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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:30 pm
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CB91710 wrote:
You can do testing directly at the output jack, but remember that if you solder the final choice in at the jack, it will always be in effect, so it will make your stock .022 caps sound like .03 if you end up selecting .008 as your ideal ear-saving value, not to mention it will kill some of the treble even when the tone pots are at 10.

I'm not sure why you redrew the circuit with the red line going from the switch to ground... that's an effective kill switch, unless you just didn't want to draw the cap, but yes, that's where the cap should be installed to keep the non-direct sound as it is today.

HA .. Mea Culpa .. I forgot to draw the cap .. working on that crude grd symbol ..

If the Jack isn't clear, I'll solder wiring connections inside ..

As you say, testing is fine on the Jack but I wouldn't want to live there.

Now .. how do you feel about a TBX with the 220Kohm mod?

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:37 pm
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I have no experience with the TBX circuit. Only non-"standard" I've owned is the G&L S-500 "PTB" design, which isn't really even close to the TBX.

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 2:46 pm
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This was an all around great project .. that worked out!

Thanks to sfceric64 & CB91710 for a lot of sound advice (no pun) & simplifying explanations for me

Problem: Direct Through mod (no pots in signal path) was too shrill.

Solution: Install a capacitor (cap) to bleed off unwanted High Frequencies.


Solder connections to the +/- terminals of Output Jack ..

Image

Connect Alligator clips & test by ears (two musicians).

I could test any combination from .001uf to about .49uf .. alone or in series or parallel with another Cap

It soon became apparent that some combination of .001 was needed

Just one .001was slightly preferred to "in series" with another .001.

The combination of .001 & .001 in parallel was much too strong.

Image

This is the .001installed .. between a CTS 250K DPDT pot and grounded to the Tone 1 pot (TBX w/220Ko res) ..

Lots of shrink wrapping to prevent shorts .. treble bleed on the Vol pot

Image


That's it .. the best Strat wiring mod I've made or heard in person ..

No tone suck .. a nice quick alternative from a muted rhythm setting

No fooling with the Amp or Gtr controls .. just pull up Tone 2 and Go Cat Go!

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:32 pm
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Fantastic. I'm surprised that .001 was enough, but the ears don't lie!

Ya, the difference between resistors and capacitors is that resistors are additive in series, while capacitors are additive in parallel. Likewise, resistors in parallel are subtractive by the factor of "1/Rt = 1/R1 + 1/R2 + 1/R3...."
The same formula applies to capacitors in series.

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:58 pm
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CB91710 wrote:
Fantastic. I'm surprised that .001 was enough, but the ears don't lie!

Ya, the difference between resistors and capacitors is that resistors are additive in series, while capacitors are additive in parallel. Likewise, resistors in parallel are subtractive by the factor of "1/Rt = 1/R1 + 1/R2 + 1/R3...."
The same formula applies to capacitors in series.

Thanks for your help CB .. I haven't memorized any formulas yet .. but it's working so far

The .001 was enough for both our sets of ears .. I'm still happy with it today (after several checks) .. larger caps got muddy quick

The "Texitano" is going to the best local Luthier that I know in the morning ..

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:50 pm
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Glad you were able to get that worked out quickly and at the right price!!!
Not really surprised by your cap selection, especially after thinking about the bright switch on many Fender amps. Not that it was the same issue but a similar issue w/ being to shrill for many ears. Good learning experience, maybe the best route is to start w/ the smallest option available. Next time the question comes up I'll recommend a 250pf, 500pf, 1000pf and a 2000pf.

No TBX experience but maybe the 220k mod is a bass limiter/enhancer, seems like a lot of resistance for a pot mod.

What's it sound like disconnected/ connected?


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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:38 pm
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I am curious if anyone has seen a 500k pot with a 3PDT push-pull.
I'd like to mod a 3-pickup guitar with coil taps, and I don't see a Superswitch giving me the options that I want.
I'll probably end up only putting the coil tap on the neck/middle positions.

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 2:50 am
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sfceric64 wrote:
Glad you were able to get that worked out quickly and at the right price!!!
Not really surprised by your cap selection, especially after thinking about the bright switch on many Fender amps. Not that it was the same issue but a similar issue w/ being to shrill for many ears. Good learning experience, maybe the best route is to start w/ the smallest option available. Next time the question comes up I'll recommend a 250pf, 500pf, 1000pf and a 2000pf.

No TBX experience but maybe the 220k mod is a bass limiter/enhancer, seems like a lot of resistance for a pot mod.

What's it sound like disconnected/ connected?

Grounding the most piercing high freq was the goal .. now there's an appreciable difference from stock ..

There's a "Treble Bleed" on the Volume pot .. Vol can be turned down without losing too many high freq

The 220K TBX mod gave me a more usable high end sweep ..

Dirk Wacker (sp?) on Premier guitar published these mods ..

He recommends 220K with a passive system .. the original was designed to work with an active system (Clapton's Mid-Boost)

Thanks again for coming to the rescue .. I couldn't be happier with the results .. that's not always the case : )

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:07 am
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CB91710 wrote:
I am curious if anyone has seen a 500k pot with a 3PDT push-pull.
I'd like to mod a 3-pickup guitar with coil taps, and I don't see a Superswitch giving me the options that I want.
I'll probably end up only putting the coil tap on the neck/middle positions.

I don't think that switch exists outside the stomp box world ..

Have you looked at a 500k S-1 Push Push 4PDT switch? Knurled or Solid shafts are available.

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 1:13 pm
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danagos wrote:
I don't think that switch exists outside the stomp box world ..

Have you looked at a 500k S-1 Push Push 4PDT switch? Knurled or Solid shafts are available.

Ya, plenty of 3P and even 4P mini toggles, but I don't want to drill the body (my buddy joked that I needed 2 shots of bourbon before drilling out his PRS to replace the rotary 5-way with a toggle).
It's for one of my '90s G&Ls (Climax HSS) and I want to be able to completely restore it back to the OEM (or provide all of the OEM parts to some future owner).

It's currently still H-S-S, the H is comparable to a Duncan Distortion, but the middle and neck are just generic Taiwan single coils. Coupled with the factory 1m pots, they are horrible. My plan is to go with Hot Rails to replace the single coils... I haven't decided if I will keep the original neck or go to a Duncan Nazgul.

I did consider the S1, but the problem with the S1 is Fender doesn't make the Tele style knobs for it in black, converting to chrome would mean new tuners and a new Floyd. I was going to go with the S1 for my Partcaster, but decided to go with Hot Noiseless instead of Duncan rails. I might still pop one in to make a connection from the bridge to the neck a/la Tele.

I'll probably just use a 2PDT and only split the coils of the middle and neck. I have the Strats and S-500 for the traditional Strat tones. The Climax is more for high-gain stuff anyways, but I wanted the ability to get the #4 "slot" position.

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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:32 pm
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CB91710 wrote:
danagos wrote:
I don't think that switch exists outside the stomp box world ..

Have you looked at a 500k S-1 Push Push 4PDT switch? Knurled or Solid shafts are available.

Ya, plenty of 3P and even 4P mini toggles, but I don't want to drill the body (my buddy joked that I needed 2 shots of bourbon before drilling out his PRS to replace the rotary 5-way with a toggle).
It's for one of my '90s G&Ls (Climax HSS) and I want to be able to completely restore it back to the OEM (or provide all of the OEM parts to some future owner).

It's currently still H-S-S, the H is comparable to a Duncan Distortion, but the middle and neck are just generic Taiwan single coils. Coupled with the factory 1m pots, they are horrible. My plan is to go with Hot Rails to replace the single coils... I haven't decided if I will keep the original neck or go to a Duncan Nazgul.

I did consider the S1, but the problem with the S1 is Fender doesn't make the Tele style knobs for it in black, converting to chrome would mean new tuners and a new Floyd. I was going to go with the S1 for my Partcaster, but decided to go with Hot Noiseless instead of Duncan rails. I might still pop one in to make a connection from the bridge to the neck a/la Tele.

I'll probably just use a 2PDT and only split the coils of the middle and neck. I have the Strats and S-500 for the traditional Strat tones. The Climax is more for high-gain stuff anyways, but I wanted the ability to get the #4 "slot" position.

Your project is starting to sound like a lot of my "almost good" ideas

Just more complex

For instance I stuffed a 9 V in the Trem Spring compartment .. along with 3 springs

So I wouldn't have to cut a battery compartment in a Hot Rod 50's Vintage Fender body ..

nice body but I'd like a 4th spring in there now.

None of which is helpful .. Good Luck Rich


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Post subject: Re: Wiring mod "Direct Through" needs help
Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:04 pm
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Necessity is the mother of invention... and trying to install desired mods without harming long term value is certainly a mother ;)
That battery mount is really a great idea. You can get heavier springs from FU-Tone and a few other sources that might do the job without having to go to 4 springs.

Not enough room for the battery in the channel between the neck and middle pickup cavities?

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