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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:09 am
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frank2016 wrote:
I'll play my Laguna/guitar center guitar until I have enough experience and enough knowledgeable people with me before I get another one.
Good idea. Believe it or not, you have plenty good knowledgeable people here to help you out if you were only open to receive it. You let ONE GUYS comments get under your skin, and dismissed everything else that was given to you.
Thin skin has possibly screwed up one of the best deals you may be offered in your musical world. That's a shame.
Educate yourself on how to spot "red flags" on a Fender guitar (and one of the best ways to do that is to browse these forums) and get out there and go shopping again.

P.S.- You can take as many "knowledgeable" people with you as you'd like...but it is YOU that will have to 'bond' with the instrument.

P.P.S.- I am an experienced truck driver...and nothing annoys me more than when someone gets on a trucking forum and asks "How is (insert company name here) to work for, I am set up for orientation in the morning?".
See...they accepted a job, and know nothing about the company, but there's nothing me or any other experienced driver can do for them or tell them because it is too late. THAT is what BMW-KTM was experiencing emotionally when he first saw your post. That shouldn't have gotten under your skin...it should have taught you a lesson---and I think it did, because you took the guitar back based on that ONE post (as far as I can tell).


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:16 am
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frank2016 wrote:
Thanks for the replies ..I took the guitar back for a full refund. Small shop, known for repair skills... all three people in the shop (owner, salesman, repair dude) were way to over excited at how great my purchase was! Something just didn't feel right...

I'll play my Laguna/guitar center guitar until I have enough experience and enough knowledgeable people with me before I get another one.

Thanks again.


Not everyone is a criminal. The guys in the shop are probably enthusiasts and were genuinely pleased (for you) that you got a great guitar.

If you run a shop in any (non Eastern) country you are unlikely to knowingly sell a fake as the damage to your reputation would be ruinous. Also, labour rates are such that it isn't generaly worth the time to produce a convincing fake.

It looks very much like you took back a perfectly good guitar and, perhaps worse, ruined a relationship with a guitar shop that could have been your best support for years to come.

Well done.

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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:45 am
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John Sims wrote:
It looks very much like you took back a perfectly good guitar and, perhaps worse, ruined a relationship with a guitar shop that could have been your best support for years to come.

Well done.


I feel compelled to agree.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:57 am
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Sorry guys.
I gave in to a moment of weakness and I let my frustration show.
I guess I grow weary of the bullshit sometimes.

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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:23 pm
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Don't sweat it man.
A case of the customer is always right ... only in this instance he wasn't :D


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 5:45 pm
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John C wrote:
shimmilou wrote:
The neck plate looks like it has a RI serial number, but there is no such thing as a "70s RI", American or otherwise. I'm not sure that the "American Vintage 70s" Strat had a serial number on the neck plate. :?


No, actually you're wrong. If you check catalog the model was called the "American Vintage '70s Stratocaster Reissue" - that is the name it carries on page #13 of the 2012 Fender Illustrated Price List (or page 15 of the online version - Fender didn't number the cover pages on the hard copies). So it was an AVRI '70s Strat, and it did have the serial number on the neck plate.

Here's a link to the 2012 Illustrated Price list:

https://support.fender.com/hc/en-us/art ... Price-List

That being said I wonder if this one was an FSR of some kind - the "regular" AVRI '70s would have had white plastic parts early-70s style and this one has the late-70s style black plastic parts. The parts could have been swapped out, but I don't think that the replacement Fender pickguards have the flag decal on them (over the film) like the AVRIs did from the factory.


lol! You would have to find 1 misprint somewhere. Everywhere else on the Fender site, it was never called a RI. Frankly, as i stated before, you can't "reissue" something that was never issued in the first place. Every other Fender "reissue" was a specific year, not an entire decade. :wink:

At least now I know probably where many retailers picked up the "reissue" nomenclature. :roll:

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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:49 pm
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shimmilou wrote:
John C wrote:
shimmilou wrote:
The neck plate looks like it has a RI serial number, but there is no such thing as a "70s RI", American or otherwise. I'm not sure that the "American Vintage 70s" Strat had a serial number on the neck plate. :?


No, actually you're wrong. If you check catalog the model was called the "American Vintage '70s Stratocaster Reissue" - that is the name it carries on page #13 of the 2012 Fender Illustrated Price List (or page 15 of the online version - Fender didn't number the cover pages on the hard copies). So it was an AVRI '70s Strat, and it did have the serial number on the neck plate.

Here's a link to the 2012 Illustrated Price list:

https://support.fender.com/hc/en-us/art ... Price-List

That being said I wonder if this one was an FSR of some kind - the "regular" AVRI '70s would have had white plastic parts early-70s style and this one has the late-70s style black plastic parts. The parts could have been swapped out, but I don't think that the replacement Fender pickguards have the flag decal on them (over the film) like the AVRIs did from the factory.


lol! You would have to find 1 misprint somewhere. Everywhere else on the Fender site, it was never called a RI. Frankly, as i stated before, you can't "reissue" something that was never issued in the first place. Every other Fender "reissue" was a specific year, not an entire decade. :wink:

At least now I know probably where many retailers picked up the "reissue" nomenclature. :roll:


I just pulled the most recent one where it was listed; it's listed that way in the 2011 Frontline as well. From what I recall it was always listed as the "American Vintage 70s Reissue" in the Frontlines and in the ads for it; it's just that Fender has pulled the 2006-2010 Frontlines from their website.

But I do agree with you - you can't reissue a decade; you have to pick a year. Fender did that so they didn't have to redo that cast Marzak (Marzac?) bridge and could use the bridge they used on the '57 and the '62 and make a few other changes for that model.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:17 pm
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Not that it matters but around 2009 give or take the name change happened where the american vintage series including the 57, 62 and 70s became the american vintage reissue series.
It is clear in the frontline mags and not a typo .
Just checked the official pricelist 2007 and they are called american vintage series reissue as well.
Whilst calling your strat an AVRI maybe is not technically correct depending on the year of manufacture I think we all get the idea... :D


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:49 pm
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John C wrote:
Fender did that so they didn't have to redo that cast Marzak (Marzac?) bridge and could use the bridge they used on the '57 and the '62 and make a few other changes for that model.


"Mazak", John.

The combination bridge-plate/trem-block and the saddles were cast from this miserable alloy, softer and more malleable than the chrome plating used to conceal it.

:lol:

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 7:56 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
John C wrote:
Fender did that so they didn't have to redo that cast Marzak (Marzac?) bridge and could use the bridge they used on the '57 and the '62 and make a few other changes for that model.


"Mazak", John.

The combination bridge-plate/trem-block and the saddles were cast from this miserable alloy, softer and more malleable than the chrome plating used to conceal it.

:lol:

Arjay


Arjay - thanks; I couldn't remember the spelling and was putting in an extra "r". I wonder if those solid saddles on my '79 Lead II were also made of Mazak.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake?
Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:33 am
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Probably. FMI/CBS was growing ridiculously chintzy during the last years of its existence. Much like FMIC is now.

Arjay

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