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Post subject: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:55 am
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Need some expert insight please;
Considering a Japanese manufactured Strat,

Serial Nr seems legit, P +6numbers, but guitar has no truss rod...can this be? And back plate is completely blank (i.e words Fender and "made in Japan" only appear on the frontside of headstock 'decal')

'Bridge pickup is not working... So if I spend the money to buy and repair, It must be worth while doing,

Your advice and comment will be appreciated,

Pictures below:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:20 am
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I don't claim to be an e expert, but starting this:

First of all, the pics go blurry when enlarged. Can you take some more in better lighting, that usually helps a bit with digi/phone cams.
And while at it: add pics of the headstock back, body back, under the pick guard etc; and definitely from the neck pocket & neck butt would be helpful.

Then the "no truss rod" issue: can't see in the pic if that's a vintage style truss rod, adjusted at the neck heel. I don't know anything of your guitar knowledge, so did you know there are several truss rod types..?

The serial number often gives pointers in authentication, but serials are easy to fake so I wouldn't trust it alone.
What's the background story of the guitar, and how much is the seller asking?


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:52 am
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Jhaylward wrote:
Need some expert insight please;
Considering a Japanese manufactured Strat,

Serial Nr seems legit, P +6numbers,
Japan 1992-1993
http://www.guitardaterproject.org/fender.aspx



but guitar has no truss rod...can this be? No, I see a wood shrunk where is the truss rod , back of the neck, Remove pickgard and look at the body side, you must see the truss rod head

And back plate is completely blank (i.e words Fender and "made in Japan" only appear on the frontside of headstock 'decal')

'Bridge pickup is not working... So if I spend the money to buy and repair, It must be worth while doing,

Your advice and comment will be appreciated,

Pictures below: Very poor.

]


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 7:25 am
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Jhay, I don't claim to be an expert on mid-nineties Japanese Strats, but it is common knowledge that the Japanese are usually pretty anal when it comes to QC and workmanship, so a couple of items in your photos give me some pause:
1) area at heel of rear of neck where the serial number decal is located appears to be discolored, as though it has possibly been sanded, and then (poorly) re-stained with a non-matching wood stain, and a new decal added; 2) Don't these guitars of this vintage usually have a "Made/Crafted in Japan" decal or stamp included above serial number?; 3) Pick guard does not appear to fit guitar-it seems to encroach over the bottom fretboard of the guitar at top, bottom, and sides.
Once again, I'm no expert on these models, and more and better pictures would certainly help.
If you look online, you will find several site devoted to guys who are expert aficionados of Japanese Fenders from the seventies to the nineties who can probably help.
There is a guy named Xhefri who knows damn near everything about Japanese Strats, and is an occasional poster here, and has his own website as well , it may be worthwhile looking him up. What really matters is how well you like the guitar, how much work it needs, and what the price is. Good luck, O...


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 8:04 am
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Those observations are what I thought, too - plus the "Original Contour Body" sticker is missing on the front of the headstock...
Still, there may be logical explanations for these, and generally speaking there's no blatant fake signs on what we see.
So a) at this point and b) on those photos, I can't say for sure (= sure as possible via internet, usually less than 100% certainty) one way or another.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 11:06 am
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nyquilcoma wrote:
Jhay, I don't claim to be an expert on mid-nineties Japanese Strats, but it is common knowledge that the Japanese are usually pretty anal when it comes to QC and workmanship, so a couple of items in your photos give me some pause:
1) area at heel of rear of neck where the serial number decal is located appears to be discolored, as though it has possibly been sanded, and then (poorly) re-stained with a non-matching wood stain, and a new decal added; 2) Don't these guitars of this vintage usually have a "Made/Crafted in Japan" decal or stamp included above serial number?; 3) Pick guard does not appear to fit guitar-it seems to encroach over the bottom fretboard of the guitar at top, bottom, and sides.
Once again, I'm no expert on these models, and more and better pictures would certainly help.
If you look online, you will find several site devoted to guys who are expert aficionados of Japanese Fenders from the seventies to the nineties who can probably help.
There is a guy named Xhefri who knows damn near everything about Japanese Strats, and is an occasional poster here, and has his own website as well , it may be worthwhile looking him up. What really matters is how well you like the guitar, how much work it needs, and what the price is. Good luck, O...
See bold/underlined 1) - That discoloration is where the finish faded and the unfinished part that was attached to the neck pocket is now showing. To the OP - Did you loosen the neck and move it out of the pocket and/or is the neck seriously crooked? It's either one or the other.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 11:17 am
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... Or someone matted the neck for playability and sanded the neck heel for better fit, wanted to keep the serial number while at the same time wasn't keen on saving the part about Japan...
No way to tell on the info given.

Edit: An apology to both nyquilcoma & LawFlow is in order; from the beginning of the topic I made a decision to not start any guesswork because of the lack of info so far, and now I seem to be getting edgy if someone doesn't follow my lead. No offence, no censorship meant.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:03 pm
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jmattis wrote:
... Or someone matted the neck for playability and sanded the neck heel for better fit, wanted to keep the serial number while at the same time wasn't keen on saving the part about Japan...
No way to tell on the info given.

Edit: An apology to both nyquilcoma & LawFlow is in order; from the beginning of the topic I made a decision to not start any guesswork because of the lack of info so far, and now I seem to be getting edgy if someone doesn't follow my lead. No offence, no censorship meant.
No problem here. I missed anything like that. Anyway, while I'm at it, I noticed when I first saw the pictures, the skunk stripe is very noticeably crooked. Perhaps it's a bad angle. Then I noticed the finish disparity and knew something wasn't right. We will just have to wait and see. :?


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:52 pm
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Hi all,
Thanks very much for each one's input, I appreciate it ...

Note: Unfortunately pictures were sent to me, :( and I didn't have opportunity to take some myself yet;

Asking price: $375

--- I really wasn't aware of the truss rod that adjusts from the heel :( --- one learn something new everyday ;) ---

So the take away points really, I suppose are, ... chances are it's legit ;) ... A strip and further check "on inside" and neck heel could reveal more...
If seller accepts an offer of $150-200 ? It could be worth it?

;) blessings


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:10 pm
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I looked at this earlier, and nothing screams out as being out of place, except for the lack of either Made In Japan, or Crafted In Japan at the neck heel.
Sanding the neck for playability would explain this lack of MIJ/CIJ.

It looks likely to be a legit Japanese Fender.
The tuners look to be Gotoh's standard fair.

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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:29 am
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If there is any doubt of origin on any Strat:
One "absolute must" check is the trem cover screw holes in the back of a guitar - if the middle screws are level with each other, it's a strong sign of a Squier.
On MIJ/CIJ guitars, I'd always check the neck pocket & neck heel - Japanese instruments have their characteristic stamps and markings - although it's sometimes hard to separate Squiers and Fenders.
This guitar might (thinking: should) have ST-57 stamped on the pocket.

My general and IMHO evaluation for this guitar is, those pics show no blatant/typical fake signs. Anyway, there are so many irregulations (plus the electronics problems) that the price should be way below the general level for MIJ Fenders of that era (and not significantly above the MIJ Squiers), in the region it's sold.
Of course, the final risk & final price negotiations fall to the buyer.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:46 am
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Thanks!

Appreciate the comments and advice. It helps


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 1:39 pm
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To jmattis: certainly no offense taken here either-as I stated, I don't pretend to be an expert on these models.
It does seem kind of odd that only that one portion of the neck appears to have been sanded and re-stained. I also hadn't noticed that the skunk stripe seems to be kinda off kilter, but that could just be the angle of the photo.
As I understand it, the Japanese Fenders usually had varying levels of prices (e.g., Y XXXX for how much Yen was MFSRP) & model repros (e.g., ST-57, for 1957 Stratocaster reproduction) that are indicated by specific letters and numbers at neck pocket, and pencilled/stamped in/on neck heel, and there are online guides that interpret them. How long this practice continued, I don't know. Definitely necessary to pop neck and investigate. This should be a starting point for the OP to check into whether this is a complete Fender Japan Strat, or a Japanese Squier Strat, or any combination thereof. HTH...O


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2016 2:29 am
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Got to take issue with the tuners.
The ST-57s I've seen had Gotoh vintage Kluson types not modern bolt fixing ones.


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Post subject: Re: Real or Fake - Japanese Strat
Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:42 am
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The logo isn't what you'd expect to see on a '57, so it isn't a vintage replica.
There are plenty of Japanese Fenders with those Gotoh machines - my HM Strat has those tuners in black.

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