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Post subject: High E string slips off fretboard
Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 3:21 pm
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Hi. First time poster here. First time Fender strat owner as well.

I recently got a 2001 Yngwie Malmsteen signature strat in great condition and I love it but it has a major flaw as stated in the thread title. I raised the string height and also tried a thicker gauge (.11) but to no avail. Upon closer inspection I see that as the strings hover over the mid pup, the g, b & e are hovering more to the right a bit over the pole magnets and at the bridge (which is angled) they're even more to the right, off centered. Other than that, everything appears to look fine EXCEPT when I took off the back plate, I saw hand written in black marker on the body the letters MZ. Now I know serial numbers that start with mz mean mexican made. I fear that this is not a true Yngwie model but made from parts with the body being mexican. I don't want to take the neck off just yet to look at the pocket for verification. I've never done this with any guitar and fear I will screw something up.

I'm assuming that string slipage is not common and am looking for some personal experiences, opinions and advice. I thought maybe I should take it to a tech but I don't see how it can be fixed.

Maybe its just a scalloped neck thing and is common with them but somehow I doubt it.

Thoughts?


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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 3:26 pm
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Welcome to the Forum!

Sounds to me like the nut is not cut right. Take it to a tech and have it checked out.

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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 3:52 pm
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CAFeathers wrote:
Welcome to the Forum!

Sounds to me like the nut is not cut right. Take it to a tech and have it checked out.



Hey, thanks for the reply and the welcome CAFeathers.
You know, you might be on to something there.
Just eyeballing it, it does look like the spacing is not exact, especially the gap between the b and e. It actually looks like a wider gap there. I guess the nut would have to be replaced with a new one. I wonder how much thats gonna run me.


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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 3:58 pm
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Should be less than $50.00 to fix.

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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 4:20 pm
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CAFeathers wrote:
Should be less than $50.00 to fix.


That doesn't sound to bad.

Before I take it in I'm thinking that I'd like to take the neck off and look at that pocket to satisfy my curiosity. Although even if it does turn out to be american, I guess that still wouldn't guarantee that it is the same body that came with the neck...or would it?

I'm assuming its simple enough to do. Just unscrew the bolts and take it off?


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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 5:27 pm
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If you really want to know if it's real, take pictures of what you find when you take it apart. The neck pocket, end of the neck, the body under the pickguard. Put the pictures somewhere we all can see 'em. A guy, Smark, is an expert at Yngwie models.

You might be able to fix the problem by realigning the neck in the neck cavity. When you put the neck back on, slide it around so that both E strings are on the fret board.

If you can't get both on, it's better to have the Low E fall off than the High E.

Good Luck.

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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 6:23 pm
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orvilleowner wrote:
If you really want to know if it's real, take pictures of what you find when you take it apart. The neck pocket, end of the neck, the body under the pickguard. Put the pictures somewhere we all can see 'em. A guy, Smark, is an expert at Yngwie models.

You might be able to fix the problem by realigning the neck in the neck cavity. When you put the neck back on, slide it around so that both E strings are on the fret board.

If you can't get both on, it's better to have the Low E fall off than the High E.

Good Luck.


I don't quite understand how the neck may be realigned when the bolts will be tightened into the same holes but I'll try it and will have to take those pics and post them. Definitely thanks for the advice/suggestions orvilleowner.

Maybe I should also point out that the slipping is not an extreme case but is enough to piss me off. Also the nut is brass.


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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 6:30 pm
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That was (is?) a problem with the EJ's. I took off the neck and reset it, problem solved.

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Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 7:42 pm
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Radd wrote:
I don't quite understand how the neck may be realigned when the bolts will be tightened into the same holes but I'll try it and will have to take those pics and post them.


The screws aren't real tight in the holes in the body.

You'll be surprised how much wriggle room you have.

When you do it, be sure to loosen the strings a lot. Having the E strings on will let you see when you have things lined up better.

When you snug up the screws, don't overdo it!

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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 5:03 pm
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Ok, I took off the neck and realigned it twice and it seems to have helped a bit but not solved it. I might just continue to adjust my playing to it for now.

I took photos for authenticity verification but my piece of crap camera basically died on me so these are the best that I managed to capture. Many of the numbers are hard/impossible to make out but I wrote down everything the best that I could. I'm guessing it says in the neck pocket, OCT 24 2001. The Allparts sticker on the pick guard has me thinking its an after market. There are 3 stickers on the body underneath the guard that look like they read:
C 1-23
1T24
0053388-741

I'm going to send Smark an email and direct him to this thread and see what he comes up with.

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm18 ... M%20strat/


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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:06 pm
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Hey, guess what? I had this exact same problem with my '99 YJM. Here's what I determined the cause was, and what I did to fix it. Hard to tell exactly from your pics whether this applies to yours or not, but on my YJM neck the fret ends were beveled at an extreme angle on both the bass and treble ends. I seem to be able to tolerate it on the bass end just because of the way I play (I have a non-traditional way of doing barre chords), but on the treble end I was always slipping-off the edge. Why Fender finished the frets like this is a mystery to me... The 6000 fretwire is more common on basses and with only four (typically) strings, this sort of beveling might not be a big deal on a bass neck. But it destroyed the playability of this neck.

For the fix, orvilleowner has the right idea, but there is a little trick to it. I had to loosen all four neck screws (I kept the strings on, but loosened them after putting a capo at the first fret) and had to force the neck into a position that put more of the high-E string on the fretboard, or over the frets. This involves pulling-up on the neck so it is literally at an upward angle from the body. I actually found it easier to turn the guitar on it's side with the bass strings to the floor, and push down on the neck, keeping pressure on it while I re-tightened the four neck screws in an alternating pattern. It's easier if you have someone to help you do all this, but I did do it myself. This sounds extreme and almost dangerous, but it worked like a charm for me, and the Strat has played perfectly ever since. I'm lucky too because this is an extremely tone-ful Strat with a very lightweight alder body that is very loud acoustically and very lively electrically.

And there is further good news in that this problem will smooth-out on its own as you play and wear down the frets. Today, my frets play better than they ever have (It helps NOT being a hamfist too).

Another thing... I know that the more I played this Strat, the lighter my overall playing technique became. This also helped to make this problem less of an issue. Scalloped necks demand a very light touch, and that is something that all of us who play these necks will develop over time. It just comes natural as you take advantage of everything the scalloped neck offers a player.

Let me know how everything goes...

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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:15 pm
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Radd wrote:
There are 3 stickers on the body underneath the guard that look like they read: C 1-23, 1T24, 0053388-741


That's enough info on the body: that is the part number for the Yngwie body. Check out the parts list:

http://www.fender.com/support/diagrams/pdf_temp1/stratocaster/0107100_02A/SD0107100_02APg3.pdf

If you listen to SMark, you may get your problem straightened out. Good luck.

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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 9:00 pm
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 6:16 am
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SMark wrote:
Hey, guess what? I had this exact same problem with my '99 YJM. Here's what I determined the cause was, and what I did to fix it. Hard to tell exactly from your pics whether this applies to yours or not, but on my YJM neck the fret ends were beveled at an extreme angle on both the bass and treble ends. I seem to be able to tolerate it on the bass end just because of the way I play (I have a non-traditional way of doing barre chords), but on the treble end I was always slipping-off the edge. Why Fender finished the frets like this is a mystery to me... The 6000 fretwire is more common on basses and with only four (typically) strings, this sort of beveling might not be a big deal on a bass neck. But it destroyed the playability of this neck.

For the fix, orvilleowner has the right idea, but there is a little trick to it. I had to loosen all four neck screws (I kept the strings on, but loosened them after putting a capo at the first fret) and had to force the neck into a position that put more of the high-E string on the fretboard, or over the frets. This involves pulling-up on the neck so it is literally at an upward angle from the body. I actually found it easier to turn the guitar on it's side with the bass strings to the floor, and push down on the neck, keeping pressure on it while I re-tightened the four neck screws in an alternating pattern. It's easier if you have someone to help you do all this, but I did do it myself. This sounds extreme and almost dangerous, but it worked like a charm for me, and the Strat has played perfectly ever since. I'm lucky too because this is an extremely tone-ful Strat with a very lightweight alder body that is very loud acoustically and very lively electrically.

And there is further good news in that this problem will smooth-out on its own as you play and wear down the frets. Today, my frets play better than they ever have (It helps NOT being a hamfist too).

Another thing... I know that the more I played this Strat, the lighter my overall playing technique became. This also helped to make this problem less of an issue. Scalloped necks demand a very light touch, and that is something that all of us who play these necks will develop over time. It just comes natural as you take advantage of everything the scalloped neck offers a player.

Let me know how everything goes...


Isn't that what's good about this site? There's always someone who knows the answer and will take the time to write it out.

I just want to add a couple of thoughts. One is that a guitar's nut is not sacrosanct. It is perfectly reasonable to adjust or replace it to suit your needs. You will probably have a string spread of about 35-36 mm on the YM 42 mm nut. You could have a tech make you a new one (or do it yourself) with a spread 1 mm less, with the low E in the same place, and therefore the top E a millimetre closer to the centre of the fingerboard. This apparently small difference may be just enough to stop you pulling the E string off the end of the frets, especially lower on the neck.

An easy mod can make a crucial differnce to playability.

Another suggestion. I remember (many years ago) going through a phase of falling off the fingerboard on the treble side. There was nothing wrong with that guitar: it was my technique that had imperceptibly changed in some way. Eventually, I did some detailed examination of my finger movements, practiced carefully with that in mind for a while; and the problem just went away again in time.

No criticism whatsoever of your technique, but part of the solution may be in your own hands...


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Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:27 pm
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Smark - I tried it again like you suggested., twice. It is much better now
but not fixed. Maybe I should have applied more pressure. I'm not quite as concerned now as I was about taking it to a tech. I'll try to adjust my playing to it and see how it goes.

ovilleowner - Thanks for the link and info. While it does look like it could be legit, I still have to wonder simply because of the fact that the number is on a sticker that anyone could make and slap on. I'll just have to take it at face value I guess.


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