It's rather hard getting a guitar of your choice where I'm located, in western India- with high import duties, rising forex rates and of course, profiteering by companies- and also a limited choice of instruments. I'd like either a Fender Blacktop Stratocaster with the Floyd Rose or a Jackson Soloist SLX or SLSXMG. But the local distributors don't stock these models, simply because 'they don't sell'. Worse, some dealers mock the idea of fitting a Floyd on a Fender, though there are factory-built Fenders with Floyds.

I'd like these specs in the guitar I'm buying (which should save the trouble of buying two for each tone)- the sound of choice is classic 80s metal with plenty of clean range. Fenders are better for cleans, while the Jacksons are more metal.

• It has to be a Fender or Jackson (I've already got a Mustang-1 amp, and would prefer to stick to one group)- and not another brand, and certainly not a Squier
• 22-frets minimum, 24-frets preferred
• At least a humbucker in the bridge, routing for two humbuckers, prefer two humbuckers fitted
• Coil-tapping for cleans, or a singlecoil in the middle
• Floyd preferred for the higher notes, though I may settle for a regular trem
• Alder body wood strongly preferred, though may opt for a basswood body if needed
• Contoured heel preferred, though that's in Jackson territory

For a high-gain metal rhythm, do I have to have a humbucker in the neck position? Or at least a HotRails pickup? Or will stacked singlecoils do enough? That's something I'm now thinking of, since I want both metal and clean tones. Maybe it's easier to get metal tones on a guitar which does cleans better (with added gear), than to get clean tones out of a metal-spec guitar? If a second humbucker is needed, which Stratocaster bodies are routed for it?

Plenty of classic metal guitars have HSS, and there are a few 22-fret strats (Highway-1, American Special) selling here. The odd Jackson Dinky is somewhere in some warehouse, not in a showroom, so I can't test it out. There's a Blacktop HH regular trem, very good for the task, but I'd still prefer a little more- like a Floyd/Zero. An online music instrument retailer site sells a Jackson SLSXMG at an obnoxiously high price (hang on, that's made in India, isn't it? They sell it at a made-in-USA price in India!) and it may be the only one.

All arrows seem to point to the Blacktop- in a nice budget, fills all the boxes but for the Floyd/Zero- but there's always a little more you want.

Welcome.

From what I'm reading, I see all arrows pointing to the Jackson. For if you got the Fender, you'd ultimately be modding it like there's no tomorrow in order for it to be more "Jackson-like".

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You dig?

Have you thought about Ibanez at all? If you're into Floyd equipped guitars, they're about as good as it gets in my opinion.

To answer one of your questions, a Duncan Hot Rail neck pickup is too dark. I just went through a short stint with one, and it didn't cut through a mix. If you're going HSS, you'd be better off with a hot bridge humbucker, Hot Rail neck in the middle, and JB jr. Neck. The JB jr. cuts through much better in the neck, and Hot Rails are fantastic middle pickups.

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Is there any way to order a Blacktop HH FR? I found it to be the perfect Fender Guitar to mod into the perfect Metal Monster. If not, the Jackson Soloist isn't a bad choice. If you are willing to spend big money on modifications, have you considered the American Standard HSS? The 2012 models have Fat 50's single coils and also have a Diamondback Humbucker in the Bridge. It does have a nice 2 point tremolo and I am sure you can install Locking tuners for extra stability. I have a 2011 model that has Tex-Mex single coils and a Diamondback Humbucker. I have Fat 50's in my Highway 1 and it does Metal nicely along with Rock, Blues, Country, and Alternative.

Here is a pic of my Blacktop HH after the mod project I did. It now sports a Push/Pull volume pot for coil tapping, JB humbucker in the bridge, a Vintage Stacked Tele Neck in the middle, and a Pearly Gates in the Bridge. All I can say I am extremely happy with this guitar.

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RK

2007 Fender Highway 1
2012 American Deluxe
2015 MIM Dave Murray HHH
2010 Fender Blacktop
1987 Fender Avalon Acoustic
2012 Marshall DSL 15 watt head

Maybe the 24-frets and the Floyd Rose suggest it- otherwise, a Fender is fine. I felt the Fender would be a good choice, as it does cleans better, and then run it through a pedal or amp settings for the metal tone. The inverse, getting clean tones from a metal-spec guitar (like ESP, BC Rich and Schecter), would be almost impossible- maybe it is, on a Jackson.I don't like the clean tone of Ibanez, as it sounds too artificial. I heard both the Blacktop and the Ibanez RG in a shop, on a Line-6 Spider, and the Blacktop did clean tones much better, but still did some good metal tones.
That's a very interesting input. Maybe I don't need that neck humbucker so much? I'll keep that in mind. Thanks for the tip.
That's a problem for us customers in India. Dealers don't want to stock the Blacktop HH FR or the Jackson Soloist. They say these don't sell. I feel it's because of some secret deal with Ibanez, ESP and maybe Gibson, to keep the Jackson brand as much as possible out of the local market, and also limit Fender sales. The only Jackson super-strats I can find are discontinued Dinkys (DK2, DX-10D, DXMG).
Useful inputs indeed. Since I'm not that well-versed about electronics and hardware, I'll make a note of this. However, I can at the very best stretch my budget to the American Special HSS, and as I'm spending more, I'd prefer to mod less- and with what's high-end here, not at all. Even the Blacktop is a little expensive to mod, let alone take it as far as you have, here.

Here are the options I've got

• Fender American Special HSS (most expensive, most refined- and made in USA)
• Fender Blacktop HH (new product, not so refined, most versatile)
• Jackson DK2 (out of production, 24 frets, HSS, LFR)
• Jackson DX-10D (out of production, basswood, 24 frets, HH, LFR)
• Jackson DXMG (out of production, basswood, 24 frets, HH, LFR, EMGs)
• Jackson SLSXMG- the pricing on this Indian site is outrageous- more than an American strat!

So these questions arise-

• Is the Blacktop not a very refined product? Does it fall back in sound quality? Maybe I can stretch my budget a little to buy a better Fender/Jackson. There is, after all, a stereotype on the quality of Mexican Fenders.
• Then again, is that neck humbucker so essential a part of a metal guitar? If so, that puts the Blacktop ahead in the race, again. Of course, that idea of a Hot Rails in the middle is something I've noted.
• Will a noise gate help with the single-coils on high gain? Do I need one at all?
• The American Special Strat is the most refined, and most value for money at the price. Just how much in tonal variety can I get from that instrument, in stock state, with or without settings/pedals?
• Some Jacksons have EMGs. Will EMGs give a better tone, or will I lose the clean?

To answer some questions on the Blacktop FR, the output of the Neck and Bridge are hot. The guitar also cleans up rather nicely, but still gives you umph when going with distortion. The Blacktop FR HH did not come with the same Nickel Pickup covers as the non Floyd Rose Model. I decided that it was aesthetically pleasing. I was going to buy just the pickup covers to put them on it, and decided that I liked the way the HSH looked as well. I went in to talk to my guitar tech several times and asked some questions. The store owner was playing one of his guitars in the shop and loved the way it sounded. He had the same Neck and Bridge pickups I have in mine, but the SC sized ones. After more deliberating and Q&A sessions, I decided to buy the pickups in my Blacktop as mentioned in my previous post. The tones are different than the Stock version but well worth the extra money spent on it for aesthetics and tone.

I think out of the box the Blacktop is very versatile, especially the HSH model. A very good bang for the buck. I think you can play it "out of the box" without having to modify it. But if you want a Floyd Rose, I do not recommend retro fitting one on there unless you have a very competent technician that can do the work for you. I am not as pleased with the MIM HSS FR Standard that is also in production. And for being 100 US dollars more, not worth the extra money for it, unless you want a specific color.

Something you have to know about the American Special is that it is built in America, the neck and body are made in America, the electronics and the bridge are the same ones used on the MIM guitars. Don't get caught up in the whole MIM vs. MIA hype. All guitars are made with pieces of wood and metal. These things can vary the ultimate outcome of the guitar. I have played some crappy American models an some excellent MIM models. Same thing with the Squier Brand, some good ones and some bad ones. I always tell people to play before you play. The one will present itself to you.

I think the output of the Texas Specials in the American Special are good, but prefer the Fat 50's in the American Standard. I am not a fan of the Atomic Humbucker in the American Special, and the Diamondback Humbucker a bit better tone, but that is just to my ears. Other people have their opinions on the 2 pickups as well that differ than mine.

The EMG's will give you more bite with distortion. They do not clean up as nicely as other pickups, unless they are passive pickups. If they are active pickups, which I believe they are, you also need to remember to change the battery on a regular basis so they keep giving that higher output that they are designed for.

Play all the floor models in the store within your budget. The right guitar will present itself, and if not...wait until another shipment comes in. Are there any other music store you can go to and check out their selections?

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RK

2007 Fender Highway 1
2012 American Deluxe
2015 MIM Dave Murray HHH
2010 Fender Blacktop
1987 Fender Avalon Acoustic
2012 Marshall DSL 15 watt head

Sorry I did not mean to confuse or bring up more questions. In general the Blacktop is a very good bang for the buck. The American Special is also a good guitar, but for 100 US dollars more, you can get a case, better pickups, and other features that surpass the American Special with the American Standard.

I do not know the market in India, so the American Special might be a better deal.

Nothing wrong with Jackson Guitars, the neck profiles are more slim, and I prefer the necks on Fender guitars. You may prefer this neck profile though.

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RK

2007 Fender Highway 1
2012 American Deluxe
2015 MIM Dave Murray HHH
2010 Fender Blacktop
1987 Fender Avalon Acoustic
2012 Marshall DSL 15 watt head

Where can I catch actual sound samples of better quality, of all these guitars? I can get Youtube videos of good quality, particularly from retailers (a German and a Thai video actually got metal tones from the AmSpec HSS, as also one American) but otherwise, it's difficult, and I can't find a Jackson video of a high quality- the Chris Canella videos are just average in sound quality.

The Jackson DXMG has EMG-HZ pickups, which are passive. The DX-10D has Duncan Designed pickups, which are not the actual Seymour Duncan pickups but low-cost variants made overseas. The DK2 has real Seymours, and apparently, the SCs are stacked. I wonder what to make of this (though I'm assured with the real Seymours).

I'll accept that the quality of electronics and hardware is more or less the same in Mexican and American Fenders, though there are different grades (like some pickups sound better, some tuners hold better) but I want at least 22 frets on the neck- fair, the Blacktop shows up again. But does the woodwork make a difference? Apparently, Mexican Fenders are five-piece, American, three-piece.

Meanwhile, I'm still looking for a Jackson Super-strat I can test. Dealers don't want to stock Jacksons after the price hike in the last few years, but I still see plenty of ESP/Ibanez instruments everywhere, in the same price bracket.

I fully agree with Martian!
Stay away from the Blacktop, it won't do the job for you.

Go Jackson or think about Ibanez!!
I have a cheap Ibanez RG 350 MYE. I exchanged the Edge III trem for an Ibanez Edge Lo Pro (way better regarding tuning stability) but the Edge III wasn't THAT bad for the beginning.

Why not adding another brand? Ibanez goes as well with your amp as Jackson does. And I also assume that they might be easier available in India than Jacksons!?!? Just guessing!

Here's my RG 350 MYE. It's not too different from the Jackson, has 24 frets and a Floyd Rose system.
I can highly recommend this axe. Lots of guitar for little money.
It doesn't sound artificial at all! Just use a good amp. But I used to play it via my old Spider I modeling amp and the clean sounds were sparkling clean. No probs at all.

I admit, changing to PAF Pro pickups is a big but useful step. My JEM sounds fantastic when played clean. But that's another league.

If you can spend a little more, try to get an RG 550. Better trem system, more defined sounding pickups (even though the stock pickups in the RG 350 aren't bad at all). I like them!

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Kindest regards from Germany, Dee
My recordings --> http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_mu ... dID=564337
STRATS ROCK!!! but Teles and Firebirds, too!

Well, I didn't play metal in my video, it's a Joe Satriani cover (Ten Words) but maybe it helps you a bit. If I remember right, I recorded this with a Boss GT-10 via a Vox Night Train tube amp.
If you don't like the sound of this guitar, then you know why I sold the Boss GT-10, ha ha ha.

The video is ok but in reality the guitar sounds better!

Maybe it can give you at least an idea of the sound: IBANEZ RG 350 MYE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLr9GTo5Y8Q

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Kindest regards from Germany, Dee
My recordings --> http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_mu ... dID=564337
STRATS ROCK!!! but Teles and Firebirds, too!

And here's an amazing Video with an RG 350 MYE from a guy who's much better on the guitar than I am. I friggin love this video:

John Petrucci: Damage Control Cover by Luiz Gustavo Faria.
You'll be impressed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQNLjXhB ... re=related

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Kindest regards from Germany, Dee
My recordings --> http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_mu ... dID=564337
STRATS ROCK!!! but Teles and Firebirds, too!

Here's what you can do with an American Standard (not Metal but Hardrock):

My song "Go To Hell!"

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so ... ID=4122456

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Kindest regards from Germany, Dee
My recordings --> http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_mu ... dID=564337
STRATS ROCK!!! but Teles and Firebirds, too!

Fair, so if it's down to the pickups, how do they compare? The Fender American Special has Texas Special singlecoils and an Atomic Humbucker. The Blacktop has Hot Vintage Alnico humbucking pickups, and the switching allows for coil-splitting, to get the singlecoil sound. The Jackson DK2 has Seymour Duncan STK-1 in neck and middle, and JB TB4 in the bridge. The cheaper Jacksons have Duncan Designed humbuckers and EMG-HZs. Which of these has the best, and which one needs to be swapped?

The Blacktop is the cheapest of these options (for some reason, cheaper than other Mexican strats), then for a little more, the two DX Dinkys, then, for 33% more the DK2, and for 20% more, the American Strat. The Blacktop costs 60% as much as the American Special Strat. I'm not too optimistic about the DX Dinkys.

Looking at the prices, the Blacktop seems the best choice, and it's also a better package than the DX Dinkys in stock condition. Now if it's more or less the same electronics and hardware in American and Mexican Strats, would the Blacktop sound a lot better with the same pickups as those in the higher-priced variants? I know there's a decent case for the Blacktop in stock condition, but I've thought of it. While fitting a Floyd Rose is very risky on any Strat, would you recommend any other two-way tremolo alternatives, like a Kahler?

There's a strong case for the Ibanez RG350, but I'm not keen on one, and besides, Mr SmokinFrets has also got a regular Fender Stratocaster. I'm keen on just one instrument, for multiple tones, so the question comes up. I prefer Jacksons at the same price points (Ibanez can get a little expensive, and they don't appear to be value for money there), and if Jackson owners can share their experiences, it will help.

smokin frets thank you for the Audio share..very very good!! My favorite part is you played the solo with the song and there is that level when a solo just becomes noise for the sake of shredding..you know that line..great job..going to have the song in my head all morning!

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Mona
"Music is What Feelings Sound like"

Fair, so I may opt for the Blacktop for now, and then upgrade to AmStd-HSS (and fit a neck humbucker then). I may choose one of the HH-FR or HSH variants. The HSH, people say, has the maximum tonal variation of the strats. Then again, does the HH-FR have more sustain? The entire Blacktop range is pool-routed.

That HSH mod for the HH-FR will make a little more sense, then. I may have both the guitar to buy and the mod job to have done. Although, while upgrading, selling it will be a tough ask. But with two Diamondback humbuckers and a Fat 50 (or two Atomic Humbuckers and a Texas Special)- can I get more out of the Blacktop?

I'll pass the Jackson for now- it will be in the running as a second guitar- SLXT, maybe. Or get a luthier to build one like it- if you can't buy it, get it built. An answer to the HH-FR vs HSH puzzle will decide what I ask the dealer to order.