'm pretty sure that this was the block I used on my CIC...

http://www.guitarfetish.com/Solid-Steel ... p_688.html

That said, please note in their description that will need a replacement arm...I honestly don't remember having to do that, however again it's been a while and I have a drawer full of trem arms either way. Also please note that their description says "fits most imports"...again always measure to be sure.

BTW...just as a matter of curiosity, your Standard...it does in fact say "Standard" on the headstock, yes? You had mentioned earlier that you had missed the words Affinity Series on the other guitar. I just wanted to mention this as I do believe the Affinities and Bullets have different sized bodies from the Standards. I didn't break out a tape measure, but I did a quick visual look and my CIC Squier Bullet appears to have the same body dimensions as my Fender MIM Standard (I have a lefty MIM Standard and when compared directly side by side, the bodies appears pretty nearly identical in size and such). If your instrument doesn't actually say Standard or Standard Series on the mouse ear of the headstock, you'll want to check your measurements against the block depth before you order.


Okies...good luck!


Yes, it says Standard Series on the headstock and the body measures 1.75". Both my Standard and Affinity are actually made in Indonesia, not China like I originally thought.
I'm gonna take the remaining measurements that the GFS rep told me to make, so I can order the correct steel trem bar. Once I get that all figured out I'm gonna, keep my finger's crossed, measure the neck pockets, and hope that the Affinity's neck is swappable w/ the Standard; the necks are the same size, so hopefully they fit.


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 3:34 pm
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Ok, so here's my latest issue.. The guy at GFS asked for the string to string measurement. He said it should either be 10.5" for MIM/Import or 11.3" for USA. I've been measuring where the strings come up from the block wholes, right before they hit the saddles. Every time I get 14/32 or 11.1mm. There was also a fluke measurement of 10.7mm. I've had multiple people measure as well, and they also came up with the same results. I don't know what the hell I'm doing wrong, but it's driving me insane. I've tried measuring the string to string distance on both the Affinity and Standard with the same results. Am i doing something wrong? Measuring from the wrong spot? PLEASE HELP!!!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 5:52 pm
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I'm relatively certain that your guitar is equipped with the imported bridge featuring 2-1/8" E-to-E string spacing.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 6:16 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
I'm relatively certain that your guitar is equipped with the imported bridge featuring 2-1/8" E-to-E string spacing.

Arjay


Ya, I'd be surprised if it wasn't the import. When I remove the plate to checkout the block, it'll be obvious what I'm working with. To remove the panel I just take off the strings and unscrew those top six screws, right? Thanks.


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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 1:09 am
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Adam O'Blivion wrote:
Retroverbial wrote:
I'm relatively certain that your guitar is equipped with the imported bridge featuring 2-1/8" E-to-E string spacing.

Arjay


Ya, I'd be surprised if it wasn't the import. When I remove the plate to checkout the block, it'll be obvious what I'm working with. To remove the panel I just take off the strings and unscrew those top six screws, right? Thanks.


I wouldn't as you'll have to reset the whole bridge.

The 3 screws that fix the block to the face plate are under the saddles. You should be able to get to them by moving the saddles aside once the strings are removed.

Undo the the screws to the block and drop it out through the bottom of the cavity.

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Post subject: Re: New Pickups for Squier Strat
Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 1:23 am
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John Sims wrote:
I wouldn't as you'll have to reset the whole bridge.

The 3 screws that fix the block to the face plate are under the saddles. You should be able to get to them by moving the saddles aside once the strings are removed.

Undo the the screws to the block and drop it out through the bottom of the cavity.


Oh $@!&! Thanks. You just saved me a giant headache


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