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Post subject: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:38 am
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Is it a myth that the number of pieces of wood a guitar is made out of affects tone?


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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:48 pm
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Absolutely.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:02 pm
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That's a good question. And an innocent question. In the past, the question of whether or not wood affects tone cause some of the posters on this forum to forget their manners.

Yes, the number of pieces affects tone. As does the type of wood. It's good for the wood to resonate. Whenever vibrations come to a glue joint, the vibration is diminished.

It would save the makers of premium guitars...American Fender, PRS, Gibson, etc., a WHOLE lot of money to use lesser woods with a lot of laminations. They could get the wood for close to free, and simply glue it into larger slabs where the labor is cheap. But they don't. Good tone woods, and 3 or fewer body pieces make a difference. The top manufacturers will tell you how hard it is to get good tone woods at a reasonable price. And they would tell you why they do it. And they'd tell you large pieces, for one, two, or three piece bodies are essential for good tone.

The question may come up as to why wood makes a difference. Past threads have covered this, so if you're interested, the search function will be useful.


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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:33 pm
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Looks like we have a difference of opinion here... myth or not? I personally don't think a glue joint is going to stop tone. The average glue joint is microscopically thin. JMHO, based on 45 years of serious woodworking.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:40 pm
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For exactly the reason that vibrations cannot travel through glue joining pieces of lumber properly. (never mind coming back to affect the string because all the pickup sees is how the string moves). It cannot travel and pass back through the nut and bridge to affect the string on a electric guitar.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:49 pm
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The pieces are clamped together very tightly when they are glued and the joint is stronger than the wood itself. Different pieces of the same kind of wood will have very slight variations in density and grain so I imagine a multiple piece body might deliver a tone that is closer to average for that wood but that's just my speculation. The wood does slightly affect the string but it does not have any affect on the pickups. Others will tell you tha mounting a pickup solidly to the body makes a difference in tone. That is incorrect because wood is non-magnetic. If a difference is perceived the only factor that could possibly contribute would be the difference in the mass of the body that disappears during the cavity routing process. If it were true that glue stops tone then all guitars with bodies of 2 or more pieces would be toneless.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:57 pm
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***how many pieces is my american standard body?


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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:05 pm
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I just picked up my acoustic guitar and plucked the open wound E string quite strongly. I could feel the vibration as strongly on the sides and back as I could on the spruce top. The sides and back are connected to the strings and the soundboard (top) only through glue joints. Further the bridge itself which anchors the strings and is also a buffer between the saddle and the top is mounted to the top with a glue joint. I'm not a physicist as far as my occupation but I do enjoy physics as a hobby. It's the study of how things work. At first glance it would seem that my plucked E home experiment seems to indicate glue joints do not form a vibrational barrier.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:17 pm
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I don't think the same can be applyed between an acoustic and a solid body guitar.


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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:22 pm
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BMW-KTM, I think the reason our acoustic guitars vibrate so strongly is due much to the vibrating column of air in the guitar. The sides and back respond to the air moving.

I have two wonderful Godin 5th Avenue acoustics for jazz. They sound very warm and loud, but there is an increase in volume when I play A 5th fret 1st string or D, 10th fret. Those notes are louder and sustain longer. That has a lot to do with the volume and shape of the airbox bringing out these 'wolf notes' like the old Stradivarius violins did. These are a bonus for those who love the key of D, but move up one fret and the effect is gone. Similarly, unplugged, my Strat Pluses sound louder strummed due to the bathtub routing under the pickguard with more air to resonate than my older American Standards with the smaller SSS rout.

I think in the case of acoustics the type of wood adds some colour to the sound, but moving air sets it in motion.

I love physics myself, and ponder this alot. If I'm wrong, please set me straight! I want to know as much as anyone!


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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:33 pm
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cnsky54 wrote:
.........


Take this experiment please sir. Take a electric solidbody guitar, unplugged. Rest the headstock on a tabletop, play a note. Do the same but without resting the guitar headstock on a tabletop. Compare that unplugged and amplified. Notice any difference?

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:35 pm
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Alas, work day and not near a guitar. You have my curiosity aroused...


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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:42 pm
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I hope so.

It's through the opinions of others and the testing done by others that we're encouraged to grow.

In your own good time sir.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:44 pm
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Without a doubt.

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Post subject: Re: affect of the number of pieces of wood?
Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:23 pm
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cnsky54 wrote:
BMW-KTM, I think the reason our acoustic guitars vibrate so strongly is due much to the vibrating column of air in the guitar. The sides and back respond to the air moving.

I have two wonderful Godin 5th Avenue acoustics for jazz. They sound very warm and loud, but there is an increase in volume when I play A 5th fret 1st string or D, 10th fret. Those notes are louder and sustain longer. That has a lot to do with the volume and shape of the airbox bringing out these 'wolf notes' like the old Stradivarius violins did. These are a bonus for those who love the key of D, but move up one fret and the effect is gone. Similarly, unplugged, my Strat Pluses sound louder strummed due to the bathtub routing under the pickguard with more air to resonate than my older American Standards with the smaller SSS rout.

I think in the case of acoustics the type of wood adds some colour to the sound, but moving air sets it in motion.

I love physics myself, and ponder this alot. If I'm wrong, please set me straight! I want to know as much as anyone!

Yes, air is absolutely a factor in acoustic guitars. The other major factor is the thickness (or more importantly, the thin-ness) of the top wood and the thickness (and shaping) of the bracing but the confined air and the interior reflective surfaces are the reason the sound chamber can act as an amplifier but the wood is definitely part of the tone and i think Niki's table top experiment goes a long way to show that vibrations can in fact transfer from one piece of wood to another even without a mass of air reverberating next to the wood. There is no glue involved in Niki's experiment so I suppose the question of glue being a vibrational barrier has not been difinitively answered by the two home experiments, his and mine but I think the fact that 2, 3 and 4 piece solid bodies still resonate at all is enough of an indication that the glue is not a significant hindrance. As a matter of fact dried wood glue is quite hard. Definitely harder than the wood itself.

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