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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 4:17 am
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thejakeludwig wrote:
Hey ppl idk if its just a myth but it seems true. The difference between a MIM Strat a USA Stratocaster is not only better pickups, but The bridge pickup has tone controls. Why don't they wire tone controls on the MIM strat? I've heard someone tell me all you got to do is simpily connect one wire to either the pot and switch or the pickup and switch. I have no clue?


Its because traditionally strats don't have tone controls to the bridge pickup. This is not only true for MIM strats, but American Vintage reissues and strats from 1954-1980. My Custom shop 65 Strat doesn't have tone to the bridge pickup, it also only has a 3 way switch. It cost way more than an American Standard, so its not a quality/cost thing its more an adherence to vintage strat motifs. It is a simple mod, that's easy to do if you want it


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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:56 am
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Yeah, its holding onto nostalgia, but its dumb. It is easy to wire the middle and neck to the one pot. This is THE MOST requested wiring mod on strats, I understand why they do it on reissues, because that's how they were way back when. Why they do it now; I have no idea. You do get more output from a pickup that doesnt run through a tone pot, but you can easily use a no load pot, which Fender does do with the Delta Tone. SO when the tone knob is at 10, it removes it so to speak from the signal path. I believe this was just a mistake from the beginning to not connect the bridge pickup to the tone pot, its the one pickup that benefits from a tone control the most.


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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:27 am
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It is a very simple fix. I usually put the Neck and Bridge on the same Tone Control. Put a jumper from the empty lug (lug 1) on your 5 way switch to Lug 3.

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:36 am
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windwalker9649 wrote:
Yeah, its holding onto nostalgia, but its dumb......I believe this was just a mistake from the beginning to not connect the bridge pickup to the tone pot, its the one pickup that benefits from a tone control the most.


Clueless again.

"Back in the day" when the Stratocaster made its initial debut the tweed Fender amps were not capable of or intended to reproduce the higher frequencies as the amps of today do. Their alnico Jensen speakers leveled out at around 3kHz and were pretty much done above 3.75kHz. Thus, the bridge pickup on a Strat sounded quite pleasant "without need for further tone modification". If you were half the genius that Leo was, we'd all be playing "windwalker" guitars and amps.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 10:59 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
windwalker9649 wrote:
Yeah, its holding onto nostalgia, but its dumb......I believe this was just a mistake from the beginning to not connect the bridge pickup to the tone pot, its the one pickup that benefits from a tone control the most.


Clueless again.

"Back in the day" when the Stratocaster made its initial debut the tweed Fender amps were not capable of or intended to reproduce the higher frequencies as the amps of today do. Their alnico Jensen speakers leveled out at around 3kHz and were pretty much done above 3.75kHz. Thus, the bridge pickup on a Strat sounded quite pleasant "without need for further tone modification". If you were half the genius that Leo was, we'd all be playing "windwalker" guitars and amps.

Arjay


+1

Play a vintage strat through an amp of the day and you'll quickly realize why the strat had a wide open bridge pickup. Amps were really dark back in the day and the wide open bridge helped the strat cut through in a band situation. Of course with the modern voicing of amps it really isn't a problem and the bridge is more trebly. So if you look at it in historical context it made perfect good sense. Its not like all strats are wired that way today, there are plenty that come from the factory stock with the tone wired to the bridge.


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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:13 am
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Yogi wrote:
Its not like all strats are wired that way today, there are plenty that come from the factory stock with the tone wired to the bridge.


Correct.

And I've frequently performed that mod for many clients and have used it myself for selected applications. But the historical context of the original logic itself is well-documented.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:46 pm
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Wow, tough crowd. Why flame the guy?

Antique v modern amps not withstanding (though I take the point there), I think he's right. The average strat bridge pickup IS the one that benefits most from some top end reduction. To these ears anyway..

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:21 am
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adey wrote:
Wow, tough crowd. Why flame the guy?

Antique v modern amps not withstanding (though I take the point there), I think he's right. The average strat bridge pickup IS the one that benefits most from some top end reduction. To these ears anyway..


Not flaming him at all, just informing him that there is a reason that it was that way to begin with why it has since changed on some models. Of the two standards, the MIM is more towards the traditional strat formula, i.e 21 Frets, no tone for bridge, 6 screw bridge, traditional truss rod. The American Standard is more modern with its 22 frets, 2 point bridge, delta tone pots, tone for bridge, staggered tuners, bi flex truss rod, micro tilt.

There are other MIMs that come from the factory with tone for the bridge, its just a matter of models.


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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:47 am
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John Browning was a genius in the realm of gun design, but many of his designs have been improved upon in the 80-90 years since his death. What works for 1911 might not work so well for 2011. Yet there is still a market for those who wish to have a gun like grandpa carried "back in the day." The same holds true for a guitar designed in 1953. This takes nothing away from the genius of either John Browning or Leo Fender.


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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 9:23 am
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candycoke09 wrote:
John Browning was a genius in the realm of gun design, but many of his designs have been improved upon in the 80-90 years since his death. What works for 1911 might not work so well for 2011. Yet there is still a market for those who wish to have a gun like grandpa carried "back in the day." The same holds true for a guitar designed in 1953. This takes nothing away from the genius of either John Browning or Leo Fender.


Excellent simile!

Arjay (with several "tweaked" 1911's......)

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 9:53 am
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Yes, excellent candycoke09!

The same is true for both the 1911 and the 1954, you can improve/modernize the functions, but the designs are timeless classics that are just as relevant today as back then. Nothing feels like a 1911 style pistol, or a 1954 style Strat, in your hands, and both are equally equipped to handle their respective jobs as well as, or better than, anything else.

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 1:37 pm
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[quote="adey"]Wow, tough crowd. Why flame the guy?

Antique v modern amps not withstanding (though I take the point there), I think he's right. The average strat bridge pickup IS the one that benefits most from some top end reduction.

Because its what forum trolls do. Sit online so they can "inform" people they're wrong on some irreivent topic. 7500 posts in 16 months. Must have corrected a lot of people.


Last edited by windwalker9649 on Sat Aug 06, 2011 8:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 6:06 am
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CAFeathers wrote:
It is a very simple fix. I usually put the Neck and Bridge on the same Tone Control. Put a jumper from the empty lug (lug 1) on your 5 way switch to Lug 3.


+1
Did this myself. Works fine.

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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:38 am
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If that whole amp not being about to react to that frequency, and thats why they didnt put the tone control for the bridge pickup; why did every other electric out at the time have one? Les Pauls had tone knobs for their bridge pickup, and thats one people rarely feel the need to turn down.


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Post subject: Re: The secret for having tone on bridge pickup in Strat
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:40 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
windwalker9649 wrote:
Yeah, its holding onto nostalgia, but its dumb......I believe this was just a mistake from the beginning to not connect the bridge pickup to the tone pot, its the one pickup that benefits from a tone control the most.


Clueless again.

"Back in the day" when the Stratocaster made its initial debut the tweed Fender amps were not capable of or intended to reproduce the higher frequencies as the amps of today do. Their alnico Jensen speakers leveled out at around 3kHz and were pretty much done above 3.75kHz. Thus, the bridge pickup on a Strat sounded quite pleasant "without need for further tone modification". If you were half the genius that Leo was, we'd all be playing "windwalker" guitars and amps.

Arjay


Jesus 7500 posts in 16 months??? Get out much?


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