Yes, and please dear God, let that be the last word, being as it was the best one.[/quote]

So let it be written So let it be done

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"Another day in paradise!"

Sorry to disapoint those of you who wish this to be over, but I think this sin't really fair. Are you trying to say that John, Ringo, Paul, or George were virtuosi? Really, I mean, none of them were bad, don't get me wrong, but they couldn't/can't produce solos or tracks that blow your mind. They used teamwork as a band to create a sound that helped rock and roll to evolve. NIRVANA helped bring grunge into the mainstream. Okay, you can denounce grunge as some kind of garage punk or something, okay, but nontheless it's still a genre, and NIRVANA (and Kurt) helped it be noticed. Woth the Beatles, rock and roll was already popular. By the time they were doing real rock stuff and less pop, rock and roll was already kicking. When they went psychedelic, the Hendrix Experience, The Doors, Big Brother and the Holding Company, and more were already around. When they had folk stuff out, guys like Bob Dylan were around. Same with their pop, art rock, progrssive rock, and other stuff. Once again, don't get me wrong, they helped the genre very very much, but they weren't as original and experimental as, like, the Velvet Underground.

Besides, NIRVANA also incorporated alternative rock ("Dumb," "Come As You Are," "All Apologies"), hardcore punk ("Negative Creep," "Floyd the Barber," "Tourette's," "Stay Away," "Territorial Pissings"), metal ("Scentless Apprentice," "Endless, Nameless," "Milk It"), folk/folk rock ("Polly," "Something in the Way," "Do Re Mi"), and punk rock ("Breed," "Sliver," "Rape Me," "Downer," "Been a Son") and more into their sound, not just grunge. These genres have also been done before, but at least they weren't a one-genre band like most of what's out nowadays.

Sorry to disapoint those of you who wish this to be over, but I think this sin't really fair.

Oh, it's fair Jerry.

How so?

Look, there are people who like Nirvana and there are people who dislike or hate Nirvana. Every band has its lovers and haters. There is no number or measurement for influence or success. Some people like certain bands more than others. The point is we can say all we want, in the end it doesn't change anything. Nirvana was successful and influential to some people, and to others they were just annoying. What's done is done and that's all there is to it.

You can like or dislike a band or an artist all you want. That doesnt mean that your opinion that "they suck" or "he's a loser" is valid. In fact it's an ignorant statement to make. Unless you like being a troll. I really wonder what type of person writes nonsense like that. Is it a really a young kid that is just being imature or is it somebody well over 40 thats just to old and doesnt get it.

The beatles were virtuosi, How many minds did they blow in their time, a fair few more than old kurty boy thats for sure. Do we ever see riot control for dave grohl, no. The lennon mcartney partnership was noted for its virtuosity because of their implementation of orchestra's (metallica didnt invent it) multiple styles into one sound. Surf, rockabilly, dewop to create the beat sound, which they did pretty much invent. To say non of them could produce a masterpiece on their own is a incredibly ridiculous statement.
Mcartney. the frog song, mull o kintire, band on the run, jet.
Harrison. My sweet lord, while my guitar gently weeps and the cream number badge.
Lennon, do i really have to name em.

MTV dragged grunge into the mainstream kicking and screaming. Thats why they pushed nirvanah so hard. The longstanding business plan of mtv has been if you cant silence something you dont sell, then control it. For that reason they drafted nirvana in, a nice angry boy without too much brains who's going to do everything we tell him for enough blah d blah. Face it, nirvana would be unheard of without the mtv hype that started em.
I never denounced grunge as garage punk i denounced nirvanah as a garage punk band that weren't very good. If you listen to bleach thats quite apparent.

Not true. sgt peppers had been out for awhile by 67. To say they weren't as experimental as the velvet underground is also ridiculous. The beatles pretty much invented popvideo with yellow submarine. They were also pioneers of backwards recording.

Now heres where you really lose it. I've played for a few semi-famous punk, hardcore and anarcho bands, i do know my punk. If i played anything remotely like the self obsessed drivel of come as you are or negative creep i'd of been sacked. Nirvana owe much more to the likes of bauhaus then they do conflict or discharge. Maybe theres a tiny bit of ramones or stooges in there rhythm wise but not in melody.

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No no and no

Wow ... so now this is all has digressed to a Nirvana comparo vs the likes of the Beatles and Kiss? When it comes to the Beatles, no one has yet to match their constant re-definition of music and prolificity. To the complete contrary, Kiss is a band that pioneered marketeering along with the ability to put on an amazing show. But Kiss also wrote some high quality anthemic rock songs, albeit with zero "depth".

So where does that leave Kurt?

As a very polarizing figure for us, evidently ... and somewhere in the vast lineage between the likes of John & Paul ... and Paul & Gene.

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Laughing out loud with fear and hope, I have a desperate plan ...

Finally just read through this thread. Good golly, it gets angry, doesn't it? Haven't seen one like this on the Forum for a while.

This gentleman sounds like he knows something of which he speaks:



Cheers - C

i read it in its entirety.... i think its over. KURT WINS!!!! lol im only kidding.

How did that go?

War is over
If you want it!
John Lennon

You mean instead of "Rape Me"?
Man I really miss John Lennon

Yes, I do too, but then again like the man said---"I'm not the only one!"

By virtousi, I meant extremely talented in their respective instruments, not songwriting skills, because they were all talented at writing songs. Kurt was a good songwriter too, like it or not, he sold records. There isn't one NIRVANA song that didn't AT LEAST have him as a co-songwriter, and there's only three of those, I believe, at that. Say anything you want about him being untalented, or not original, or whatever, but he left a big impact.



So? A lot of now-praised bands, or very influentual bands were/are almost unheard of, like Sonic Youth, the Velvet Underground, King Crimson, Mudhoney, the Melvins, and more. And once again, say what you what about Kurt or NIRVANA, but it doesn't change anything. lsiten to an interview with Kurt, he was an inteligent person, not educationally, not some kind of genius, but inteligent as far as life.
And I'm sorry, you denounced "nirvanah" as not good because you didn't like Bleach. Smart. Well, heres some news, music is built on opinions, okay? Some people like this, some like that. I happen to like Bleach, but I'm not going around saying that it's a fact that it's good, I say it as an opinion, because it is one.



Okay, well Are You Experienced came out in '67, too. And Big Brother and the Holding Company's self-titled, and the Rolling Stone's "Paint it, Black" single, and the Door's "Break on Through" single and their self-titled debut, and Strange Days, and the Holy Modal Rounders had plenty of stuff out before '67.
I can't say i know what "popvideo" is, so I guess I'll take your word for it.
But as far as backwards recording, Are you Experienced came out before Sgt. Pepper's, and the title track used back-recording.

[quote="nikininja|]Now heres where you really lose it. I've played for a few semi-famous punk, hardcore and anarcho bands, i do know my punk. If i played anything remotely like the self obsessed drivel of come as you are or negative creep i'd of been sacked. Nirvana owe much more to the likes of bauhaus then they do conflict or discharge. Maybe theres a tiny bit of ramones or stooges in there rhythm wise but not in melody.[/quote]

Semi-famous? I'd like some kind of proof. But even besides that, okay, you know your punk, but even if you think it's "self obsessed drivel," NIRVANA was punk, no two ways about it.

I just love this topic. . Even when you try to forget about it, the comments still echo in your brain.