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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:59 am
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Xhefri wrote:
Graon wrote:
Toppscore wrote:
Question, NY & Xhefri. Is not an "E4xxxxxx" serial number for 1984????
PLMK. It is important as I study Fender guitars and serial numbers.


E4###### can be between 1984 and 1998 (included) except 1985 and 1986 because CBS sold the company during 1985 and I was told that only vintage models (V######) were made in 1986... if I'm not wrong.

The E4 serial number was used from 1987-1989 depending on the guitar. I do not think Fender used these on the Vintage reissues, but that is an area I have not studied much. Many of the 1987 and later Plus models will have a serial number that says one thing and the date in the neck pocket in the body or on the butt end of neck that says something different. Some have said this was due to the use of parts left over from the CBS buyout, or even serial number decals left over from CBS. The very first Plus' will have an E4XXXXX serial number indicating they are from 1984. Truth is, it is a 1987 and as late as early 89. Production for the Plus Series started in mid-1987



When you type a serial number E4##### at http://www.guitardaterproject.org/fender.aspx it gives you :

"Guitar Info
Your guitar was made at the
Fullerton or Corona Plant (Fender), USA
in the Year(s): 1984 - 1988 "

About Corona:

"Fender: Corona
Corona factory was opened in 1985, Corona California, with major guitar production starting in 1987. With the addition of a custom shop in 1987 the plant currently employs about 700 workers. Apart from general and Custom Shop Fender instruments and amplifiers, it also encompasses Guild acoustic & electric guitars."

On http://www.fender.com/fr-FR/support/art ... uct-dating website:

E3 + 5 digits
E4 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1984
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)


CBS sold Fender in March 1985. Serial numbering didn’t change because instruments continued to be made using existing tooling, parts and serial number schemes.

SERIAL NUMBERS PRODUCTION DATES
E3 + 5 digits
E4 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1985
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1986
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)
E4 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1987
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)
E4 + 5 digits
E8 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1988
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)

So E4##### is clearly between 1984 and 1988 without 1986 (where there were only vintage models)


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:09 am
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Graon wrote:
When you type a serial number E4##### at http://www.guitardaterproject.org/fender.aspx it gives you :

"Guitar Info
Your guitar was made at the
Fullerton or Corona Plant (Fender), USA
in the Year(s): 1984 - 1988 "

About Corona:

"Fender: Corona
Corona factory was opened in 1985, Corona California, with major guitar production starting in 1987. With the addition of a custom shop in 1987 the plant currently employs about 700 workers. Apart from general and Custom Shop Fender instruments and amplifiers, it also encompasses Guild acoustic & electric guitars."

On http://www.fender.com/fr-FR/support/art ... uct-dating website:

E3 + 5 digits
E4 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1984
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)


CBS sold Fender in March 1985. Serial numbering didn’t change because instruments continued to be made using existing tooling, parts and serial number schemes.

SERIAL NUMBERS PRODUCTION DATES
E3 + 5 digits
E4 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1985
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1986
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)
E4 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1987
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)
E4 + 5 digits
E8 + 5 digits
V + 4, 5 or 6 digits (U.S. Vintage Series except ’52 Telecaster) 1988
(For U.S. Vintage Series, check neck date for specific year)

So E4##### is clearly between 1984 and 1988 without 1986 (where there were only vintage models)


True, but you just can't go by these guitar dating sites, even Fender's own dating site. For those of us who were around back then - I can attest that I never, ever saw a Fender Strat or Tele in 1984 that had an "E4xxxxx" serial number. Every one of those Standard and Elite model guitars I saw at say 4 different Fender dealers in Louisville KY, Lexington KY, and Cincinnati OH all carried "E3xxxxx" serial numbers. That includes guitars I watched being unboxed, and the really wacky, rare, and now worth quite a bit "bowling ball" finish (a finish that was later popularized by Steve Vai and Ibanez as a "swirl finish) Standard Strats and Teles that were only made in 1984.

Now there are a few around that happened to get "E4xxxxx" serial number decals - there was a photo of a Standard Strat (and when I use "Standard Strat" I am referring to the 2-knob model with the top-loading Free Flyte trem that were only made in 1983 and 1984) with an "E4xxxxx" serial number. On the other hand I have seen photos of more American Standards (some Strats and actually more Teles than Strats) with "E3xxxxx" serial numbers than I have seen Standard and Elites with "E4xxxxx".

In checking neck dates you will find that the earliest Corona production of the reissues was in October 1985 and you will find the earliest neck dates on an American Standard in October 1986. I don't believe these 1986-dated, "E4xxxxx" labeled American Standards were pre-production models, I just think Fender put them into production so they them available to sell immeditately after they announced them as production models at the January 1987 NAMM show. They were shown as prototypes at the Summer 1986 NAMM show (I no longer have the Guitar Player magazine with that rundown where they showed photos of the prototypes so I don't remember if Summer NAMM that year was in June or July). It is also possible that Fender did a "soft launch" by sending some American Standards out to some dealers (kind of a test for manufacturing and distribution) right before Christmas 1986 since they had already shown the prototypes.

The guitar dating sites, including Fender's own site, have to cover all possibilities; given how Fender has historically handled serial numbers there are always anomalies.


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:25 am
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Hi, John C.
Is the following link:
http://www.fender.com/support/articles/u-s-instruments-product-dating
The Fender site for serial numbers you are referring?

Are there other "Fender" links or sites by "Fender" for Fender serial numbers?
I know of many sites that have Fender serial number info, but have not
used Fender as a source.

Does Fender have a link or site for amplifier serial numbers?

Thanks. Toppscore

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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:24 pm
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Toppscore wrote:
Hi, John C.
Is the following link:
http://www.fender.com/support/articles/u-s-instruments-product-dating
The Fender site for serial numbers you are referring?

Are there other "Fender" links or sites by "Fender" for Fender serial numbers?
I know of many sites that have Fender serial number info, but have not
used Fender as a source.

Does Fender have a link or site for amplifier serial numbers?

Thanks. Toppscore


Actually Fender has updated their site and it's pretty good - all that is missing from it is that very, very few "E4" numbers were used during 1984 and a few "E3" numbers made their way onto some of the very early American Standard models.

There are other serial number dating sites like guitardaterproject that aren't as up-to-date as Fender's own site.

In over 30 years of hanging around shops and mostly being into Fender (or at least Fender-style) instruments I've found that as soon as anyone - myself included - says "this is the hard-and-fast rule" about Fender serial numbers somone else will come up with an anomaly.

Here's a good example - I still own my "first good guitar"; it is a 1979 Fender Lead II. I know it is a 1979; I even have the original recipt for it from November 1979. And it has an "E0xxxxx" serial number, which all the dating sites (including Fender's own site) will say that it is a 1980 guitar. Well it isn't unless it's also a time machine. Personally I think that since the Lead series came out in the fall of 1979 Fender didn't bother putting "S9xxxxx" serial numbers on the production models; the only ones I ever seen with "S9xxxxx" serial numbers are the Lead I and Lead II use for the photo shoot of the original magazine ad for them.

Regarding Fender amps - I don't think there is a serial number site for Fender amps. There was a site called the Fender Amp Field Guide but it is just specs, not serial numbers. Also it hasn't been updated since 2007.


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:06 pm
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John C wrote:
Toppscore wrote:
Hi, John C. Is the following link:
http://www.fender.com/support/articles/u-s-instruments-product-dating
The Fender site for serial numbers you are referring? Are there other "Fender" links or sites by "Fender" for Fender serial numbers? I know of many sites that have Fender serial number info, but have not used Fender as a source. Does Fender have a link or site for amplifier serial numbers? Thanks. Toppscore
Actually Fender has updated their site and it's pretty good - all that is missing from it is that very, very few "E4" numbers were used during 1984 and a few "E3" numbers made their way onto some of the very early American Standard models. There are other serial number dating sites like guitardaterproject that aren't as up-to-date as Fender's own site. In over 30 years of hanging around shops and mostly being into Fender (or at least Fender-style) instruments I've found that as soon as anyone - myself included - says "this is the hard-and-fast rule" about Fender serial numbers somone else will come up with an anomaly. Here's a good example - I still own my "first good guitar"; it is a 1979 Fender Lead II. I know it is a 1979; I even have the original recipt for it from November 1979. And it has an "E0xxxxx" serial number, which all the dating sites (including Fender's own site) will say that it is a 1980 guitar. Well it isn't unless it's also a time machine. Personally I think that since the Lead series came out in the fall of 1979 Fender didn't bother putting "S9xxxxx" serial numbers on the production models; the only ones I ever seen with "S9xxxxx" serial numbers are the Lead I and Lead II use for the photo shoot of the original magazine ad for them. Regarding Fender amps - I don't think there is a serial number site for Fender amps. There was a site called the Fender Amp Field Guide but it is just specs, not serial numbers. Also it hasn't been updated since 2007.


HELLO!!!!
Where can I get some help understanding the
1993 40th Anniversary Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars
1996 50th Anniversary Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars

Which ones actually shipped and did not ship?

What are differences between
the standard Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars (vs) the anniversary Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars models?

Were there Fender American Standard Stratocasters that shipped from Fender with
Lace Sensors, LSRs & bridges that looked like Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars, but weren't.

Thanks, for any and all to share and comment.

I will do some research myself on the 40th & 50th anniversary models and
which Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars were celebrated and which ones were not.

Toppscore 8)

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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:05 am
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How many times...


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:28 am
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Well I do appreciate someone who is willing to learn about the history of Fender models so I'll take a crack at answering these for you:

Toppscore wrote:
HELLO!!!!
Where can I get some help understanding the
1993 40th Anniversary Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars

Which ones actually shipped and did not ship?


Actually the 40th Anniversary of the Strat was 1994, not 1993. Fender didn't do anything at all with the Strat Plus/Plus Deluxe/Ultras for the 40th Anniversary of the Strat in 1994.

Fender's "40th Anniversary Strat" for 1994 was the Amercian Standard Strat with a specially engraved neck plate and a small metal badge on the front of the headstock. Spec-wise these were the same as either 1993 or 1995 American Standards (although Fender went back to the vintage style logo on all USA guitars in 1995). I believe they also had a limited number Custom Shop guitar - if I'm remembering correctly that one was a blinged-out guitar based on '54 specs.

Toppscore wrote:
1996 50th Anniversary Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars

Which ones actually shipped and did not ship?


1996 was the 50th Anniversary of the founding of the Fender company in 1946 and all Fenders made that year got the round "50th Anniversary of Fender" medallion on the back of the headstock. Therefore all Strat Plus/Plus Deluxe/Ultra guitars made during the calendar year of 1996 had the medallion on the back of the headstock. However, these were not special editions of the Strat Plus/Plus Deluxe/Ultra; they were just the regular models with the medallion on the back of the headtock.

The only USA "50th Anniversary of Fender" models were based on the American Standards but they had a maple top, a unique sunburst color, and gold hardware. Again - no special models for the Strat Plus/Plus Deluxe/Ultra.


Toppscore wrote:
Were there Fender American Standard Stratocasters that shipped from Fender with
Lace Sensors, LSRs & bridges that looked like Plus/PlusDeluxe/Ultra guitars, but weren't.


For one year -1989 if I'm remembering correctly - Fender had an "American Standard Deluxe" Strat that had the gold logo Lace Sensor set like the Strat Plus but it did not have a roller nut (which would have been the Wilkinson at that time), locking tuners, or Trem-Setter found on the Strat Plus. Of course the Strat Plus used the same bridge as the American Standard. That was the only time during that era that an American Standard had any of the features found on the Strat Plus/Plus Deluxe/Ultra models.


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:56 am
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davidwhitson wrote:
How many times...

David. What do you mean? Please expand.
Are you commenting on my requests about anniversary Fender guitars?
PLMK. Thank you.

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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:46 am
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Hi, John C. Thanks for your great response.

If I read your response correctly,
ALL 1996 Fender Guitars got a 50th Anniversary Sticker on the headstock backside. Right?

Therefore, any 1996 Fender Guitar w/50th Anniversary sticker is not special in any way? Correct?

Please double check the below active EBay links and let me know if they are
legit Plus Deluxe guitars, and not Standards or Pluses converted to Plus Deluxe.
Also, the two 1996 guitars did not have the 50th Anniversary stickers.


1996 FENDER STRATOCASTER STRAT DELUXE PLUS GUITAR BLUEBURST
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1996-FENDER-STRATOCASTER-STRAT-DELUXE-PLUS-GUITAR-BLUEBURST-USA-ORIGINAL-N-MINT-/370620053316?pt=Guitar&hash=item564aad3744
This Strat does not have the 50th Anniversary Sticker


1996 Fender Strat Deluxe Plus
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1996-Fender-Strat-Deluxe-Plus-Mint-Condition-w-OHSC-/170852879552?pt=Guitar&hash=item27c7a00cc0
This Strat does not have the 50th Anniversary Sticker


Fender Sratocaster Plus Deluxe USA + Hardshell Case
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fender-Sratocaster-Plus-Deluxe-USA-Hardshell-Case-/190684148011?pt=Guitar&hash=item2c65a9312b
Seller claims 1995/1996 with no 50th sticker and no lace sensors, they were replaced.
Title states plus/deluxe, listing description states Plus.
Did this start out as a Plus/Plus Deluxe?


Fender American Stratocaster Plus Deluxe 50th Anniversary Rare Color
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fender-American-Stratocaster-Plus-Deluxe-50th-Anniversary-Rare-Color-/110893296854?pt=Guitar&hash=item19d1c16cd6
Check out this guitar. Xhefri says wrong paint, is not a Deluxe Plus. It is a Standard. The Deluxe came with Blue/Silver/Red pickups, color is Electric Blue, bridge pickup has been changed

Thanks again. Toppscore

By the way, my 1990 Fender Ultra has arrived ~ will get some photos, later.

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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:07 pm
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You're welcome. Those "50th Anniversary of Fender" medallions were on all Fenders that were started, finished, and ready to be shipped out during the calendar year 1996. If the guitar was started too late in the year to be shipped out then it likely didn't have a medallion on the headstock.
It's a slow day here so I'm happy to oblige by looking at these:

Toppscore wrote:
1996 FENDER STRATOCASTER STRAT DELUXE PLUS GUITAR BLUEBURST
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1996-FENDER-STRATOCASTER-STRAT-DELUXE-PLUS-GUITAR-BLUEBURST-USA-ORIGINAL-N-MINT-/370620053316?pt=Guitar&hash=item564aad3744
This Strat does not have the 50th Anniversary Sticker


This is definitely a legit Strat Plus Deluxe in the blueburst finish. Maybe Xhefri can help out here - was that blueburst finish called "frost blue"?

At any rate - looking at that one's serial number of "N6200xxx" I suspect that if you pulled the neck off the date would be from early 1997. Remember, Fender uses up the decals so they don't typically transition to the next year on their first day back after the New Years Day holiday.

Toppscore wrote:
1996 Fender Strat Deluxe Plus
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1996-Fender-Strat-Deluxe-Plus-Mint-Condition-w-OHSC-/170852879552?pt=Guitar&hash=item27c7a00cc0
This Strat does not have the 50th Anniversary Sticker


The seller says it's a 1996 but it has an "N5xxxxx" serial number so it is likely a 1995 and therefore was likely completed before the anniversary year. Again we would have to see the neck dates or get the info from Fender to verify the actual completion or shipping date. If the seller is the original ower they likely bought the guitar in 1996 so they are calling it a "1996" without really checking the dates.

Toppscore wrote:

Fender Sratocaster Plus Deluxe USA + Hardshell Case
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fender-Sratocaster-Plus-Deluxe-USA-Hardshell-Case-/190684148011?pt=Guitar&hash=item2c65a9312b
Seller claims 1995/1996 with no 50th sticker and no lace sensors, they were replaced.
Title states plus/deluxe, listing description states Plus.
Did this start out as a Plus/Plus Deluxe?


The seller doesn't show the serial number so we have no idea if it is really a 1995 or a 1996, and you have no idea if it has the 1996 "50th Anniversary" medallion. Based on the trem it probably started life as a Strat Plus, so the description is correct but not the auction headline.


Toppscore wrote:

Fender American Stratocaster Plus Deluxe 50th Anniversary Rare Color
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fender-American-Stratocaster-Plus-Deluxe-50th-Anniversary-Rare-Color-/110893296854?pt=Guitar&hash=item19d1c16cd6
Check out this guitar. Xhefri says wrong paint, is not a Deluxe Plus. It is a Standard. The Deluxe came with Blue/Silver/Red pickups, color is Electric Blue, bridge pickup has been changed


I agree with Xhefri on this one - definitely didn't start life as a Strat Plus Deluxe. It was likely a Strat Plus that has been modded with a different pickguard, different bridge pickup, etc. I'm not sure if that color blue was available on the Strat Plus that year or if it was only on the American Standards, so this one could be a "mutt" with parts from several Fender guitars. It definitely isn't "frost blue" as frost blue was either the blueburst color like the first auction in your post or it was another darker color that had some silver around the edges. I just don't remember which of those colors was called "frost blue".


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:55 am
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Thanks, John C.

I am treading the waters checking out Hendrix Strats and
the Plus Deluxe Strats, as so many of both posted on EBay
are not legit, or have been modified.

Your's and Xhefri' work/shares have saved a bad buy by me, already.
Toppscore 8)

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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:22 pm
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John C wrote:
Graon wrote:

True, but you just can't go by these guitar dating sites, even Fender's own dating site. For those of us who were around back then - I can attest that I never, ever saw a Fender Strat or Tele in 1984 that had an "E4xxxxx" serial number. Every one of those Standard and Elite model guitars I saw at say 4 different Fender dealers in Louisville KY, Lexington KY, and Cincinnati OH all carried "E3xxxxx" serial numbers. That includes guitars I watched being unboxed, and the really wacky, rare, and now worth quite a bit "bowling ball" finish (a finish that was later popularized by Steve Vai and Ibanez as a "swirl finish) Standard Strats and Teles that were only made in 1984.


Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I have seen 3 or 4 1984 USA Strats with the E4 label, in fact I have an E4 neck with a June 1984 neck end date hanging in my basement right now.


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:01 pm
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mcmacguy wrote:
John C wrote:
Graon wrote:

True, but you just can't go by these guitar dating sites, even Fender's own dating site. For those of us who were around back then - I can attest that I never, ever saw a Fender Strat or Tele in 1984 that had an "E4xxxxx" serial number. Every one of those Standard and Elite model guitars I saw at say 4 different Fender dealers in Louisville KY, Lexington KY, and Cincinnati OH all carried "E3xxxxx" serial numbers. That includes guitars I watched being unboxed, and the really wacky, rare, and now worth quite a bit "bowling ball" finish (a finish that was later popularized by Steve Vai and Ibanez as a "swirl finish) Standard Strats and Teles that were only made in 1984.


Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I have seen 3 or 4 1984 USA Strats with the E4 label, in fact I have an E4 neck with a June 1984 neck end date hanging in my basement right now.


Pictures would be good. Fender did ship E4 during 1984 and later years.
Pictures of proof will help others rewrite their notes. Thanks for helping out.
Congratulations for owing an early guitar model. Toppscore 8)

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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:03 pm
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mcmacguy wrote:
John C wrote:
Graon wrote:

True, but you just can't go by these guitar dating sites, even Fender's own dating site. For those of us who were around back then - I can attest that I never, ever saw a Fender Strat or Tele in 1984 that had an "E4xxxxx" serial number. Every one of those Standard and Elite model guitars I saw at say 4 different Fender dealers in Louisville KY, Lexington KY, and Cincinnati OH all carried "E3xxxxx" serial numbers. That includes guitars I watched being unboxed, and the really wacky, rare, and now worth quite a bit "bowling ball" finish (a finish that was later popularized by Steve Vai and Ibanez as a "swirl finish) Standard Strats and Teles that were only made in 1984.


Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I have seen 3 or 4 1984 USA Strats with the E4 label, in fact I have an E4 neck with a June 1984 neck end date hanging in my basement right now.


Very true - this is why I also say "never say never" about Fender serial numbers during this time frame - they really were all over the place and as soon as you throw out a rule of thumb there will be something that refutes it. As I mentioned I've only seen "E3" numbers on these particular models and only ever saw one photo of these models with an "E4"; since you've seen more than I have seen (and even have one of the necks) I have to assume that there are more of them out there than I originally thought. Again - nothing is ever a hard and fast rule with Fender serial numbers, so Fender's "product dater" site has to cover all the bases.

It's always been my understanding that the Fender folks who apply the decals and the finish just grab stacks of them for their workbench and then put them back into a bin; they can be pretty random - which will account for things like there being some "E4" numbers actually being used in 1984 and that some "E3" numbers were left hanging around that were eventually used on American Standards in the late 1986-1988 time frame.


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Post subject: Re: Fans of Strat Plus and Strat Ultra
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 3:30 pm
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mcmacguy wrote:
John C wrote:
Graon wrote:
True, but you just can't go by these guitar dating sites, even Fender's own dating site. For those of us who were around back then - I can attest that I never, ever saw a Fender Strat or Tele in 1984 that had an "E4xxxxx" serial number. Every one of those Standard and Elite model guitars I saw at say 4 different Fender dealers in Louisville KY, Lexington KY, and Cincinnati OH all carried "E3xxxxx" serial numbers. That includes guitars I watched being unboxed, and the really wacky, rare, and now worth quite a bit "bowling ball" finish (a finish that was later popularized by Steve Vai and Ibanez as a "swirl finish) Standard Strats and Teles that were only made in 1984.


Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I have seen 3 or 4 1984 USA Strats with the E4 label, in fact I have an E4 neck with a June 1984 neck end date hanging in my basement right now.


Very true - this is why I also say "never say never" about Fender serial numbers during this time frame - they really were all over the place and as soon as you throw out a rule of thumb there will be something that refutes it. As I mentioned I've only seen "E3" numbers on these particular models and only ever saw one photo of these models with an "E4"; since you've seen more than I have seen (and even have one of the necks) I have to assume that there are more of them out there than I originally thought. Again - nothing is ever a hard and fast rule with Fender serial numbers, so Fender's "product dater" site has to cover all the bases. It's always been my understanding that the Fender folks who apply the decals and the finish just grab stacks of them for their workbench and then put them back into a bin; they can be pretty random - which will account for things like there being some "E4" numbers actually being used in 1984 and that some "E3" numbers were left hanging around that were eventually used on American Standards in the late 1986-1988 time frame.


IMHO and cannot be verified, Fender, being a public company, now/recently,
must have tighter controls for their inventory, accounting, service & marketing
departments.

So, Fender knows it has had a bad rap with parts, components and serial number
consistency, I declare that modern day Fender is and will be much better about
serial numbers and recording correct components in amps and guitars.

They have a history of sloppy performance, but, what does it take to change
the serial numbers on January 1st? Not much. No more Leo Fender saving a buck
at every turn of the production line.

What say you.
Toppscore 8)

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