While playing my American Standard Stratocaster through a Blues Jr. NOS today, I was searching for a better tone/sound. I turned the gain knob and volume knob on the amp to 10 and backed off the volume on the guitar. I feel that it sounded much better this way. I had never played under these conditions before. Is this a standard method of playing? Have others found this to be a better way of getting the tone/sound you are looking for?

Sorry for my ignorance. Thanks for any input.

There are absolutely no rules my friend. Its all up to you how you want to hear it... Experimentation is half the fun in the pursuit of tone.

Bill

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Hey, Boy Blue is back!

+1

That said, I'll frequently dime a smaller amp like a Princeton Reverb or a Vibro Champ then "drive the bus" via the guitar's volume control. It's a lotta fun, as many discover.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY

Hi Patrick0815: like Bill says, no rules. Do what sounds best.

What you are doing is setting your rig flat out which runs all the tubes as hot as they will go, and then only delivering a small amount of signal from the guitar to keep the final volume at humane levels. Nuttin' wrong with that at all, though you may find it uses your tubes up a bit faster.

Though if you're wanting quite this much crunch from your Blues Junior I'm wondering whether putting a blues-type drive pedal in front of it might be another way for you to go.

Just for comparison, here's how I and some others do it. Set the guitar's volume to around 6 - 7. Then on a master volume (volume and gain controls) amp like yours, balance the gain against the volume control to get the level of front-end grunt you like. In your case it sounds like that is going to be with the gain wide open, so then the amp's volume knob is used to set the final output.

Myself, I'd set that gain so that the amp is just at "breaking point"; that is, single note lines sound clean while aggressive double stopping is just kicking the amp into overdrive.

From this point you can then drive the amp from the guitar. Turning the guitar volume lower will clean the sound up, so you can play chords without distortion muddying the tone. Turning the volume higher from that 6 position adds dirt, to the point you even have a bit of crunch on single notes.

Some people feel that running the rig from the guitar is the "grown up" way to do it, but once again: no rules. I know others who leave everything wide open on the guitar and make all their adjustments at the amp. Or pedals. We do whatever works for us.

Cheers - C

PS Hopefully Nikininja will look in shortly and say useful things about pre-amps and power stages. Take the scientific conclusions of that fella's ears seriously: he knows...

It's odd how 20 people can look at the same scene and each see something different. It occurs to me you may very likely be the sort of chap who might fall into the "Vintage" crowd. I say that because in essence what you learned in your little experiment is that you do NOT prefer HOT pickups even though you may like lots of tube saturation. One thing you can do right now to move in that direction is to lower your pickup height. One full rotation of each screw would be a good place to start.

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Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.

I find with my Blues Jr. putting the treble and mids on 6 1/2 and the bass on 8 1/2 turning the volume on 12 and the master on 2- 3 you can get a real gutsy blues sound and if you hit the fat switch it gets real raunchy.

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'65 Strat,65 Mustang,65 Jaguar,4 more Strats,3 vintage Vox guitars,5 Vox amps,'69 Bassman with a '68 2-15 Bassman cab,36 guitars total-15asst'd amps total,2 vintage '60s Hammond organs & a myriad of effects-with a few rare vintage ones.

Thanks to everyone who responded to this post. All of the information has proven very helpful.

Like BMW-KTM noted, I am more of a "Vintage" type musician. That being said, I am considering ditching the Blues Jr. NOS for either the Vintage Reissue '65 Princeton Reverb or the Vintage Reissue '65 Deluxe Reverb. I am leaning toward the Princeton because I feel that the Deluxe would be too loud for home use.

Now that I have caught on to this new way of using the volume knob on the guitar, the gain knob on the Blues Jr. doesn't seem as necessary.

Thanks for any additional input that you can give to help me with this decision.

DRRI is not that much louder than the BJ at home, since you already had it turned up... you will achieve that tone and even sweeter tones from the DRRI, you will not be sorry. It's a completely different experience! It is a bit louder but it's also a fuller sound that cuts well if you're playing with a band.

I'm not saying that the Princeton is not a great amp, it's like the DRRI's little brother. Both will get you a nice vintage tone. Personally I prefer the sound of 12" vs 10".

The PRRI's tremolo is unlike that of any other Fender re-issue amp currently made. Most use the opto-isolator which gates a dedicated pre-amp tube in the vibrato channel on and off to create the effect. However, the Princeton's tremolo is a bias-modulation circuit which acts on the power tubes at the output stage. The difference is both significant and dramatic. The opto-isolator type effect is somewhat harsh and clipped while the "bias-wiggle" circuit produces a pleasantly warmer pulsating throb. This can be heard quite plainly on many tracks by Credence Clearwater Revival ("Born On The Bayou", "Midnight Special", "Heard It Through The Grapevine", etc)

(if anybody cares about tremolo, that is)

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY

Hi Arjay: we care!

Cheers - C

I am considering ditching the Blues Jr. NOS for either the Vintage Reissue '65 Princeton Reverb or the Vintage Reissue '65 Deluxe Reverb. I am leaning toward the Princeton because I feel that the Deluxe would be too loud for home use.
[/quote]

Do a search on the site, and see if you can find a SINGLE INSTANCE of any of these very well equipped posters dissing a Deluxe Reverb Reissue. Bottom Line: it is almost 100% love.

Armed with that recommendation, I looked for some time, and finally bought a used Guitar Center DRRI for a good price. And it is MORE than anyone in here states. It is, frankly, perfect (IIIFFFFFFFF you do not want an overdriven metal/grunge/distorted sound; and then, maybe a pedal could do that too).

Retroverbial has taken up the mantle of resident amp guru extraordinaire (have you seen the pics of his stuff?). His comments on the PRRI should sway you very influentially if Tremolo/Vibrato (just which one is correct anyway?) is very important to you. Because, the only flaw that is sticking in my craw about the DRRI is that ticking/pulsing/fluttering opto-isolator sound, even when nothing is going thru the amp.

[Aside to Retroverbial (can I call you Arjay?): Is that pulsing "normal"; and how loud before it is actually in need of repair? And...... what was the tremolo Fogerty used if it was a solid state Kustom amp?]

Bob in California (but you can call me ....................................................................................................................................................... Bob)

LOLOL

Thanks, Bob (I think.....)



The "trem tick" you mention does not afflict every Fender amp (vintage or re-issue) but I'm not sure why. I do know that somebody recently developed a "cure" that involved adding a suppression cap to the screen of the oscillator tube (generally V5 in a dual-channel combo amp with reverb). If I find that info again I'll pass it along.

The Fogerty's did indeed play Kustoms in concert (Stu Clifford favored the Kustom heads with Sunn cabs). But in the studio, John was fond of a blackface Princeton Reverb and -- periodically -- a silverface Vibrolux Reverb. I saw them once in their earlier guise as "The Golliwogs" at an outdoor event in SF and they played a mix of Fender and Standel (likely rented gear since many of the other acts used similar non-familiar equipment).

HTH

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY

Turning the amp up and the tone controls down makes me happy.

good stuff arjay

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"Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present."

oogway, kungfu panda 2008

Interesting stuff about the Fogertys and the Fenders in the studio, but Kustom in concert. Makes alotta sense, because the Tremolo is just so pure on the records. Thanks for the info Arjay.

Also, there is some stuff on the net about soldering a cap (I dunno, is that a capacitor?) in the opto-isolater circuit to "bleed" off the noise. Don't think I'd trust anyone to do that right. There was also some dude who was making opto-isolaters with an LED light instead of the neon one that is in there, but I couldn't find anything, and again, it sounds like soldering. Some folks recommended electrical tape around a light leaking opto-isolater but not sure how to do that if it is mounted. And finally, there are some who solved it by moving the lead dress (whatever that is). Note: I might sound like I know what I'm talking about here, but I am just taking the info from the net. I actually have not a clue.

Bottom Line: I'll live with it, unless it starts to have a loud mind of its own. And then it would be off to someone who actually might have a clue.

Your advice is what is important here, Arjay. If you want the best Tremolo, get the Princeton. My lame adjunct is: if you are getting the DRRI, and you're going to play the Tremolo, find an amp that does not make this noise.

Bob