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Post subject: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:31 pm
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Sorry for this post being so long. I just wanted to make clear my problem/concern.

Recently I purchased a Washburn BT3 from a pawn shop for dirt cheap.. Two of the ceramic pickups had their magnets fall off so I decide to replace them with something better. I found a loaded pickguard from a 1999 Super Strat on ebay. I Thought it would be cool to have the optional push button switch for my Washburn. I modified the Washburn pick guard and it worked as it should. With the switch up, position 1= bridge, 2=bridge/middle 3=middle, 4=neck/middle, 5=neck. With the switch down everything the same, except position 4=bridge/middle/neck, 5=bridge neck.. I confirmed the combinations my tapping on the super fat pickups with a small drill bit.

I have always wanted a Fender Strat and I then got interested in finding a Super Strat after reading about them.

I found a MIM 2006 Players Strat Deluxe on Craigslist in like new condition and purchased it today for a fair price. It had been sitting for 5 years and after cleaning it up it looked great. The seller didn't have an amp set up to test everything, but I was willing to take a chance.

Using the same technique and tapping on the pick-ups I got these results:

Switch up 1= neck, 2=bridge/middle/neck, 3=middle/neck, 4=middle/neck, 5=middle/neck

Switch down 1= neck, 2=bridge/middle/neck, 3=middle/neck, 4=bridge/middle/neck, 5=bridge/middle/neck

Looking at a scematic, I checked under the pick guard and it appears to be correctly unmolested wired factory wiring .

Perhaps a bad component?

Any help would be appreciated.


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 11:21 pm
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IIRC, the Super Strat's wiring was identical to the Deluxe Players Strat -- only the pickups and pot values were changed. The latter was required due to the Vintage Noiseless pickups which use 1MΩ values (the Fat Strat pickups are traditional single-coils and use 250KΩ). The push-button switch was designed to provide two additional pickup combinations: bridge and neck pickups together, and all three pickups simultaneously.

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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 2:07 am
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ChasB wrote:
Switch up 1= neck, 2=bridge/middle/neck, 3=middle/neck, 4=middle/neck, 5=middle/neck
Switch down 1= neck, 2=bridge/middle/neck, 3=middle/neck, 4=bridge/middle/neck, 5=bridge/middle/neck
Looking at a scematic, I checked under the pick guard and it appears to be correctly unmolested wired factory wiring.

The positions should be:
Push switch up 1-B, 2-BM/Tone2, 3-M/T2, 4-MN/T1&2, 5-N/T1
Push switch down 1-B, 2-BM/T2, 3-M/T2, 4-BMN/T1&2 5-BN/T1.
(And I know, I'm being nitpicky about the position numbers; it affects the info given and thus the diagnosis. Sorry...)

My best guess is the push-push switch is either really dirty or broken. Try cleaning it with non-lubricating contact spray first. If that doesn't help, replace the switch (you may get some confirmation to my diagnose if the cleaning has some effect).
Part number 0020803000. Keep all gidgets from the old switch (screws, mounting block, knob).

Deluxe Player Strat 013-3000/3002 Service Diagram

BTW, the original pots are 250kΩ/Vol, 500kΩ/Tones.


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:27 am
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jmattis wrote:
ChasB wrote:
Switch up 1= neck, 2=bridge/middle/neck, 3=middle/neck, 4=middle/neck, 5=middle/neck
Switch down 1= neck, 2=bridge/middle/neck, 3=middle/neck, 4=bridge/middle/neck, 5=bridge/middle/neck
Looking at a scematic, I checked under the pick guard and it appears to be correctly unmolested wired factory wiring.

The positions should be:
Push switch up 1-B, 2-BM/Tone2, 3-M/T2, 4-MN/T1&2, 5-N/T1
Push switch down 1-B, 2-BM/T2, 3-M/T2, 4-BMN/T1&2 5-BN/T1.
(And I know, I'm being nitpicky about the position numbers; it affects the info given and thus the diagnosis. Sorry...)

My best guess is the push-push switch is either really dirty or broken. Try cleaning it with non-lubricating contact spray first. If that doesn't help, replace the switch (you may get some confirmation to my diagnose if the cleaning has some effect).
Part number 0020803000. Keep all gidgets from the old switch (screws, mounting block, knob).

Deluxe Player Strat 013-3000/3002 Service Diagram

BTW, the original pots are 250kΩ/Vol, 500kΩ/Tones.


Thanks for the reply. I have both wiring diagrams for both models and they are identical (although the super has two caps). The button is working as it should, it makes or breaks with no problem. If it was bad,(shorted or open) the pick ups would remain on one status or the other. I can verify this by removing the wires and manually making or breaking them, which I will try. All the wiring and components on the pick guard are clean and pristine as the Strat was stored in a gig bag. After more trouble shooting, everything points to the selector switch. It's like it is wired wrong, but according to the wiring diagram, it is not. The metal mount is facing to the outside of the pick guard. Each side of the wafer on the selector switch has four connections. Whats really weird is the yellow wire from the bridge pick up looks like it is going to the common of the selector switch base on a visual , but that would make the mounting of the selector switch "backwards" and the wiring diagram wrong, which I'm sure is not the case. The chart makes it clear how the switching works in relation to the pots and pick ups. I suppose I could totally remove the selector switch and ohm its operation out. If it is mounted in the right direction then the selector switch has to (some how) be bad. Hard for me to believe that though as it looks new.

Image


Last edited by ChasB on Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:52 am
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The 5way would have been my next guess if you're sure the push-push is OK. :wink:

Maybe the easy way out is to get a new 5way and rewire it. Troubleshooting can take a lot of time.

On the present 5way switch and the"backwards" wiring:
It has never happened to me, and I'm absolutely no wiring expert, but I remembered reading about "mirror wiring" re: Fender vs. some other brand blade switches:
Quote:
http://www.tdpri.com/threads/4-way-switch-wiring-problem.64925/
One other thing that COULD be an issue here - I've seen this on Strat 5-ways - is that you may have a non-Fender switch with a different lug layout. I haven't seen a 4-way like this, but there's always a first time - so it would be odd, but possible...

In other words, the common lugs may be at the other end of the poles - instead of bottom-left and top-right, as shown in the drawing, the switch may have been manufactured with top-left and bottom-right as commons.

This is a common issue when people use the replacement 5-ways from Stewmac.com and a few others in a Fender axe - the commons are at the "wrong end" of the row of lugs (poles). And I don't EVEN want to get into the Mega-S switches!

If this were the case, then all you need to do is "mirror-image" the drawing - reverse it left for right - so that the commons in the drawing match your switch. You should be able to meter-check this, or heck, even just eyeball it by looking at the wiper.


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 9:28 am
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I ohmed out the selector switch. Found no problems. From common to the different outputs allowed different varieties on the other three terminals on both sides. The selector switch is definitely good. I then compared both the super and the player wiring again. Not only does the super have an extra .022 capacitor at the lower tone pot, instead of the capacitor, the player has a wire going from there to the second tone pot where the capacitor is on the super (see photo). I removed this wire and added an extra capacitor as the super has and relocated another wire. Now the selector switch allows multiple pick up configurations as show in the manual.

Image

It would be like having a super strat and removing the super fat super strat pickups and installing noisless pick ups.

I put everything back together and it plays much better.

Any opinions on this?


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:41 am
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There is a "Deluxe Player", and there is a "Player", which are 2 different guitars. Perhaps you have the latter and not the former? I thought the "Player" was MIC?

As noted, the "Super Strat" and the "Deluxe Player" are the same except for the pups. The 'Super Strat" has "Super Fat" pups, wheras the "Deluxe Player" has noiseless pups. I'm not sure which pups the "Player" has. There are "Classic Players" strats also, with still different pups.

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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:19 am
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ChasB wrote:
Any opinions on this?

I'm not an electronics wizard enough to know what those different wirings do differently - or even if the improvement is because of just resoldering or the rewiring...
Main thing is it's OK now.

I've got a growing collection of Fender/Squier service diagrams (due to the disappearance of those in the gravely disappointing and totally disasterous website updates lately), but I do not have that Super Strat diagram. Could you post the whole diagram on the forum, or provide a download link for it?

PS: There are at least Deluxe, Classic, Modern, Road Worn Player (or Players/Player's) Strats, but I don't recall a model named just Player(s)... Anyway, the naming shows the imaginative level of the marketing department. Likewise, reclaiming/reusing "Elite" and "Pro" series... :wink:


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:58 am
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shimmilou wrote:
There is a "Deluxe Player", and there is a "Player", which are 2 different guitars. Perhaps you have the latter and not the former? I thought the "Player" was MIC?

As noted, the "Super Strat" and the "Deluxe Player" are the same except for the pups. The 'Super Strat" has "Super Fat" pups, wheras the "Deluxe Player" has noiseless pups. I'm not sure which pups the "Player" has. There are "Classic Players" strats also, with still different pups.



I should have been more clear. It is a 2006 Deluxe player, MIM. It has one of the 60 Anniversary buttons on the headstock. Besides the pups (Super Fat and Noiseless) and possible other differences, the two models vary by their wiring, as shown in my diagram. Mine has the Noiseless pups.

Here's what it looks like:

Image


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 5:00 am
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jmattis wrote:
ChasB wrote:
Any opinions on this?

I'm not an electronics wizard enough to know what those different wirings do differently - or even if the improvement is because of just resoldering or the rewiring...
Main thing is it's OK now.



I've got a growing collection of Fender/Squier service diagrams (due to the disappearance of those in the gravely disappointing and totally disasterous website updates lately), but I do not have that Super Strat diagram. Could you post the whole diagram on the forum, or provide a download link for it?

PS: There are at least Deluxe, Classic, Modern, Road Worn Player (or Players/Player's) Strats, but I don't recall a model named just Player(s)... Anyway, the naming shows the imaginative level of the marketing department. Likewise, reclaiming/reusing "Elite" and "Pro" series... :wink:


I guess I was being lazy not typing out the whole model name.. It is a 2006 Deluxe Player Strat. :mrgreen:

Stratocaster® Service Diagrams:

https://support.fender.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000820386-Stratocaster-Service-Diagrams

Specifically the Super Strat:

https://p4.zdassets.com/hc/theme_assets/549136/200076499/013-9400_02C_SISD.pdf

And the Deluxe Player:

https://p4.zdassets.com/hc/theme_assets/549136/200076499/013-3000_02A_SISD.pdf


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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:19 am
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I surely wish I'd grabbed a Super Strat when they were still available.

:(

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Possible MIM Player Strat problem ??
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:22 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
I surely wish I'd grabbed a Super Strat when they were still available.

:(

Arjay


I was looking for a Super Strat when I found this Deluxe player Strat. It was hardly used.. almost mint condition. Well worth the $320 that I paid for it.. another thing that is cool about it is that it has the cool 60 anniversary Medallion on the headstock. Came with some extra gear and the Fender gig bag also. The only downside is it is just about unplayable.. It needs to be set up. Although I am pretty handy I am probably going to take it to a professional.


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