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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:58 am
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jmattis wrote:
jeffo46 was, i believe, referring to OP's guitar...

To make a summary of this, @matthew420: just about any Fender neck will fit, if you feel you need a different width, profile or radius.
The buzzing you get is not IMHO a reason to replace the neck (provided it's not faulty), it's a reason to give the guitar a setup.
"The guy who set mine up said he had to loosen the neck all the way" spells to me as too much relief, plus possibly the bow-and-arrow effect (see my previous post) where the truss rod is so loose it doesn't support the neck at all. But, a full setup is my recommendation.

Strat-Slinger wrote:
A lighter touch can prob get away with a lesser relief but... not enough and it causes the guitar to play badly... It will effect the string tension to a feeling of "over-tightness".

I don't get the tension part.
Same string, same pitch, same string length (after checking the intonation) - why would the tension be any different with a straight neck or with relief? :wink:


As the saddle height rises the string feels stiffer. Lowering the saddle makes them feel looser.


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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:38 am
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Jeff46 if you tighten or loosen the neck it will cause the neck to either bow back or bow forward. This can cause tension on the strings if bowed too much. I tightened the truss rod up a bit last night and that helped a lot with the tension of the strings. For the most part the buzz stopped as well. Some people might find it odd but I like to play with 8 gauge strings with high action, it helps me get those Albert king bends.


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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 3:25 pm
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Hey, wait, what's going on here..?
91Stratplayer wrote:
jmattis wrote:
I don't get the tension part.
Same string, same pitch, same string length (after checking the intonation) - why would the tension be any different with a straight neck or with relief? :wink:

As the saddle height rises the string feels stiffer. Lowering the saddle makes them feel looser.
The subject there is relief (= how much the neck is allowed to bow), not action (= string height @17th fret).

@matthew420:
Good to read it got better. BTW, you have read the Strat Setup Guide, haven't you? Might help in getting rid of that remaining buzz - the .008 with high (how high..?) action should not be the cause.


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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 3:34 pm
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jmattis wrote:
Hey, wait, what's going on here..?
91Stratplayer wrote:
jmattis wrote:
I don't get the tension part.
Same string, same pitch, same string length (after checking the intonation) - why would the tension be any different with a straight neck or with relief? :wink:

As the saddle height rises the string feels stiffer. Lowering the saddle makes them feel looser.
The subject there is relief (= how much the neck is allowed to bow), not action (= string height @17th fret).

@matthew420:
Good to read it got better. BTW, you have read the Strat Setup Guide, haven't you? Might help in getting rid of that remaining buzz - the .008 with high (how high..?) action should not be the cause.

Agree... with Buzz/Rattle due to relief...
* Buzz/Rattle on the lower fret areas = not enough relief
* Buzz/Rattle on the higher fret areas = too much relief

Here's good info that should help:

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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 4:05 pm
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I am not sure of the exact height measurement of the strings. I just like it high enough where I can get those good whole bends and step in a half bends. So I can get under those strings. I feel with lower action it's just to hard to bend.


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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 6:10 pm
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I don't measure, just go by feel. The numbers don't really matter, it's the playability. For the neck bow, I fret the first and last fret, depressing the string in the middle, and adjust the truss rod for a slight movement of the strings (checking both high and low E). Then set the saddle height for the best compromise between action and rattle. Play and enjoy without worry about whether any numbers are correct. Sometimes a slight tweak of the tilt is necessary.

I have a friend that prefers action like matthew420, so when bending he gets under the adjacent strings. I hate that feeling, and prefer bending the adjacent strings together.

This is why the recommended numbers aren't really important, they don't match everyone's preference. For those new to setups, the recommended numbers can be a great starting point, and just might be sufficient for many.

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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:30 am
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I really disagree.

That go-by-feel system only works for those with sufficient (= quite a lot) experience on how to set up guitars.
For others (especially beginners, and especially on this era of unsetup-onlineordered guitars) the factory specs and measuring are the right way to go. Like I said before, reliefs of .050"/1,3mm are not uncommon...
So: "when in trouble, measure"

Of course, the factory recommendations are just that, but they are a good starting point - which in almost every case guarantee a buzzfree, easy-to-play guitar.

Quote:
For the neck bow, I fret the first and last fret, depressing the string in the middle, and adjust the truss rod for a slight movement of the strings

How much in inch/mm is "a slight movement"?
:wink:


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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 3:30 am
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More precisely, barely. :lol: Just enough to know that there is a slight bow and not dead straight.

I really meant not to get hung up on the numbers. Sure, start with the recommended settings and go from there, but don't worry if the setup isn't exact.

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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 8:45 am
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jmattis wrote:
I don't get the tension part.
Same string, same pitch, same string length (after checking the intonation) - why would the tension be any different with a straight neck or with relief? :wink:


With more relief, the string must be pressed a greater distance to fret a note. More distance=more tension.

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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 5:02 pm
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+1 take the guitar to a professional for a perfect set up before you try to mod it.

I modestly don't think changing the neck is a wise thing to do about the fret buzz you mentioned.

Depending on how you play and the neck relief, all electric guitars will eventually buzz a bit, and if it is properly set up it won't reflect on the sound your amp reproduces, especially at louder volumes.

Just my 2 cents: I prefer to keep my guitars as original as possible, I avoid changing anything unless it is strictly necessary. Swapping necks always gets me that "Dr. Frankenstein" feeling... I don't like it. Fender builds them like they are for a reason... But then again, it's me.Anyway keep in mind that Am. Std.'s and MiM's necks are often very different, including the number of frets, if I got that right.

If I were you, I'd insist a bit on a better set up in your MiM (which can be a great guitar) and take my time to invest on a real American Standard if it suits you. Then you can have bot neck profiles in the due guitars.

Rock on!

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Post subject: Re: mim stratocaster
Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 7:58 am
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thompal wrote:
With more relief, the string must be pressed a greater distance to fret a note. More distance=more tension.

You're right, that's what happens - in theory. On the 0,25mm/.010" relief I was recommending, nobody feels the difference in tension - and anyways, the original argument was the opposite:
Quote:
A lighter touch can prob get away with a lesser relief but... not enough and it causes the guitar to play badly... It will effect the string tension to a feeling of "over-tightness".


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