Hey Guys...hoping you can help me out.
Got an American Special with the stock tuners....they work ok..but I much prefer the locking tuners on my American Deluxe (stock on that guitar).

So in doing some research, I've found some comments about the Deluxe Locking Tuners as being "staggered"...and after looking at the specs on my guitar, it doesn't appear that the tuners on mine are "staggered".

So does this mean that the deluxe locking tuners won't work on my guitar. I would be a shame, cause I really like the convenience and tuning stability of locking tuners. If it turns out that they don't work on the Amer. Specials, can anyone recommend locking tuners that will?

BTW....I did do a quick search on this forum for some answers, but nothing popped immediately...so I do apologize if this has been covered.
Any info you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks Guys,
Todd

Mate if their is a particular tuner that you like, then use it.

Myself I don't see any benefit of staggered height tuners. They don't fully cure the problem they were designed to sort out. They just don't provide enough down pressure on the string to create a good break angle over the nut. Locking tuners don't really improve stability over a well wound on string onto any tuner. They are just easier and faster the restring in a emergency.
That is just my opinion though. I have guitars with all three types and I prefer the vintage slotted top tuners. If you prefer staggered height locking tuners, then use em. It's your life and your guitar. You may as well be happy with it.

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No no and no

+1

I put vintage Kluson repros on everything I've built. Never a problem with them.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY

Thanks guys...I think that you misunderstood my post, however. I wasn't asking if there's a benefit to locking vs. non-locking (or staggered vs. non-staggered)....What I'm asking is, what specifically does it mean to be staggered? From your replies, it seems to be something that is optional, and not something that determines whether or not a tuner will work on a particular guitar...is that accurate?
So once again....what does it mean to be staggered...and could you provide an example of a staggered type tuner vs. non-staggered?
Thanks again...much appreciated.

Todd

OK...so after a little more searching, I found this thread:

http://www.fender.com/community/forums/ ... 5f7456f090

So now that I understand the difference, this begs a few questions...1st) does fender make locking tuners that are not staggered (like the tuners on my Amer. Special)...and 2nd) if not, can these be installed on a guitar that didn't originally come with them..and if so, does this mean I don't need the string trees?

Thanks again

Todd

You say faster and easier in an emergency. I think faster and easier anytime you change your strings. I put staggered Fender Schaller locking tuners on all of my guitars and really like what they do.

I have been wanting to try the GuitarFetish.com Gotoh staggered locking tuners, but I have not seen or heard any feedback on them. So, if you have used them, please post on this thread. I would love to read about them.

TJ

Staggered locking tuners seek to have 2 advantages. They lock the string on to the tuning peg of course, and this can help achieve great tuning stability - especially if you use your trem hard and like big string bends. But really, as Nikki says, a well wound string on an ordinary tuner is virtually as good. I actually use very few winds, but make sure the string tightens over it's own end, effectively locking it. I get fantastic results this way.

The other solution staggered tuners offer, is to pull the string down lower on to the tuner. This increases the break angle of the string over the nut and should ensure a good tone, without the need of the dreaded string trees. But they rarely work out that way. I've used 2 types - Sperzels and Wilkinsons, but I've still needed at least one of the string trees (often both) in order to get enough of a string break angle over the nut. This makes them redundant as far as I can see.

Nevertheless, my 2 fave strats both have locking staggered Sperzels and I can wang my trem arm all day without having to tweak the tuning. But another of my Strats doesn't have them, and it's almost (but not quite) as stable. So I guess they're not strictly necessary on a well set up and maintained guitar.

If you've got them, use them. But if you haven't, I'd put the money on a hand cut super slippy nut (tusque/teflon). More advantages all round.

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Fender Highway & Classic 60s Strats, Fender Toronado, Telecaster, Gretsch Projet, Charvel 3, PRS SE Soapbar II & Custom 24, Burns Batwing and many others!

Adey, Most guitars these days come with a plasticky nut. I always change out the nut. I use bone myself, it just sounds good and my tech is particularly good with it. I think if staggered tuners are readily available at no extra charge, then why not get them. They make replacing strings much faster with the locking mechanism. I am really wanting to hear about the Gotoh staggered locking tuners from GFS, because if they are good, I will put them on all future guitars.

TJ

With you all the way tjnugent (you're not Ted are you? if you are, keep the hell away from my pets).

When I budget for a guitar, I always assume that it going to cost an extra £40. That's because I know the stock nut is going to be pulled out and replaced by my Tech. And that's what he charges. And I don't begrudge it. The strings really ring out of a good solid nut and I'm not driven mad trying to keep the tuning stable. Oh, and an extra £1 for a tube of lip salve which lubricates the string trees.

I have a guitar with a bone nut and it's great, but my preference is for Tusque (artificial ivory) which is as hard and sliipier than teflon. Goodbye to tuning hassles and hello twang!

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Fender Highway & Classic 60s Strats, Fender Toronado, Telecaster, Gretsch Projet, Charvel 3, PRS SE Soapbar II & Custom 24, Burns Batwing and many others!

Adey, No, I am not the Rock Star Ted Nugent, I am the weekend warrior from Tennessee Ted Nugent. I go by TJ though... always have. I respect your choice and if I didn't already have bone on all my guitars I would go with a Graphtech nut as well. I am going to try it on my next acquisition, which I have not picked yet, though I have a feeling it will be a Classic Vibe 50's Strat in White with the anodized gold pick guard and a maple neck. For some reason I lust for that guitar... I love the anodized gold pick guard. I will try it on that one. I am in the process of finishing up on all the mods to my current guitars. I have set a rule that I will not get another guitar until everything that I intend to do on the ones I have are completed. I hate having big gaps of time from when I start a refurb and finish. Though money is always a factor. I have a bent for Seymour Duncan Antiquity Pickups and they cost $260 for a Strat set and $180 for a Tele set. So, that is where I really get slowed down. Ahhh but I love when I finally get one completely finished and it is top notch and sounds amazing. The CV 60's Strat I just finished blows me away on the tone and how well it stays in tune. It rings in every position on the neck. It inspires me to play better and more.

Cheers,

TJ

PS. I am a pet lover as well. I have 3 cats....

TJ you're a man after my own heart. Hand cut nuts, Seymour Duncan Antiquity p/ups, pressing all my buttons.

Fair play if you're in a Ted Nugent act, I just hope that you're not going deaf and can continue to enjoy the tonal delights of your (our) excellent guitar mods!

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Fender Highway & Classic 60s Strats, Fender Toronado, Telecaster, Gretsch Projet, Charvel 3, PRS SE Soapbar II & Custom 24, Burns Batwing and many others!

TJ

Yeah mate you're absolutely correct, everytime you change strings.

I do have to make a point on Adey's 'tuning stability' point. ONLY because I have no problems with tuning stability on any tuner. Yes I go trem crazy at times. Then again it takes me longer to restring a set of vintage tuners than it does a set of locking. I have to pay more attention and have this weird thing going on with my right hand where I keep the string taught and pressed down just infront of the tuner. To make sure the winds are really neat.


Anyways off to the soldering iron and the drill. See ya later guys.

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No no and no

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Your guitar is fine the way it is. it has 2 string tree's that will give you the correct brake angle. Guitars with the staggered tuners only have one string tree, because the tuners for the D and G strings have a shorter stem which will give you the correct break angle for those two strings. I prefer the non-staggered tuners because the D string bottoms out on the stem with the correct amount of winding with the staggered tuners.

Also, 99.9% of tuning issues when using the trem are caused by the strings sticking in the nut. The other 0.1% are caused by some kind of issue with something else on the guitar.

I just got an American Special a week ago. It would not stay tuned with the bridge floating, so I put a Graphtech nut on it, and now it stays in tune fine when using the trem.

What it comes down to for you is the convenience of being able to change the strings quickly with locking tuners.