It is currently Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:17 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 48 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 2:29 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:57 am
Posts: 13164
Location: Peckham: where the snow leopards roam
Guys, did jlevesque88 mention where on the neck this buzzing is occurring? Unless I missed it (might have) the assumption above that this is low fret buzz might be premature. Within which case the nut slots are not involved - though it's easy to check.

jlevesque88 wrote:
I have just over .50mm between the 6th E at the 8th fret, capo on first and pressing the last. This is a little alarming as I tho thought it was around .10mm... And I still have this buzz with all that room.

Hi jlevesque88. 0.5mm is a touch on the large side: it should be 0.25mm with your fingerboard. Still, a quarter of a mil doesn't make that much difference down on the low E string as far as relief is concerned, and in any case yours errs on the side of caution, so it can't be the cause of the problem. As you say.

So the next thing to think about is action, measured at the 17th fret. It should be 1.6mm on the bass side on a 9.5 inch radius fingerboard. How does yours measure?

One more thing. Since it's been mentioned: it is unlikely that your microtilt is engaged, but if it is turn it all the way anti-clockwise to take it out of the equation and then leave well alone. As previously described, it could be causing the problem if it is pushing the 22nd fret end of the 'board up; aside from that it has no role in this situation.

Tell us your action and we'll take it from there.

Cheers - C

_________________
Image


Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:26 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:27 pm
Posts: 3448
Location: Connecticut
Ceri ... I still suspect the nut, if buzzing is occuring throughout the fretboard on the bass side, Then it is likely the string slots are cut too deeply....
Capo'ing to check relief would temporarily remove the nut ( as well as the Saddles location ) and the effects of a too deep string slot, but once released the problem would still be there....

How are those Paganini etudes going ... :?: :wink:

_________________
"C'est parti mon Kiki "


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 1:55 am
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:57 am
Posts: 13164
Location: Peckham: where the snow leopards roam
53magnatone wrote:
Ceri ... I still suspect the nut, if buzzing is occuring throughout the fretboard on the bass side, Then it is likely the string slots are cut too deeply.... How are those Paganini etudes going ... :?: :wink:

Hi 53: well, easy to check if it's the nut slots. When they're too low the strings buzz when they're played open. Soon as we fret a note we take the nut out of the equation. So if the strings still buzz when fretted it's not the nut.

It would be helpful if jlevesque88 tells us where on the neck the buzz seems to be coming from (open or fretted, high positions, low or everywhere, etc) and then we'll be able to be of more use.

Regarding the other thing, I just spent fa-a-a-ar more hours and hours than it ought to take cutting purfling channels on the back plate of a violin. Now I have to do it all over again on the front. Phew! Strats are easy-peasy by comparison. :lol:

Cheers - C

_________________
Image


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:33 am
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:50 am
Posts: 26
Sorry for disappearing, long weekend with work.

I'm ignoring the majority of the argument that seemed to sprout earlier on, however I appreciate the initial attemps to suggest the issue.

As for where it is buzzing, it is most noticable when picking notes up towards the nut (2nd fret, 3rd fret, so on), but is noticable enough for me to start scratching my head almost down to the 12th or 13th fret. I haven't had a chance to read any of these posts until now - nor have I had a chance to look at my guitar since reading the first few.

I'll give a reading of the action once I have a chance and hopefully that will help. I haven't touched the micotilt since purchasing it new... however, it was a display at GC so I'll make sure it hasn't been adjusted at some point by them.

This afternoon I'll get more measurements for you guys, thanks for all the input on this.

Edit: Forgot to mention, it does not buzz when I pick an open note/strum open strings... and keep in mind I do tend to have a pretty heavy picking style.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 7:36 am
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:50 am
Posts: 26
I'm using d'addario 9's, the same strings I've been using on all my strats for about 10 years now, i've never come across an issue with the strings before.

If i severely soften my touch while playing it seems to alleviate the problem a good amount... it's just not something I've ever had to do before. I know something must have moved within the structure of the setup, I'm just reaching out more for my own knowledge to see if this is something I could take care of myself.

Like I said before, after work I will come back with measurements - I am also not opposed to bringing it in, but if this is something that you guitar-educated folk can brainstorm over and fix without me spending a lot of money, I am not opposed to that either.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:09 am
Offline
Fender Staff
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:40 pm
Posts: 746
Giving advice is good. Disagreeing is fine. Discussing is encouraged.
Let's keep personal attacks out of it. Name calling doesn't strengthen a point, it diminishes it.
Please treat each other with respect.

Code of Conduct: "Don't harass, abuse, threaten, flame, stalk, or spam other users."

Just sayin.

All the best,
rob

_________________
______________
rob Schwarz
Director,Fender Customer Service
Proudly serving Fender Customers
for over 30 years

Image


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 12:29 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:27 pm
Posts: 3448
Location: Connecticut
Thank's Rob....

My aopologies to the Op for having his thread derailed.
Now we can continue discussing as to why this is happening.

Out of curiosity, do you keep your guitar in a case and/or is there sufficient humidity in it's environment or could there be too much.
Trying to think of all possible causes, which again without seing the guitar are just at this point educated guesses...

_________________
"C'est parti mon Kiki "


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 12:33 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:50 am
Posts: 26
It stays out on a stand, but I live in a well humidified area about 90 miles off the east coast, humidity usually is between 50 and 60 (a little high for my preference) - I've had my air conditioner on to keep the humidity in my room between 40 and 50.

I don't have any pictures right now, my mother jacked my camera and it's been at her and my father's house for a while. I'll see if I can get some to help out more as well.

Thanks again to everyone pitching in.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 1:24 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:20 pm
Posts: 9640
Location: Indiana
Rob Schwarz-Fender wrote:
...Disagreeing is fine....Let's keep personal attacks out of it...


I disagree, you face-washing, hair-comber! :lol:

_________________
---> "The amp should be SWITCHED OFF AND UNPLUGGED before you do this!" <---

Por favor, disculpe mi español, no se llega a la práctica con mucha frecuencia.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 1:28 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2010 2:39 pm
Posts: 1340
Looking back thru this thread it makes me smile to see just how passionate some are regarding guitars. Ok things may have been said but no one was injured.
Some good advice was given earlier and later on by respected members of the forum.
I possibly like others are now wondering how your string height is set and maybe it is just too low. How does it meaure around the 17th and did you compare this to the Fender setup guide?


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:48 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:50 am
Posts: 26
Okay here we go-

I took some measurements of the action, and while I was at it, everything else. I brought the truss relief to about 0.15mm and after doing so (and making sure 1/8th inch gap between tremolo and guitar, and tuning and whatnot), action is about 3mm at the 17th fret on the low E and just over 2mm on the high e.

I'm working on getting pictures now, but for right now that's what I have. The buzzing doesn't happen strumming open strings, but does once I start picking notes right from the first fret. It is prominent on all the strings, usually lasting all the way down to around the 20th fret or so, then it seems to not be as bad for the last two frets (some strings are a little worse than others, but all have it all the way there). It does seem to be a bit worse towards the lower end of the neck (first frets).

Hope this helps, finally had a chance to sit down with it.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:12 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2009 12:01 pm
Posts: 3261
Location: Halls of ikea
Don't know if this will help you solve the problem, maybe just confirm if it's a single fret high up on the neck, hold down or capo on the first fret and run a cigarette paper or something similar down the length of the neck see if it snags up on any individual fret, I have my strings as low as I can get them and I've changed from 9's to 10's and back again without any fuss....the pro's will probably use feeler gauges I'm guessing if indeed this is a way of finding out this problem......best of luck


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:15 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:50 am
Posts: 26
Tried it with a feeler gauge, no snags at all.

Been playing around on it more, the lower notes (close to the nut) are definitely a lot more noticeably bad, starts getting more tolerable around the 12th-ish fret. Definitely worse when I put the relief back to a normal setting.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:29 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:57 am
Posts: 13164
Location: Peckham: where the snow leopards roam
jlevesque88 wrote:
action is about 3mm at the 17th fret on the low E and just over 2mm on the high e.

Hi again jlevesque88. Thanks for the measurements. Godda say, it's a bit surprising. That is not low action you're describing: Fender's own suggestion is for 1.6mm on both treble and bass sides on a 9.5 inch radius neck, and that's by no means limbo dancer low. Still, yours is not insanely high either, and if it's still buzzing for you then you have a couple of options.

The relationship of action and fret buzz are a player-by-player thing. What suits someone's picking/strumming style is not right for someone else. What most of us want is the action as low as it will reasonably go without intolerable buzzing - with our particular playing. The usual way to get it is this:

Start with the action set to Fender spec (1.6mm). Play a string with your normal attack and if you get no buzz lower the saddle a quarter turn on both height screws. Repeat this procedure again and again till you get buzz you don't like, then reverse the last adjustment and, bingo, you have the action as low as it will go for that string. Repeat for all the strings.

Of course, in your case you have to invert the process, since you already have intolerable buzz with higher-than-spec action. So, working with just one string at a time, raise the saddle a quarter turn on the height screws, play it at all the frets, and repeat again and again till the buzz has gone or reduced to tolerable levels. Repeat for each string. Now you have the action as low as it will go for your playing style.

I'd be curious to know how high you have to take the action to get rid of your buzz.

The alternative is simply to take the guitar to a good, well recommended tech and have him look at the problem with you. No shame in this: after all, there's only so far we can go over the internet without the guitar in our own hands. We run the risk of tinkering with your guitar with our eyes closed, as you might say.

I hesitate to mention it, but one last possibility is that this isn't fret buzz at all. There are many other possible sources for buzzing/rattling noises on guitars: a loose saddle screw, a pickguard screw, the pickguard itself vibrating against the body between it's screws, an electronic component worked loose... etc etc etc. we're all assuming this is fret buzz because that seems to be what you've described, but if we had the guitar in front of us we'd also be checking it wasn't one of these other things, to be sure.

Long post, and I'm not sure it's going to solve your problem. But some more things to think about, at least.

Good luck - C

_________________
Image


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Some minorly alarming discoveries
Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:35 pm
Offline
Fender Staff
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:40 pm
Posts: 746
Going back to what others have advised.....plus my own two cents---if the neck is "Buzzing" pretty much all over, and the string height is to spec....and the pickup height is to spec, then more than likely, there are uneven frets or the neck has warped. You can perhaps "sight" that lookng down the neck, but I too would recommend you have a reputable and authorized Fender Service Tech have a look. Without having the guitar in hand, its all guess work....including mine.

All the best,
rob

Founding Member of the
"in Shimmilou's general direction" club. :P

_________________
______________
rob Schwarz
Director,Fender Customer Service
Proudly serving Fender Customers
for over 30 years

Image


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 48 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: