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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 6:57 am
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John Sims wrote:
My main objection to the Plus was the card reader. If they could have (or do) produce a product which does the same but fits within the original body cavities it would have much greater acceptance in my opinion. Perhaps they could make the changes to switching using the same technology/magic that TC Electronics employ with their Tone print pedals?


EBMM tried that with their "Game Changer" model - it has a USB port where you can change up the switching path to any one of a number of programs (they claim 250,000 combinations) . It also has not been accepted by the marketplace, but they keep it around probably because they invested too much into it to kill it off and they do still sell a few of them each year. They even went so far as to kill off the base model, the Reflex, that didn't have the "Game Changer" circuitry. EBMM has found use for the some of the technology - the switching in their Majesty models uses the "Game Changer" technology but it is set at the factory and does not have a port so it can't be changed.

One the whole we


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:39 am
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John Sims wrote:
My main objection to the Plus was the card reader. If they could have (or do) produce a product which does the same but fits within the original body cavities it would have much greater acceptance in my opinion. Perhaps they could make the changes to switching using the same technology/magic that TC Electronics employ with their Tone print pedals?

I hope not. That would be a bad idea. It pretty much guarantees obsolescence and prevents serviceability. And I think that's the main concern with the plus - it's already less likely to be fixable in the future, and the way to fix that isn't with even more fragile and/or proprietary technology.

Case in point for the TC pedals: I already have one pedal that isn't supported anymore and they won't release a needed firmware upgrade for. And their PC program doesn't work with high DPI displays (vital buttons disappear under the bottom of the display when scaled), so I have to find an old clunker of a PC to use it with.
Due to this, I won't buy another TC product, no matter how good they may sound, and the ones I have are packed away.

No, Fender, please don't go the consumerist route where customers are expected to toss and re-buy, toss and re-buy. We want our instruments to last, and be serviceable even 20-30 years down the road. The plus not being a success should show you this. Going digital with proprietary and short-lived protocols and interfaces would be even worse.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:22 am
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I take your point entirely. My main thrust was that it sat within a standard body so, if it went South, the guitar could have traditional/conventional components installed.

I agree entirely that digital microprocessors, and the like, are a potential liability and seem to have a very short lifespan. The main issue is, when they fail they fail. There is nothing you can do with them. You cant resolder a wire or swap in a blow capacitor if you could even establish what had failed in the first place.

We might go week at the knees for a 50 year old Strat or Amp but a ten year old phone is only worth the precious metals which can be salvaged from it.

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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:23 pm
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Do you guys know if I can buy solderless connectors that I can wire any soldered pickups to easily that would work with Fender's solderless electronics?


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:06 pm
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jfred1979 wrote:
Do you guys know if I can buy solderless connectors that I can wire any soldered pickups to easily that would work with Fender's solderless electronics?


That service diagram I linked to in an earlier post doesn't really show the plugs; you might have to take the pickguard off and measure/photo the plugs on the stock pickups to get the right size/shape. I would imagine that the plugs themselves are off-the-shelf connectors and not one of the proprietary parts Fender used on these.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 12:47 am
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I think the potential to source the plugs (and not have to buy 10,000) and then successfully crimp a conventional PUP wire on to the terminal post is all pretty remote.

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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 10:59 pm
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John Sims wrote:
I think the potential to source the plugs (and not have to buy 10,000) and then successfully crimp a conventional PUP wire on to the terminal post is all pretty remote.

Nah. If they kept the "Fender Solderless" pickup plugs the same as for the Select models (2013-2014), it's a standard 3-pin molex fan header plug, available in any quantity you like for a pittance.

Image

However, if they did the stupid thing that Gibson did with their "QuickConnect" and changed the plug so there are two different ones with the same name, and no way to tell from the packaging which one is which, nor which guitar needs which, then they've killed their own product, and like with Gibsons, users and techs are just going to snip them off anyhow.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 6:41 am
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arth1 wrote:
John Sims wrote:
I think the potential to source the plugs (and not have to buy 10,000) and then successfully crimp a conventional PUP wire on to the terminal post is all pretty remote.

Nah. If they kept the "Fender Solderless" pickup plugs the same as for the Select models (2013-2014), it's a standard 3-pin molex fan header plug, available in any quantity you like for a pittance.

Image

However, if they did the stupid thing that Gibson did with their "QuickConnect" and changed the plug so there are two different ones with the same name, and no way to tell from the packaging which one is which, nor which guitar needs which, then they've killed their own product, and like with Gibsons, users and techs are just going to snip them off anyhow.


Thanks; I couldn't find a photo like that for the OP. That what I remember the connectors looking like in the photos of the solderless N3s used in the American Deluxe Strat Plus, and that also looks like what they show in the Service Diagram wiring drawing.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 12:02 pm
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Thanks for the info everyone, my current thought is to possibly swap these N3's out with some of the Jeff Beck Hot Noiseless pickups. I figure if I get the solderless connectors I can plop them in easily and not screw with the wiring and hopefully get more of the sound I am going for. Just for some perspective, here are a couple of screen grabs of the direct signal into a freq analysis tool in my DAW. Look at that bridge pickup!!!! Its so low and lacking mids and lows that I almost feel like something is wrong. I'm using the standard tone card, is there anything else you guys can think of other than the pickups that would account for this?

Neck:
Image

Middle:
Image

Bridge:
Image


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:04 pm
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It appears the Hot Noiseless are not solderless! I guess I assumed there were a ton of their pickups that would be solderless, but I am having a hard time finding any. They don't list which ones are on their site as far as I can tell. Is the whole solderless thing something that they are dumping, just like the whole tone-card thing?


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:48 pm
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jfred1979 wrote:
It appears the Hot Noiseless are not solderless! I guess I assumed there were a ton of their pickups that would be solderless, but I am having a hard time finding any. They don't list which ones are on their site as far as I can tell. Is the whole solderless thing something that they are dumping, just like the whole tone-card thing?

Hot Noiseless are exactly what I'm going to put in mine. I don't believe they are available with plugs. I'll just cut the wire on the N3s back from the plug and solder the Noiseless ones to the plugs. Done.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:52 pm
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wmachine wrote:
jfred1979 wrote:
It appears the Hot Noiseless are not solderless! I guess I assumed there were a ton of their pickups that would be solderless, but I am having a hard time finding any. They don't list which ones are on their site as far as I can tell. Is the whole solderless thing something that they are dumping, just like the whole tone-card thing?

Hot Noiseless are exactly what I'm going to put in mine. I don't believe they are available with plugs. I'll just cut the wire on the N3s back from the plug and solder the Noiseless ones to the plugs. Done.


Got it... that's probably what I'll end up doing I suppose. Just kinda bummed that they hyped this solderless thing in the promo for this guitar and there's no pickups that support it...


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:38 pm
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jfred1979 wrote:
wmachine wrote:
jfred1979 wrote:
It appears the Hot Noiseless are not solderless! I guess I assumed there were a ton of their pickups that would be solderless, but I am having a hard time finding any. They don't list which ones are on their site as far as I can tell. Is the whole solderless thing something that they are dumping, just like the whole tone-card thing?

Hot Noiseless are exactly what I'm going to put in mine. I don't believe they are available with plugs. I'll just cut the wire on the N3s back from the plug and solder the Noiseless ones to the plugs. Done.


Got it... that's probably what I'll end up doing I suppose. Just kinda bummed that they hyped this solderless thing in the promo for this guitar and there's no pickups that support it...


They do. American Select, Texas Specials, Fat 50s to name a few. Just not Hot Noiseless.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 8:02 pm
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wmachine wrote:
jfred1979 wrote:
wmachine wrote:
jfred1979 wrote:
It appears the Hot Noiseless are not solderless! I guess I assumed there were a ton of their pickups that would be solderless, but I am having a hard time finding any. They don't list which ones are on their site as far as I can tell. Is the whole solderless thing something that they are dumping, just like the whole tone-card thing?

Hot Noiseless are exactly what I'm going to put in mine. I don't believe they are available with plugs. I'll just cut the wire on the N3s back from the plug and solder the Noiseless ones to the plugs. Done.


Got it... that's probably what I'll end up doing I suppose. Just kinda bummed that they hyped this solderless thing in the promo for this guitar and there's no pickups that support it...


They do. American Select, Texas Specials, Fat 50s to name a few. Just not Hot Noiseless.


At least they did - I imagine you can still track them down but they aren't on the Fender website any more.


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Post subject: Re: Pickup Change on American Deluxe Plus
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 9:23 pm
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jfred1979 wrote:
Look at that bridge pickup!!!! Its so low and lacking mids and lows that I almost feel like something is wrong. I'm using the standard tone card, is there anything else you guys can think of other than the pickups that would account for this?

Hi there looks lower in level and admittedly has a higher freq response but did you try raising the pickup to give you the level achieved by the others?
You could also lower the others if raising is not possible. :D


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