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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:44 am
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Ceri wrote:
Xhefri wrote:
I remember hearing how the Beatles were hesitant to do some concerts after their heavily muiti-track recorded albums came out.

'Zactly! Many in those days were a major disappointment live, because they couldn't replicate on stage what they'd done on the album, and it just felt like a pale imitation.

I think the successful live acts, like so many named on this thread, were those that thought of live playing as a fundamentally different thing: the album was just there to provide a starting point for the different but very aggressive and exciting way they'd do the number on stage.

Since Mike mentioned them on another thread, I remember attending a very early Stray Cat's gig, late 1980. Full on action! Didn't cross my mind anything was missing, far as their live sound was concerned! :)

Cheers - C


Sidetracking a bit: I remember when I worked at a television station in the 70s, as they had purchased a four track Sony real-to-real (remember those???), which was nice because you could bounce tracks and even create some really cool echo effects. I remember one Friday night I was in the DJs recording booth with this Sony real to real, packed in with my VOX Super Beatle amplifier (4 x 10s) and a Strat. It was about 1:30 in the morning when the door opened up and smoke rolled out of the small studio room I was in and I was staring face-to-face with the station manager who just looked at me and said "What are you doing in here?" He then hesitated as I could not speak, and he shook his head, shut the door and left. Nothing was ever said!

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:48 am
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Xhefri wrote:
I was in the DJs recording booth with this Sony real to real, packed in with my VOX Super Beatle amplifier (4 x 10s) and a Strat. It was about 1:30 in the morning when the door opened up and smoke rolled out of the small studio room I was in and I was staring face-to-face with the station manager who just looked at me and said "What are you doing in here?" He then hesitated as I could not speak, and he shook his head, shut the door and left. Nothing was ever said!

Mwaaahahaha! I'd have liked to have been a fly on the wall! For more than one reason. :D

By the way, do kids today even know what bouncing tracks means?

...I feel so old. :(

:lol: - C

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:25 pm
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Ceri wrote:

By the way, do kids today even know what bouncing tracks means?

:lol: - C


Some might if they use the stand alone recorders where you have the
ability to bounce 64 virtual tracks down to four or two. :?:

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:11 pm
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Helpful info on the thread with some interesting perspectives.
Personally, I love 3 piece lineup. Played many Gigs with just a Bass and Drummer.
A few suggestions that may help:
1. Be Confident (SUPER confident)
2. If you feel your Chops aren't up to it... Do it anyway. Work on your Chops at home (hopefully your Band Mates are also doing this...) and use the playing as a Trio opportunity as a learning experience as well as a Chop Building experience. If your not sure how to build your Chops up at home, go get a good guitar teacher ASAP.
3. Don't stop playing if you make a mistake w/ the Band. Frankly, you can play the mistake again... as if you meant it. Of course, if your Band Mates stop.. well, you may wish to address this "Confidence" issue w/ them.
4. Don't rely on effects. If you can't play it straight through an amp without effects first... you can't play it. Period. Work it out and Practice it until you can nail it... then you can add effects if so desired.
5. Be yourself. Don't try and sound like anyone else... just sound like YOU.
Rock On!

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 3:46 pm
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SRV is a good example of the "play it in the studio as you would on stage" approach. Here's some details of his "Texas Flood" recording session, pretty much 3 guys plugged in and recorded with almost no overdubbing extra parts after the fact.

What you get on the album was always pretty much what you got live with him. About as honest as it gets and the Texas Flood album is a great example of how to make a Trio sound huge in a single pass.

http://pureguitar.com/features/2013/02/ ... -sessions/

Snowy


Last edited by No457 Snowy on Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:18 pm
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Ceri wrote:
Nothing 'suspicious' about it, Doc. Listen to Cream's "SWLABR" (Disraeli Gears), Zeppelin's "Livin' Lovin' Maid" (LZII), or Jimi's "All Along The Watchtower" (Electric Ladyland). The overdubbed guitar tracks are plainly audible..............listen to the difference between a whole range of artists' album and live recordings. By discovering how they fill the gaps left by the absence of studio overdubs you can really get your mind around how a three-piece unit functions in action.

Ditto....but better writ than I... :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:22 pm
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[quote="No457 Snohttp://pureguitar.com/features/2013/ ... /....Snowy[/quote]
An interesting read...but...in the listening....and watching on videos, Shannon's bass work is integral to this, with "rhythm fills' which replicate the 'feel' of a second guitar.

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:33 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
[quote="No457 Snohttp://pureguitar.com/features/2013/ ... /....Snowy
An interesting read...but...in the listening....and watching on videos, Shannon's bass work is integral to this, with "rhythm fills' which replicate the 'feel' of a second guitar.


Correct, it demonstrates that each member of a trio needs to bring their A game to make it work, it also demonstrates by example exactly what the OP is asking about (how to do solos and make it sound good as a Trio), Double Trouble (Tommy and Chris) is text book how it's done from the perspective of a well oiled rhythm section, and SRV seamlessly slipping between rhythm and lead using techniques previously described in this thread, did the rest.


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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 12:01 pm
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This is where your bass player needs to be doing what serves the song. I played bass in a 3-piece band and, often, I had to modify what I played to compensate for no rhythm guitar. It is not uncommon to have to replace the rhythm guitar music line with the bass. It takes a little work up front to figure out what to play but, in the long run, it is not too hard.


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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 1:45 pm
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warnergt wrote:
This is where your bass player needs to be doing what serves the song. I played bass in a 3-piece band and, often, I had to modify what I played to compensate for no rhythm guitar. It is not uncommon to have to replace the rhythm guitar music line with the bass. It takes a little work up front to figure out what to play but, in the long run, it is not too hard.


This reminds me of one band I was in. I've been playing bass for about 7 years, but I started out as guitarist in a band with 2 guitarist and no bass player.

To compensate I would hit the bass string first, them the rest of the strings. Think "Get off of My cloud" by the Rolling Stones.

I didn't pick up a bass until years later when I joinded a jam band.


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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:34 am
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warnergt wrote:
This is where your bass player needs to be doing what serves the song. I played bass in a 3-piece band and, often, I had to modify what I played to compensate for no rhythm guitar. It is not uncommon to have to replace the rhythm guitar music line with the bass. It takes a little work up front to figure out what to play but, in the long run, it is not too hard.


I concur - the bassist can either make or break the whole 3-piece sound.

+1

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:13 pm
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I listen to old live Hendrix and Trower and I never notice that there is no rhythm guitarist.

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:42 am
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Most rockabilly bands are trios.

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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:46 pm
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If the bass player fills in more its just fine. I play in a 3 piece band and we cover all kinds of stuff and it all sounds great. We play pop, funk, metal, blues, rock, country and cover 93 different artists. no problems with anything sounding empty or less full.


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Post subject: Re: Playing solos in a 3-piece band
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 9:54 am
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I would describe it as more than just filling in. The best example of this that I can think of is "Jumpin Jack Flash" by the Rolling Stones. The Rolling Stones (Keith Richards) bassline just rambles; you can't identify the song from that alone (except maybe at the chorus). If you were to play the true, original bassline in a 3-piece band, it would sound terrible.

What the bass player has to do instead is pick up the musical progression from the rhythm guitar and play based on that. It requires figuring out what the rhythm guitar is doing and building a bassline with that. As I said earlier, it takes some up front work to figure it out but, once you've done that, the resultant good-sounding bassline is often easier than the original bassline.


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