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Post subject: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:55 pm
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I think it is two separate singles that make the duelly. This was a very informative site:

http://www.xhefriguitars.com/page4.html


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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:04 pm
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First off, the pickups are not fighting each other to the death.

In the case of Don Lace Sensors a dually is two noisless or stacked pickups side by each and used together as a single unit although in many cases there are also options for splitting them up again after the fact. This could theoretically be done with any stacked pickup. Ordinarily two single coil pups side by each and wired together as a unit would be considered a humbucker and not a dually. It's when you pair "stacked" pups together that we call them a dually.

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:23 pm
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Thanks for the clarification. I am still learning some of the terminology.


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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:05 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
First off, the pickups are not fighting each other to the death.

In the case of Don Lace Sensors a dually is two noisless or stacked pickups side by each and used together as a single unit although in many cases there are also options for splitting them up again after the fact. This could theoretically be done with any stacked pickup. Ordinarily two single coil pups side by each and wired together as a unit would be considered a humbucker and not a dually. It's when you pair "stacked" pups together that we call them a dually.

IMHO I thought the word Dually simply came from the idea of having two single Lace pickups put side by side or a dual configuration (consisting of two parts), then nicknamed "Dually."

I thought a "stacked" pickup was a set of two single coils, one on top of the other and having the winding on one part go the opposite direction of the other part—in a way making it a "stacked" humbucker, rather than a side-by-side humbucker:

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The Laces are a complete different design using what Don Lace Senior called: Micro Matrix Combs:

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When I wire a Dually using a mini-switch (on/on/on) it simply runs the two pickups in a series or individually. I have always wanted to try this we a set of Seymour Duncan single coils to see how it would work. I could be wrong, and have been in the past. But this was my understanding. :D

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:46 pm
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Well, that's interesting. That's really interesting. I'd never done any research into how Sensors were made. I always assumed they were stacked. I'm not sure when or who it was but I know I picked up the stacked idea from someone at another well known Fender forum. You really do learn something every day. Today I learned it the hard way ... after sticking my foot in my mouth.

Thank you for the heads up. I have something new to study.

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:08 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
Well, that's interesting. That's really interesting. Today I learned it the hard way ... after sticking my foot in my mouth. Thank you for the heads up. I have something new to study.

LOL! your a good mate. I have posted a few things that were pointed out and then I swallowed really hard. And they were much bigger than this. On my build thread I will be showing how a Dually is put together as I am on that part of the build right now. Will be posting in a few minutes! Keep cool... 8)

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:50 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
... after sticking my foot in my mouth.

Haha - BMW, if that's the worst foot-in-mouth you ever do then you ain't doing too badly. Most of us have made fa-a-a-a-ar bigger public slips than that! For some of us it's nearly a full-time occupation. :lol:

Anyway: that Lace diagram does show beautifully why it is you can set Sensors so close to the string they're all but touching without getting magnetic string pull and wolf notes. Not that any sensible person would want to, but it was always one of their proud claims.

To Xhefri: have you ever tried connecting a Dually in parallel? I have no idea if there would be good reason for trying that - maybe it would be a horrible thing to do. But I'm just contemplating alternative set-ups for that on/on/on switch...

Cheers - C

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:17 am
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Find the wiring schematics for the original Fender Telecaster Plus[ca"1993--Radiohead guitar]. There's a blue Lace at the neck and a Red Dually Lace at the bridge. There's a micro switch in the circuit along with the standard three-way which coils splits the pickups to give:
-neck
-neck/bridge front
-neck/bridge rear
-neck/bridge
-bridge
.....if memory serves.
Great guitar!!.

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:23 am
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Ceri wrote:
To Xhefri: have you ever tried connecting a Dually in parallel? I have no idea if there would be good reason for trying that - maybe it would be a horrible thing to do. But I'm just contemplating alternative set-ups for that on/on/on switch... Cheers - C

Good question. Even for my dyslectic brain, understanding how the on/on/on works is tough. But when it is in the middle position the hot lead to the middle right lug connect to the top right lug, runs through white ground wire to the lower Lace in the dually then connects through the hot side (orange wire) to the middle left lug and then down to the lower left lug and through to the upper Lace and then to ground. Wow. Got that? :shock: :wink: So for sure these are wired in series (now that I just confirmed that for sure. So parallel? Umm , might take two mini-switches. Where is Andy Big Hair when you need him???? :?

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:13 am
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Wonder if Fender's archives has the schematic for TelePlus? That might give you some insight.

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:38 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
Wonder if Fender's archives has the schematic for TelePlus? That might give you some insight.

Hey Doc, I had a version one Tele Plus and took it apart. The bridge Dually worked the same way as the Ultra. It used a 3-way Tele type switch and then used the on/on/on mini-switch for the red dually in the bridge. This gave either pickup (up or down on the switch) or the two in series (middle on the switch). Very clever as that distance from the bridge creates different tones. The one closest is more biting, like a traditional Tele bridge sound. The one closer to the neck is more of a hollow sound and less biting. And of course the 2 in series has a fatter humbucker tone. This is one reason I love the Dually i the bridge on a Strat. Lot's of mixing and matching! :shock:

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 2:48 pm
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Xhefri wrote:
Even for my dyslectic brain, understanding how the on/on/on works is tough. But when it is in the middle position the hot lead to the middle right lug connect to the top right lug, runs through white ground wire to the lower Lace in the dually then connects through the hot side (orange wire) to the middle left lug and then down to the lower left lug and through to the upper Lace and then to ground. Wow. Got that?

Er... no! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Brainwise, you beat me hands down. :D


Xhefri wrote:
Where is Andy Big Hair when you need him????

Ah - I've sat and watched while Andy took a plate of spaghetti Bolognese and hooked it up series, parallel, in phase and out of phase. You and Andy in a room together? The rest of us would just stand and stare in respectful silence. 8)

Cheers - C

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:44 pm
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Ceri wrote:
You and Andy in a room together? The rest of us would just stand and stare in respectful silence. 8) Cheers - C

Just chalk it up to divine inspiration, mate. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:46 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
Ceri wrote:
You and Andy in a room together? The rest of us would just stand and stare in respectful silence. 8) Cheers - C

As would we, standing at an easel, or in a wood shop, looking over your shoulder. Nothing but the best of the best in these pages mate.

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Post subject: Re: Duelly is two singles in the ultra?
Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:54 pm
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@ZZDoc

The Tele Plus is not necessarily associated with Radiohead.

Supergrass' guitar nut Gary Coombes used regularly (and still uses) a blueburst Telecaster Plus throughout the years.


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