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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:46 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
...Relic lovers who wish to insult those who merely point out the blatantly obvious should remember that fact.....


:?:

I haven't seen this at all. Do you have examples?

It isn't "merely pointing out the obvious" at all, it is pure and simple put-downs and insults about relics and in particular those that like/own them. I have not seen one example of a relic lover denigrating anyone that simply states that they don't like relics.

Do you really think that we are somehow too stupid to know that they are artificially worn? That is insulting right there. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:20 pm
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shimmilou wrote:
It's a shame that some are so insecure that they would denigrate those that like the relics. The twelve-year-old school-yard routine is sad. :roll:

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:28 pm
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Geckochameleon wrote:
Ebaysux,

I truly think that there are far more than a "handful" of forum members that have disdain for the whole idea of relics. I DO get what you're saying about appreciating the look,...I really DO get that.

I have a great deal of trouble swallowing the whole idea of relics. Taking a beautiful new $1,500.00 (or so) Strat, and "aging" it to make it a $3,300.00 custom shop item. For the manufacturers, it's great business, and great business is where you find it.

I rarely,.....RARELY have such strong opinions on things, but to me, this is tantamount to taking a beautiful young woman, leaving her in the sun on a desert island for a year to weather her skin to approximate an old crone, all because you "dig older chicks".

I don't get it,...never will,...and DO have much disdain for the whole idea of it. Calling such owners "posers",...well, I'll watch that in the future.

Long story short, I stick by my opinion,....vehemently. But the delivery of same could've been better, I'll grant you.


P.S. This article sums my feelings up perfectly.

http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/1 ... our-guitar


I fully respect your opinion but how are you comparing "antiquing" a piece of freaking wood to sunburning a womans skin? The bottom line is you have every right not to like relics for whatever reason but why you seem to have such a deep seated hatred is beyond me.

The gist I am getting is what some people find "beautiful"...to you it is ruining something. I just don't see the big deal..when you get down to it.....it really is only a piece of freaking wood....and not even rare wood at that. I do know that friends I have who are pro carpenters are often paid, and paid well to make fencing and bars etc look old/distressed and aged...and it looks great to me. Would you go to the bar owner and call him a loser and a poser just because he didn't use rare petrified wood from the Mayflower or something, but "faked" it? Yes....the analogy is exactly the same and shows how silly this entire discussion is :mrgreen:


And, if someone feels like paying more for a guitar that Fender "reliced"..so what? That is their right.....they get the COA and all that and to them it is worth every penny or they would not buy it. Perhaps they could do it themselves and save money but as we have discussed some of these DIY relics are horrible. Now if the owner likes it more power to him/her and to each his own but to do a relic correctly and natural looking does take skill....I should know. I learned the hard way.

And to anyone considering a DIY relic I HIGHLY suggest you research and study what natural wear and tear is supposed to look like on a 50+ year old well used guitar and practice on old 2X4's with some nitro and also use junk plastic and metal plated parts first.

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Last edited by ebaysux on Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:31 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
shimmilou wrote:
It's a shame that some are so insecure that they would denigrate those that like the relics. The twelve-year-old school-yard routine is sad. :roll:


That's it?!? :lol: Yeah, that's still not denigrating those that don't like relics, it's denigrating those that are denigrating the relic lovers.

I think that you might spin that into "pointing out the blantantly obvious". :lol: :lol: :lol:

I was really expecting some examples that I might have missed. :?:

A swing and a miss. :(

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:42 pm
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The silver lining here is that everyone appears to be making proper use of the word "denigrate".

...and for that, I am denigrateful.


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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:45 pm
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Geckochameleon wrote:
The silver lining here is that everyone appears to be making proper use of the word "denigrate".

...and for that, I am denigrateful.


We could have use "belittled". But yeah, denigrate seems to carry a little more weight :)

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:01 pm
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Maybe next we should belittle those who pay more for a guitar made from "reclaimed" wood. I mean seriously I can't understand why someone would ruin a perfectly good old Basin Creek bridge from the depression era just to make a strat or tele body :lol:

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:01 pm
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Yeah, but I was the OP of that word in this thread, so yeah....


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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:06 pm
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ebaysux wrote:
Maybe next we should belittle those who pay more for a guitar made from "reclaimed" wood. I mean seriously I can't understand why someone would ruin a perfectly good old Basin Creek bridge from the depression era just to make a strat or tele body :lol:



Nah, but I'd gladly sand down a few relics for full refinishes...

You sort of did hit the nail on the head above, I view relics as a destructive thing. Like taking a human being to make a Borg... Some could argue the new "creation" is better, in function, aesthetics, or both,...but not me.


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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:15 pm
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Geckochameleon wrote:
ebaysux wrote:
Maybe next we should belittle those who pay more for a guitar made from "reclaimed" wood. I mean seriously I can't understand why someone would ruin a perfectly good old Basin Creek bridge from the depression era just to make a strat or tele body :lol:



Nah, but I'd gladly sand down a few relics for full refinishes...

You sort of did hit the nail on the head above, I view relics as a destructive thing. Like taking a human being to make a Borg... Some could argue the new "creation" is better, in function, aesthetics, or both,...but not me.


I give you full credit for the "denigrate".

As far as refinishing a relic I have nothing against that. As a matter of fact a percentage of my business is purchasing failed attempts and restoring the parts. But a proper relic on the other hand simply has more value so to sand one down and refinish it would be counter productive. You would be better off selling it and buying a non reliced guitar and put some coin in your pocket. Because regardless of your personal preferences, there are many out there who like relics and do not consider them making a human into a Borg, but making an otherwise run of the mill boring anyone can have reissue, into something they prefer but simply can not afford.

I mean think about it....why would someone want to have a beat up reissue that looks like a 50's or 60's guitar if they had 20 or 30+ grand lying around to buy an authentic one?

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:09 pm
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It is blatantly obvious that a relic is a guitar which has been intentionally distressed in order to appear to be old and worn when it is actually new and unused. That is what a relic is. That is blatantly obvious. That is also exactly what most people who object to relics take issue with ... that it takes extra effort (and expense) to make it look like something it is not ... in other words that it is fake ... that it is in fact a poseur. There is nothing about that which is not self evident.

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:24 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
It is blatantly obvious that a relic is a guitar which has been intentionally distressed in order to appear to be old and worn when it is actually new and unused. That is what a relic is. That is blatantly obvious. That is also exactly what most people who object to relics take issue with ... that it takes extra effort (and expense) to make it look like something it is not ... in other words that it is fake ... that it is in fact a poseur. There is nothing about that which is not self evident.


Just because it is "finished" to look older then it is actually is does not mean it is a "fake" guitar. Of course if anyone tried to sell a relic as an authentic 50's or 60's then yes..I would consider that "fake" but that would be the seller being a "fraud", not so much the guitars fault.

Now if you take objection to those who don't mind paying more to have a guitar that looks like a $30,000 guitar for 1/10th the price I can respect that but I don't consider the person who purchases it to be a poseur and a fake anymore then someone who purchases a signature series guitar.

Again I just don't see the big deal what a person decides to do with their freaking piece of wood (which is ALL it is) as long as they are not doing it with intent to rip anyone off. There are so many other things in life to take objection to this entire discussion is so petty and I think beneath all of us as musicians, hobbyists, players, Strat collectors, Strat owners, users of the forum and just individuals with individual tastes and pocketbooks.

Actually it is getting to the point that is approaching the troll who personally insulted the poster that painted his MIM Tele blacktop black and put gold hardware and EMG pickups in it. How in any way shape or form does it affect anyone else's life what someone else does with their freaking piece of wood? And if he were to relic that Tele more power to him if that is what he likes. And even more power to him if he did a good enough job that others would be willing to pay him for his efforts if they loved the way it came out and are smart enough to know they could not do that themselves without causing a total disaster.

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:52 pm
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Nobody I have seen on this or any other forum who ever used the word fake to describe a relic did not mean the guitar was a fake. Nobody ever implied, to my knowledge, that someone was trying to rip off unsuspecting buyers. Nobody ever implied, to my knowledge, that the guitar was not genuine Fender or that it was not really a guitar. It is the so-called "mileage" that is fake and nobody said otherwise.

I'm growing weary of this conversation. Having words placed in my mouth is not my idea of having fun and this issue will not be resolved here. I am in agreement with Frank. I hope this fad wears off soon so we can go back to discussing the actual merit of guitars.

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:06 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
That is also exactly what most people who object to relics take issue with ... that it takes extra effort (and expense) to make it look like something it is not ... in other words that it is fake


So I guess I did not understand this? ^

And if you are growing tired of this issue by all means stop responding. But I still do not understand how you or "Frank" think something that has been going on for like 30 years is a "fad". And as far as discussing the actual "merits of guitars"....what exactly does that mean? Are you insinuating that relics are not guitars, but fakes?

If you are going to post these types of statements then either be prepared to back them up, or face the fact that you are out of your element and gracefully concede :twisted:

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Post subject: Re: Bad American Strat relic job
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:54 pm
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ebaysux wrote:
...something that has been going on for like 30 years ....
1998.
That was the year relics first appeared in the regular Fender catalog. Also introduced to the catalog that year were other two finishes: NOS and Closet Classic, neither of which proved to be very popular compared to the relic treatment. Prior to 1998 if you wanted a relic you had to order a Custom Shop guitar. Ask me how I know that. It's because I have been around long enough to remember so please do not try to imply I don't know what I'm talking about. Thank you.


ebaysux wrote:
...face the fact that you are out of your element and gracefully concede
And there we see it again. The relic crowd directing comments at the man instead of the issue.

And with that I take my leave of this conversation and of you. Continue to speak ill of me all you wish.

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