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Post subject: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:22 am
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Hello anyone reading this thread!

I own a strat which is said to be a '91 American Standard but several things have appeared to confuse me. It has only 21 frets , plastic insert like an MIM instead of walnut like an MIA and 2-screw tremolo like MIA.Tuning machine is Fender.Pickup on bridge is Noiseless and tone pot is TBX. On the other hand when I removed the neck I saw factory stamps and stickers - date .....? Number on headstock N1059870 - indicates 1991, date on body Jul 21 1989 and Jul 26 1989 ( two date ? ) date on neck Jan 20 1993 - fake ? .Is it a real American Standard or not? If not then what can it be -neck MIM or Squier -93 , body Standard 89 - it looks like with the usual fake decal. My guess is this thing was probably an MIA series body and MIM Squier Series neck that someone put a counterfeit Fender headstock decal on.
Sorry for my language, I'm Polish, and I ask for Help - Andrzej.
Foto full - https://picasaweb.google.com/1081568167 ... ENDER91Big

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 6:04 pm
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Andyles6...from what I can see it is a faked partscaster. There has never been a plastic instert in a MIA Strat that I am aware of. The neck looks to be a MIM one that has been relabeled with a new headstock decal. The body is an American standard with a period correct "Swimming Pool" route for the pickups. This guitar appears that is started out as an American Standard and was modified from there, with pickups, neck, etc.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news on this one. But even though it may not be what you thought it was, if it plays well, sounds well and you like it...go with it!

Hope this helps.

T2

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 7:51 pm
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As a general rule, most MIA Strats do not have a plastic truss rod sleeve, but there are exceptions to this. The 1997-8 California Series had this feature.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/FENDER-Stratoca ... fresh=true

Here is a thread that gives more detail on those models.

http://www.strat-talk.com/forum/stratoc ... -98-a.html

There were earlier USA Strats that also had this plastic sleeve. PM me if you want some more links.


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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:26 pm
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This is a MIA strat- there is no way that neck is faked. Refer to this thread and compare photos of the neck base-

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=84239

I dont see how anyone could fake a correct QA sticker and a micro tilt adjustment.. At best this neck has a period correct serial number, font, logo, the only thing that suggests otherwise is that this is a mexican neck which is not a familiar sight, but not uncommon. :?

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:25 pm
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NO American Standard has ever had a 21 fret neck and a plastic plug, so for sure the neck has had some shenanigans going on. It could be a US neck, but all those extra stamps make me very suspicious, why all the different dates? The QC Sticker may be original, but why years apart from the body? I wonder if it is possible it went back to Fender at some point, but that still doesn't explain them using a plastic plug, Fender would never use a California series neck on an American Standard, that would have to be the blunder of all time!

This guitar is NOT a California Series guitar so that reference and link are a moot point. It could be a california series neck with a fake American Standard logo put onto it. Guitar headstock stickers like this HAVE been faked or at a minimum, were unused examples that found thier way onto a neck Fender did NOT put it on. I have seen this before many times!

I see nothing in any of the posts that makes me think that Fender made an American Standard with 21 Frets period. That is NOT disputed. Which means it must be a partscaster...a nice one for sure, but one none the less.

One way to help verify this guitars bonefides is to send the pics and info to Fender at:

consumerrelations@fender.com

T2

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:47 pm
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Neck was made in Mexico- guitar assembled in USA. Just like the Fender USA Prodigy for example. Someone would have to go to an extreme length to fake a neck like that- you would be assuming also that they would also fake the QA sticker? The only suspicion is the name on the written on the QA sticker neck- I think that that was written with a sharpie afterwards, perhaps by a previous owner.

If you do some digging on previous stated thread and online, you will find there are a small number of strats out there that are like this- not a lot out there though. Not to be mistaken from the 'California Series' however..

T2Stratman wrote:
This guitar is NOT a California Series guitar so that reference and link are a moot point. It could be a california series neck put onto an American Standard, but why?


There is no reference in this thread that indicates to a California Series Strat. Even so, California Strats had a '64-'67 style logo.. so that rules that part out.

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 7:05 pm
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Quote:
There has never been a plastic instert in a MIA Strat that I am aware of.


T2

Sorry, I was not clear in that I was not trying to weigh in on the identity of the OP's guitar but rather was trying to address the narrow issue of the plastic sleeve based on your comment above. I fully agree that no American Standard would have the plastic sleeve, but not all USA built Strats in this 1989-1991 period were American Standards. That is established in detail in the other thread about my guitar that Blertles refered to.

I only linked to the California series to add an additional example of a MIA Strat with a plastic sleeve, again in response to the quote. I agree the California series is not relevant to the identity of the OP's guitar since his predates that series by many years.

The wider issue is that in this time period, some guitars were sold as Fender Stratocasters that were not to American Standard specs. The OP's guitar is far closer to Am Std configuration than my guitar, but the neck certainly is a puzzle.

Regarding Fender Consumer Relations for this question, they will only say the guitar is too old for their computer records and they can't supply any information.


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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:08 pm
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Michael7 wrote:
Quote:
There has never been a plastic instert in a MIA Strat that I am aware of.


T2

Sorry, I was not clear in that I was not trying to weigh in on the identity of the OP's guitar but rather was trying to address the narrow issue of the plastic sleeve based on your comment above. I fully agree that no American Standard would have the plastic sleeve, but not all USA built Strats in this 1989-1991 period were American Standards. That is established in detail in the other thread about my guitar that Blertles refered to.

I only linked to the California series to add an additional example of a MIA Strat with a plastic sleeve, again in response to the quote. I agree the California series is not relevant to the identity of the OP's guitar since his predates that series by many years.

The wider issue is that in this time period, some guitars were sold as Fender Stratocasters that were not to American Standard specs. The OP's guitar is far closer to Am Std configuration than my guitar, but the neck certainly is a puzzle.

Regarding Fender Consumer Relations for this question, they will only say the guitar is too old for their computer records and they can't supply any information.


Michael7...No issues...That neck (along with three different pickups) is why I said partscaster to begin with. The body is most certainly an American Standard, but the neck I think has been forged with a US label. They made those transfers in the thousands and that is why some years the numbers run for mulitple years without changing the prefix. That decal looks everybit like an American Standard, but the 21 frets means it is not. For those that don't believe these transfers get outside of Fender's control...I have a few myself from when I worked at a Fender Dealer as they were going out of business...I have seen them forged onto both non-Fender necks as well as Fender made necks from other countries, (some right here on this forum) to make them into US ones, which is what I believe happened here. This most certainly is Not a stock American Standard nor the same as it left the Fender Factory.

T2

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:28 am
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Michael7 wrote:
The wider issue is that in this time period, some guitars were sold as Fender Stratocasters that were not to American Standard specs. The OP's guitar is far closer to Am Std configuration than my guitar, but the neck certainly is a puzzle.


My thoughts exactly. The pickups have been swapped out most definitely, but the neck essentially is the same as the neck on your Strat. Perhaps this was made for export? now thats a credible theory.

I have seen American Std strats equipped with Floyd Rose shipped internationally designated as an 'export'. From what I remember they had an 'AMXN' prefix on the serial number.. which was from the same time as this particular model but still I doubt it. My best guess is that for a short while the USA plant were temporary unable to make necks and thus necks were brought in from Mexico and finished in USA ready for assembly.

Here's one here: http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... p?t=990863

I'm not here to argue the credibility of this Strat, its just not many people know that not all American Strats were "American Std's" at the time. Key things to note were the Squier production change over in '93-'94 temporary shift to mexico (later became Standard Series) and the fire that occured in the Mexico plant, temporarily shifting some production to the USA. Again, not to be confused with the 'California Series'

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:57 pm
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Blertles wrote:
Michael7 wrote:
The wider issue is that in this time period, some guitars were sold as Fender Stratocasters that were not to American Standard specs. The OP's guitar is far closer to Am Std configuration than my guitar, but the neck certainly is a puzzle.


My thoughts exactly. The pickups have been swapped out most definitely, but the neck essentially is the same as the neck on your Strat. Perhaps this was made for export? now thats a credible theory.

I have seen American Std strats equipped with Floyd Rose shipped internationally designated as an 'export'. From what I remember they had an 'AMXN' prefix on the serial number.. which was from the same time as this particular model but still I doubt it. My best guess is that for a short while the USA plant were temporary unable to make necks and thus necks were brought in from Mexico and finished in USA ready for assembly.

Here's one here: http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... p?t=990863

I'm not here to argue the credibility of this Strat, its just not many people know that not all American Strats were "American Std's" at the time. Key things to note were the Squier production change over in '93-'94 temporary shift to mexico (later became Standard Series) and the fire that occured in the Mexico plant, temporarily shifting some production to the USA. Again, not to be confused with the 'California Series'


I think you guys are getting hung on something the OP didn't ask or state. He was told it was an American Standard Stratocaster...it is not, it is a partcaster of some sort and the neck "May Be" of american origin, but it is not what he was told it was...and when a neck and body (from this era) are two years apart, it is a partscaster...american parts or not, but it is not what the OP was told it was...and no amount of wishful thinking about some other similar guitar will make it so.

Not trying to argue, but this has gone way off into left field on a "maybe" or "It is Possible" well anything is possible, but based on the OP's pictures, I see no real hard proof from any of the links. Now the one that was "Similar" could have been more difinitive if there had been pic of under the pickguard, neck pocket, etc...but alas no.

T2

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 6:38 pm
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T2Stratman wrote:
I think you guys are getting hung on something the OP didn't ask or state. He was told it was an American Standard Stratocaster...it is not, it is a partcaster of some sort and the neck "May Be" of american origin, but it is not what he was told it was...and when a neck and body (from this era) are two years apart, it is a partscaster...american parts or not, but it is not what the OP was told it was...and no amount of wishful thinking about some other similar guitar will make it so.


+1000!

Some folks simply enjoy being hoisted on their own petard.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Need help identifying '91 ( or 89 ) strat
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:46 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:

Some folks simply enjoy being hoisted on their own petard.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Arjay


lol :roll:

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