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Post subject: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:19 pm
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I am not sure what to do. I have a super champ x2 amp, a ramparte amp and I picked up my first Stratocaster. It is a Classic Player ' 60.

I wanted so much for it to be a great guitar for me but it isn't working out. I just can't get used to the tones or lack of them coming out of either amp. When I checked it out in the store I was plugged into a Deluxe Reverb. This guitar does not sound the same on either of my amps.

I did order a Eminence Rajin Cajun speaker for my super champ, hoping that will help. It should be here by next Friday. Maybe this will help but I am not counting on it. I have thought about upgrading to an American Strat but I am not sure that will do it either.

This guitar sounds sweet through higher end amps but not so good through mine.

Will an American Standard with Fat 50s give me better tone do you think?

I plan on doing more research but I am not sure how to start as I am new and don't have much in the way of guidence other than what the sales guys tell me and since I don't have their higher dollar amps at home I am not sure what I am bringing home.

And pearls of wisdom you could share would be appreciated,

Jay


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:34 pm
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JayWayman wrote:
I have thought about upgrading to an American Strat but I am not sure that will do it either.


Why don't you upgrade to a real amp instead?

And stop listening to sales guys......their only raison d'etre is to sell you something. Anything. Whether you need it or not.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:01 pm
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Welcome to the Forum Jay. The never ending quest for the perfect sound. I an no expert, but the perfect sound is very subjective. What kind of music you play is a good place to start. I have had dozens of amps and guitars looking for that sound. IMO changing speakers will not dramatically change the sound of your amp. There is a reason why high end amps sound better. They are built with better parts. All Strats have unique sound, as do Telecasters, Les Pauls, etc. etc. I would suggest going to a music store on a week day when they are not crowded with a bunch of aspiring heavy metal wannabes and spend some time with different amps and guitars. The you can decide what is your perfect guitar and amp. If you don't have enough cash to purchase what you want then save up for it, at least you will know what you want. Good luck and keep us posted
Kenny V


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:12 pm
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Thanks for the suggestions guys. I believe that you are both right.

I am out of my eliment when it comes to guitars. I had an uncle that passed a year ago and I used to listen to him play as a kid but he did not pass any of his years of wisdom onto me. I am not sure what he used to play even.

I am afraid to spend any more money on anything at this point. Except for an acoustic, it is pretty easy to figure that out. The electric stuff not so much.

I have an Epiphone '60 Les Paul Tribute that sound pretty good but I wanted to get a Strat and it isn't working so far. Of the five switch settings only one sounds good with either of my amps. :(

Jay


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 6:40 pm
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The reality is, you already answered your own question.
You said your guitar sounds good through better amps but not through the amps you have now.

Bingo!
Problem identified.
You need to upgrade your amp, not your guitar.

This problem happens to 99.8% of new (or less experienced) guitar players and they fail to see the answer even though it's staring them in the face. I just shake my head when I see some guy spend $6K on a Gibson R8 and then be confused when it doesn't sound absolutely wonderful through his $600 amp. Please do yourself a favour and don't fall into the category of the uninformed masses. Until you grow as a player and become knowledgable about all things related to guitar gear, turn your budget around the other way and spend more on your amp and less on your guitar.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:34 pm
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I cannot in truth say anything kind about the Rampart amp but those little Super Champ's don't sound half bad if you spend some time to set them up correctly. As well, a couple of quality stomp-boxes might not hurt either (a decent boost/OD and perhaps a compressor). Rest assured, there is nothing fundamentally wrong with your new Classic Player Strat. Ergo, the problem lies elsewhere.

If you need advice and counsel, you can always come here. And said assistance costs you nothing. The same cannot be said for a store's sales staff who earn based on commission.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:57 pm
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Welcome, and as BMW-KTM stated, your answer is staring right at you. You said when you tested the Strat you were plugged into a Deluxe Reverb. A Deluxe Reverb is a great amp, very versatile and a good mate for the guitars you own. You stated you liked the Strat enough when you tested it with the Deluxe Reverb, sounds like you might want to sell the other amps and invest in a Deluxe Reverb.

FWIW

T2

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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 12:49 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
... I just shake my head when I see some guy spend $6K on a Gibson R8 and then be confused when it doesn't sound absolutely wonderful through his $600 amp ...

Any guitar player worth his salt SHOULD be able to make a Gibson R8 sound "absolutely wonderful" through a $600 amp. Just my opinion ...

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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 12:53 am
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Welcome to the forum.

Electric guitar sound is very much a system. You have the guitar, the amp and your playing.

If any of those elements are out you won't hit the sweet spot. All three planets need to align.

I don't necessarily stand by the spend loads on an amp view. I have bought some great cheap small amps that work well for me. But the sounds of these amps have changed from great, to horrible, to really great with little more than a £25 valve or speaker change. It is getting those planets to line up. And when you look back to some of the classic blues players, they were producing some awesome sounds with little more than a converted radio.

The advantage in an expensive amp is the build and components used are more likely to to give the sound you are looking for because there has been more attention to detail by the manufacturer. You haven't got the variables of will a speaker or valve change make it better because it should already be the optimum configuration.

We can all say your guitar is great, and it is a great guitar, but it might not be great for you. People have affinities to different guitars. I love my Strats, I don't like Les Pauls. They are obviously great guitars (judging by the price tags and those who use them) but just not for me. There are those who hate Strats (obviously they are wrong but it takes all sorts to make a world ☺).

Listen to a lot of stuff, read a lot of gear reviews and artists rig run downs, watch a lot of YouTube stuff "How to sound like...." are great. If you have a Hendrix like set up and want to nail a Brian May sound you are always going to be disappointed.

Finding the sound you want can take years of experimentation, and could even change as time goes on and your playing changes. ...fun isn't it.

I would rather like your Ramparte Strat rig, but that's because it would suit the sound I like. I can understand why it wouldn't necessarily work for you.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 1:18 am
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Another part of the problem may be your "electric stuff not so much" statement.
First be sure that the Strat is set up good (pickup heights...), then give the guitar & amp some time, play a lot with different settings, get to know the gear.

Both those amps are a bit "demanding" - they only have the basic tube sound world, and they're IMHO very in-your-face amps. And one extra thing to note: neither has a reverb.


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 1:18 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
JayWayman wrote:
I have thought about upgrading to an American Strat but I am not sure that will do it either.


Why don't you upgrade to a real amp instead?

And stop listening to sales guys......their only raison d'etre is to sell you something. Anything. Whether you need it or not.

Arjay


+100 , buy a good tube amp


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 2:39 am
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Thanks for the help! The Ramparte did sound good in the store and my Les Paul with Humbuckers it sounds pretty good too.

Jay


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 6:22 am
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Having owned modern and vintage amps as well as guitars, some realities have to be observed.
You're never going to get a Prius to sound like a V8 S4 ... :wink: Joking aside,,

Before you buy another piece of gear trying to solve what you feel is missing you should first do this.
Take that Strat. Classic player 60 and go and test out small amps. Even budget end Squire Strats will sound good thru a Deluxe Reverb and capable hands.
You have a refined guitar so that is not the problem. Your amp choice is.
Look at the following..

(1) Champ 600 = 5 watts 1 Volume 6 inch speaker = A great little practice amp which sounds good at lower volumes but cranked has its limitations due to its 6" speaker. The common mod is to replace the 6 with an 8" Celestial or equivalent. ( A 6" just cannot move enough air at higher volumes )

(2) Pro Junior III = 15 watts 1 Volume 1 Tone 1 input . a simply layed out versatile small amp. Quite loud past 4 where it begins to distort. And up from there.
Downside is that it does not have Reverb.

(2) Blues Junior III = 15 watts similar to the Pro but with added features...

(3) Of this category I would pick 3. These are 40 Watts and lower. The Hot Rod Deluxe, The Blues Deluxe and of course to this list I would include the 65 Princeton reverb.

So those will give you very different sound parameters, but all within that Fender tube sound spectrum.

Today I only play thru 2 amps, a Pro Junior III and an early 60's Magnatone Classic 401. Best way to describe the sound of that Magnatone would be to listen to The Face's song " Miss Judy ".

I wouldn't return to the Hot Rod Deluxe, would go to the Blues Deluxe in tweed. a warmer tone all around ( and just to detract I have never had any problems with my amps breaking down.. ) and would also complement with a matching bottom cabinet.
Keep in mind that also having a small portable amp that you can take anywhere is much easier than trying to lug a 40 watt amp everywhere..... Consider this bt most importantly buy or replace an amp with what suits you best for the present. Not for what you wish to be at in the future. Has to be about what makes the most sense today.

Cheers.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:33 am
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I can't believe it hasn't already been said...but your problem could be something as simple as 'strings'. Whether it does turn out to be a string issue...will cost you $5.00 to $7.00 to find out (that is where I'd start). Try "Pure Nickel" strings.

My buddy has a $325.00 Fender Champion 100. I have a 2012 MIM Strat...he has a 2015 MIM Strat (same guitars built 3 years apart and set up exactly the same by me). My guitar sounded fantastic through that amp; his sounded like garbage. I gave him a set of MY strings, pure nickel Fender 150R's and it made a WORLD of difference. I have since switched to 150M's (11's instead of 10's), and even THAT made a big difference in sound.

It is your least expensive option in troubleshooting sound issues.


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Post subject: Re: Looking for some help.
Posted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:32 am
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It isn't a string issue since he has played it thru various amps and doesn't like what he hears from his current amps.

It is a solid state versus tubes preference. I likewise do not like the sound of a solid state amp nor the way a solid state electrical signal translates to sound. Yes... There are some solid state amps that sound great but it is for me not a tone in any range or volume that I like. To me it is a clinical disaffected ( disinfections :wink: ) tone.That is with 40+ years of playing.

Some people love them I find valve / tube amps have a warmer sonority. But that is all subjective as everyone hears differently. In the same way that the colors red or blue or any in the light spectrum may be identified with a common name but you and I and everyone else on the planet see's each color in a unique perspective. ( Not conjecture but real scientific facts. )

So where amps are concerned and the infinite opinions fundamentally based on personal perspective, it is best that we suggest testing various amps and see what sticks :lol:

The OP may like the higher line solid state amps, but the discussion at the moment is that he does not like what he hears from what amps he plays thru at the moment.

The equation is always fairly basic.
Quality guitar + Quality Amp. The amp is 50% of your sound and if it is off then nothing you do on the 6 string side will change the outcome. Ironically a well setup / dialed in budget guitar can sound great thru a good amp but not the other way around. You can color a miserable tone anyway you wish to, with effects and a cornucopia of mods, but the basics still remain in that the amp itself is not up to the task for the player/listener...
Also, also this about playing at home, in a jam with bandmates or whatever. This isn't about professional and playing venues where a solid state amp may be the ticket versus tubes. Not dismissing SS amps just in the present context.

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