Dear all.

I began playing guitar when i was 11. My heros throughout the years have been Hendrix and SRV,three kings,blues jazz etc etc.My first electric was an Aria Pro 2 which cost about $150. I played that thing constantly in my early teens.

When I was 16 I needed a new guiar. I got jobs in the summer everywhere i could to get the 1100 euro to buy a new stratocaster. (i grew up in Ireland). Washing dishes, working at sea on mussel rafts,mowing lawns - lots of low pay and hard work.

Well I only saved 550. My mom gave me 550 (which was a hell of a lot of money) and we went to the nearest city to buy the covetted Stratocaster.

Now, back home, they don't let 16 year olds play sratocasters untill you show up with an envelope of cash. I had my heart set on a tex mex or smth but the guy in the shop told me that what i really wanted was a standard 1100 irish pound stratocaster.(thats about $1500-2000) And he had to order it in...

Well in reality he was probably just out of stock, and the next week I picked up my stratocaster,my innocence still intact.

Playing it in the shop and there was serious fret buzz. But i was so excited to have a real life strat,just like jimi and stevie, I let the shop owner convince me all that was wrong was a little adjustment.

NOTE: fret buzz = anywhere and maybe everywhere,one string maybe all strings.

Cut forward now to 2 years later and I finally sorted out the action and the buzzing. probably 100 hours or more of adjusting. I had to get replacement allen keys becasue i wore out the ones that came with it. Did i know what I was doing? not really . But I learned. I also took it to a reliable guitar tech who had actually set up some of Rory Gallagher's guitars. (cork city). He told me that some fenders especially the new ones are just crap, overpriced and not worth the money. So I asked him to show me how to set p the guitar properly. And do you know what was funny? He didnt make any adjustments to the guitar. i had high action proper truss rod etc etc - and still minor buzzing - and thats when he played it too. He just said "that's how it goes".(intonation ws perfect etc)

So I would continue periodically going nuts and trying all kinds of things to make the fu*king thing not buzz. eventually i used crazy high action with a shim under the neck to give zero buzz and sore,sometimes torn finger tips. i also tried every guage under the sun,even using acoustic strings for a while whcih gave me tendonitis basically from the elbow down.


So now, years later - I decide to buy a stratocaster again. Why you may ask. Well as many problems I had with the old one, I still had many many hours of learning and fun with it. Stratocasters have the tone. they let your fingers make the noises you want to hear. But as I was to learn again, they also are mass produced with extremely questionable quality.

So I went hunting. I played many, from $900 standards to deluxe all the whisles $2900 ones .(now in the usa) And you know what I found? All of them in the store,no matter the price, had fret buzz somewhere. At this point you're all screaming - its the way you play - not the guitar. Well i thought that too untill I asked the sales person to play it. Either they played very lightly or really fast upper register licks,always trying to hide the obvious buzz. I would then fret the buzzing frets and show them where it was buzzing.

And they all thought I was nuts. "you can't hear it in the amp,don't worry about it". But I can hear it. And there ARE guitars out there that don't buzz. At least,I hope there are guitars out there that don't buzz. (NOTE:i've played a telecaster once that had zero buzz,and a les paul)

So i eventually bought a used deluxe strat that had barely been played (with plenty of fret buzz). And now am going through the process of eliminating as much as I can. Unfortuneatly I am having a hard time with this one.

i have set it up to fender specs.It plays really nice and easy on the standard specs. And it also has horrendus fret buzzing. I have used a straight edge to check frets and they are perfect,no wear no risers. I have tried all kinds of setups and have found again that crazy high action is the only answer. I talking like 1/8 to 1/4 ich off the fret board at the 12th. Also a large curve in the neck, again much more then fender recommends. Neck tilt gizmo seems to me to tilt the neck in the WRONG way as it lends itself to adjusting for a closer action when the opposite is what is required.

this could be considered an insane rant. believe me I have left out a lot of the insanity. I can say with certainty that I have been throughly dissapointed with Fender as a guitar manufacturer. I am not a bad player. I am not SRV or Hendrix. I absolutly consider fret buzz to be the result of a poor instrument made to poor standards. American Stratocasters are not cheap, and they sell thousands of them. Get rid of all the gizmos and rubbish they're been sold with and give me an American Stratocaster that has zero buzz on medium action and I will die happy. 3 single coil pickups and a volume and tone control please.

I will probably settle at a high action with some tilt to bring the strings down a little. But will continue to battle with buzzing. Beforea nyone comes up with the take it to a shop,string guage blah blah blah - I've already done everything with the first one. now I'll just keep fiddling with this one.

So why write this? Because somebody has to say this - i am not going to spend anymore than $1500 for a guitar. And when I buy one it cannot come with fret buzz. Guitars over $1000 in guitar shops SHOULD NOT have a lot of fret buzz. I don't understand why guitars costing this much money can even exist in this universe with severe fret buzz. Yes i said universe, because sometimes i think i'll wake up and my guitar won't buzz.

Just as an aside, I was thinking that the nut might be the problem. Maybe a higher cut nut would slove all these guitar's problem. maybe most people are willing to accept fret buzz for danger close action. I'm not, in case you didn't know.

If you've got this far you're either holding a lighter up and swaying, or ure already taking qoutes out to cut me down.

Sorry if I have caused any offense.

Guitars that cost as much as my car should not make as much unidentified noise as my car.

Yours Sincerely

Chris

Welcome to the Forum.

A properly setup guitar with low action will have some fret buzz when played acoustically, but not when plugged into an amp.

Check out this guide: http://www.fender.com/support/stratocaster.php

_________________
Chet Feathers

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I didn't Lose my mind, I traded it for this guitar.

I dont accept any buzz on my guitars and play them unplugged for the majority of the time. I have endevoured recently to play softly particularly with my picking hand. What i want to know is, if you had such a hard time with fretbuzz before why did you accept it again?

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No no and no

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVvtIS2YGVI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDBIbJKjAZQ

thats why

Yeah i totaly get the point that you wanted a strat. But they do make em without buzz, its nothing that cant be sorted out. A couple of months back i came across a good method to determine neck pitch (whether it needs shimming or not). Perhaps your answer lies there.

http://www.fender.com/community/forums/viewtopic.php?t=18601&start=0

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No no and no

I think that the frets on modern Strats are just too big. Probably to make them easier to play but it really does cause a lot of buzz. The last 4 or 5 Strats I have purchased all had vintage style frets on them and never buzz. Even when played acoustically.

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Custom Shop '59 Strat with John Cruz Master Design Pickups
Vibro King
Fulltone Clyde>Deja-Vibe>TS-808>TS-9>Boss Tuner

Dude I just finished playin my guitar for about an hour and you put up two of my fav songs. Now I must play for another hour or so. I kinda like a little buzz but not from my guitar.

Every Guitar I have owned, has come with high action. Factory standard I guess.

Mine did not come with a buzz. It has low action, lower than my ESP LTD that's built for Metal music. I have had several guitars in my 25+ years playing and some have had buzzes and others haven't. It just depends on what you will settle for.

My last guitar aquisition when I bought my Highway 1 Stratocaster, I played just about every Fender in my price range (and yes I was out for a Fender Strat). I played several MIM Standard's, Deluxes, Tex-Mex/Lone Star's, and Highway One's (which was the top of my price range). Once I decided on the Highway One Stratocaster, I played several different ones until I found mine. Once I played it I knew it was mine. You just have to have patience in the store, don't be pressured, and play/play/play until you find the one.

Every guitar is different, even if it is the same model and has same set-up.

_________________
RK

2007 Fender Highway 1
2012 American Deluxe
2015 MIM Dave Murray HHH
2010 Fender Blacktop
1987 Fender Avalon Acoustic
2012 Marshall DSL 15 watt head

I can't remember where but I've read that it is generally a factory standard to set action high...has to do with the different environments where the guitars are going to be shipped to eventually as I recall.

Chris / thenextsupercow - no you are not crazy, i went thru the same thing, helping a friend look for a new Strat (he bought a rosewood EJ that has a little bit of buzz in the same area that EVERY Strat that we could find at 4 - 5 stores had) i went to a bunch of music stores over the past few weekends

i tried a few Am Std's , a bunch of Roadworn's , BCorgan, Clapton non CS, Rory G CS, '56 CS, a few maple EJ's , and more - and EVERY single one had some buzz on the Lo E and A string - on the lower frets (1 thr around 8 were the worst)

Also the same two lower strings on the higher frets.

Most of these were setup with a bit of relief too - prob around .016" (using Fender's measurement std in the Strat setup guide) - i have helped my friend setup his guitars and over the past year have messed with mine a ton to try to kill as much buzz as possible... The action on most of the new Strat's was prob about like the setup guide suggestions: 5/64 on the two lower strings and a little over 4/64 on the rest (I have been measuring so much, I know can pretty much immediately spot those measurements - that's how my stuff is setup now - the action, but my relief on my guitars is either .010" to /012" on two of them and one is nearly "straight".

I could increase relief to possibly reduce the buzzing but that kills the overall tone and playability to me anyway - to me having the neck nearly straight just makes a huge diff over relief of like .012" or higher.

I really like all 3 of my strat's but if I could get the necks straight with zero buzzing I'd be more than satisfied. most of the buzzing you can't really hear thru the amp , but one sustaining notes on the lower strings, 1st few frets you can hear it.

dude i became so obsessed the past few months that i have been looking at instructional DVD's by EJ himself - there's lots of footage when he's playing clean chords and letting them ring out / sustain - and I even marked a few points where you can hear a tiny amount of fret buzz / rattle thru the DVD (to show my friend) - but mot much (EJ has sort of hi action btw - around 5/64 , he states in his latest DVD that he is sure to have the action high enough to eliminate any rattling <plus so he can play with a slide>

i also began looking thru hundreds of YouTube videos - any video where someone is reviewing, demoing their Strat. There's a guy out there that gives lessons with a site SteveSnacks, he has free videos on youtube and he teaches blues licks with a Strat and a pretty clean sound - so when he goes over the penta scale i check to listen for fret rattle when he plays the lower notes on the lower strings - and while his guitar sounds well, there's some rattle if you listen. this is the SRV lesson guy's (gr8bluesgtr is his user name, if it's not the video linked right here, search for other videos from him) his youtube link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Mjyl-xHfOc

also there's a guy with videos out there , this guy has lots of positive reviews on his lessons, he uses a Strat with a clean tone , the guitar sounds good but it's perfect since it's lessons - you can watch when he let's lower notes ring and there's some rattle -not alot, but about like my guitars overall , his youtube name is "johnguitar" search for his videos, here's one : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USSTMzhl4lw that i know has an example in it where you can hear rattling <and he's a pro player>

i know it's not just me, because of all of the guitars i played in stores over the past few months, there were a couple that had solid A strings - no fret rattle / buzz at all! And while my rattling isn't bad, my guitars have great tone and sustain, it was just so nice to have the extra solid tone on the couple of new Strat's that I tried with the solid A strings (they didn't have super high action either) - so I know it's not just my playing because mine rattle a little for other players, and I found a couple that didn't have rattle (new ones) - actually I think it was only ONE - a 60's Roadworn that had the no buzz at all A string.

Some more details on my Strat's and buzzing (this includes my friend's new rosewood EJ which I'm borrowing at the moment):

- the rattling / buzzing is only an issue with the Lo E and A strings , the others are fine

- going with relief of up to .016" doesn't correct the buzzing, just makes the guitars play badly (to me)

- raising the action hasn't helped much, i am at 5/64 for the two lower strings on 3 of my guitars (which have 3 diff radius' btw - one is a 7.5", another 9.5" , the last 12" EJ) , if i raise higher than that (haven't went past 6/64 because even that was just too high, don't know how you settle for 8/64) it doesn't really help , going below 5/64 makes it pretty bad (remember it's not too bad at 5/64, just that I'd like it gone)

- it's only noticeable on long sustaining notes , if i just play a riff (like Heartbreaker , even with a clean tone, you won't notice it) - THIS is why i think so many think that their strat's don't have fret rattle and also like you said how the salespeople will demo a Strat , you have to hold out notes on the frets / strings in question to hear the rattle (or people play with a more distorted tone which hides the rattling - though it can make distortion sound "harsh" - especially with higher note rattling <which i don't have - think old ZZ Top, in that case the fret buzz / rattle was a part of the sound, it actually was cool in that case>)

I'm sure my frets are level - maybe there's a problem with the nut (but it's measurements are ok <both at the 1st fret open and on the 1st fret with the 3rd fret fretted>) - it could be that the nut's angle isn't correct, that's more difficult to tell , beyond me....

Or maybe it's the neck - somehow the neck isn't aligned - though on my guitars they seem to be aligned - tight pocket fit, both E strings are evenly on the fretboard (no rolling off in either direction) - i have even taken pics of the necks looking for possible warping but all looks ok - I've even posted pics online for others to see (of the neck)

So maybe the nut angle, a twist or warp in the neck that's hard to see, uneven frets <that would require a pro to notice> , maybe the neck needs a shim - something crazy like the bridge alignment - but for SO MANY Strat's to rattle / buzz on the lower strings in the 1st few frets - like 20+ of them of all price ranges.

What's funny is at the store i was playing a Roadworn, it was buzzing badly, i was asking my wife if she could hear it (she's now a pro at detecting buzz, even in video's, i think she's sick of it, ha) - someone walking by said "yea, i hear that buzzing, they all buzz, Fender's have horrible fretwork, if you wanna play something that doesn't buzz get a ESP Strap copy" - so there was a used ESP Strat copy and i tried it and it had pretty low action and ....... it didn't buzz!!!! So in a way that's good because i know it's not in my playing / picking style causing the buzzing but it drove me buts because then why are ALL of the new Strat's that I'm trying all over buzzing? This is at smaller shops with better staff as well as the chains like GC and Best Buy too.

I haven't asked or talked to a luthier. I guess I'll take one of my guitars to a luthier that has a really good rep - but they are 2hrs away and they don't even accept repairs / setups until after you have been on a waiting list. That's why i haven't tried them, i guess by now if i would have gotten on the list I'd have my guitar with them by now but i wanted also to check out a ton of new Strat's to compare plus I wanted to adjust my own guitars as much as possible because i was hoping to get rid of the buzz on my own.

What's funny is that i see people post that they followed the Fender Setup Guide and their buzzing was suddenly gone afterward. That seems crazy because the guide is so basic - meaning that unless their new Strat was so horribly out of whack upon arrival that the basic steps in the setup guide won't really take care of a bad buzz - if so what's the magic step that does so? Because all the Fender setup does is cover relief, pickup height, action, and vibrato alignment / setup. Those are lucky that have a new buzzing Strat and they make those simple adjustments and the then they are totally buzz free (I could see if the neck was back-bowed and they added a little relief, or if the action was like 2/64 all around and they raised it to 4/64, that stuff would correct buzzing, but the guitar would have to had come to them really screwed up for those fixes to make a huge diff) - I'm not knocking those folks, i wish i was in their boat...

Also if i pick - up and away (out) , sort of like the way EJ now picks if you have seen his Fine Art of Guitar DVD (he calls it the bounce technique) there's zero buzzing , if I play slap bass style (pluck) there's no buzzing , playing with my thumb no buzzing , picking lightly with my fingers no buzzing - but using light to heavy pic's in the normal picking method (not really hard attack, just normal i guess) the buzzing is there on the lower strings , frets 1 thru 8 and on (mostly) the Lo E from the 12th fret above (but that's sort of normal for the low E in the high registers).

I don't have the higher fret buzz or choking of notes issue (even on my 7.25" radius strat) because my action is high enough....

I could go on and on, glad to see I'm not alone -- which reminds me, i have also been searching thru tons of forums and we aren't alone - i have read MANY posts to where players say they have all sorts of other guitars and every time they try a Strat is buzzes , so it's def an issue for many people. There there's always a few people that say they have zero buzzing and none of their strat's have ever buzzed (even their cheapo / beat up / partscasters).

I'd like to see a youtube video of sustained notes on the lower strings with a really clean tone from some of those folks.

Good luck and if you find a solution please post. I'm curious to find out if a luthier can come up with something to solve my buzzing (but like i said it's not really bad, most doesn't come thru the amp but i play alot unplugged and then it bothers me) - at least i know it's not just my guitars (because of your post and others, plus all of the Strat's i have been checking out lately)


p.s - I use 10's , used to use 09's , moved up to 10's in hopes of ridding all buzzing , the 10's rattle a little less...

totally agree on that RKREISHER

Hi thenextsupercow: wow, that's a painful story. You have our sympathies.

I've bought guitars with no buzz and one or two with very slight buzz, easily addressable. Worse than that: don't buy.

My last American Strat came with a good Fender spec setup (which was sheer luck, given that I bought it from the notorious Turnkey in London, now gone). It had zero buzz in the shop and none ever since. All I've done in the last four years is to make rare tiny adjustments to maintain that standard setup. Plays beautifully.

I have a light to medium right hand: I guess if I belted my guitars hard enough I could make 'em buzz, but honestly I've not had the misery you describe with my Fenders. Wouldn't buy 'em if I had!

BTW: I have a grandmother on one side of the family and a great-grandmother on the other from Cork. Nice town in a beautiful part of the country. You are doing well there, at least!!

Cheers - C

I'm in the same sort of circumstance you said when you were 16. I've gotten a job to buy my 3rd mid-higher end guitar. Hopefully i can learn from your mistakes.

When i buy my next guitar, should i get one which has no fret buzz?

AdroG - b4 you shell out the $$$ meaning you will be stuck with what you buy for a while - try out lots if you can , if you find that they all have some fret buzz, have someone at the shop play it - see if it buzzes for them or have a friend come along with you to try out the guitars

if you find something that sounds great, feels great but has some buzz and even when someone else plays it - then if it has buzz that the shop personnel can hear - ask them if they can set it up better, they should be willing to help and if it can't be fixed, then prob you don't want that guitar if you dint want any buzzing

hopefully like Ceri you will have a lighter touch, if you like high action and really dig in and have a nice distinctive tone (picking / raking technique ) though you may pic hard enough (rocking out or SRV'ing all over) to bring up some buzz

remember, now's the good time if you have $$$ and are ready to buy - now you haven't committed, take your time and play as many guitars as you can until you find the one that you really want / like , enjoy!
(so you don't end up spending more time trying to get rid of fret rattling than you do actually playing)