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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 3:16 am
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Thanks a lot, Waymore - you do very good photos! Do you use Photobucket? I'm still trying to get to grips with that!

As far as thread length goes, our trem arms look the same. Plus I have a couple of AmStd spares I've also tried, and again their thread lengths look the same. However, your "11 turns till you feel the spring tensioning" is very different. I can get 5.75 turns max (tight to the bottom of the hole), with or without the spring; a turn or more less if you fit the spring and just tighten it until it binds.

Strange eh? But we've hit on why the arm wobbles! Also why it sticks out of the block much more than it should. It's as if something's blocking the end of the hole, but it's nothing obvious or visible, and the spring drops in and out OK. I've tried clearing the hole with various things, including stud extractors, and nothing's come out. Drilling it out, sleeving it and re-tapping the thread is possible but frankly, I'd sooner buy another block! Also, to get round it, I tried an spare block (off a '93 Plus) but unfortunately and understandably it doesn't quite fit the Special baseplate. The Special block has 'PW-36' stamped on it - I assume that's the same as yours?

For use at present, I'm using an AmStd arm on which I cut the threaded part down a bit (ages ago). This at least brings the arm down to manageable height (for me), and - if I tighten the arm a turn more than I normally would - stops the wobble to a large extent.

But long-term, I probably need to replace this block, possibly the arm (to get an unworn matching thread), and probably buy the Highwood saddles. May as well buy a complete new Callaham or SuperVee!

But before I decide what exactly to do about the trem, I'm going to set the guitar up for 9's and fettle the existing saddle screws. If I make them a bit more sociable, I can at least play it comfortably for now!

Cheers - Peter.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 3:52 am
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Quote:
Thanks a lot, Waymore - you do very good photos! Do you use Photobucket? I'm still trying to get to grips with that!


photobucket or Imageshack, just copy the "direct link" and paste it between img cases.
and yeah only the "direct link" will work.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 3:56 am
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as if something's blocking the end of the hole, but it's nothing obvious or visible, and the spring drops in and out OK


Maybe the lower ends of the thread are shot so they act like a blockage, I would try running a thread making tool trough it and actually that would cut trough those screwed up threads making em usable again and probably wouldn't need to re sleeve.
It's easiest way to try, before changing the block.
Cheers.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 4:01 am
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Quote:
But before I decide what exactly to do about the trem, I'm going to set the guitar up for 9's and fettle the existing saddle screws. If I make them a bit more sociable, I can at least play it comfortably for now!


To be honest who knows what was all tempered with that block...screws shoudn't stick out to a point it hurts your palm, it could be neck height but I doubt (post pics),
I would first measure where they are now with action as you like it, than take the saddles out, polish em cut the bolts, send the top of the bolts so they are smooth and I think you'll be fine.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 10:40 am
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Sorry to butt in, but this got my curiosity going. I've looked at Fender's online photos of the Specials and it appears the arms do seem to stick up out of the bridge higher than the American Standards. Is this what you guys have observed or is it just the photo angles?

I have a 2014 MIA Standard and would probably use the trem more if the arm was shorter and didn't stick up in the air so much. It seems inconvenient to me. Are there shorter, less angled arms available with the standard threads? Fender does not seem to have them. I like the way the Elite/Deluxe trem arms look. Also, I've set my action and relief lower than Fender specs and it works very nice without buzzing. Relief is lower than .008" and action at 17th fret is between 3/64" & 4/64". My only complaint is the screws stick out too much, mainly low E but also others. This would happen even if I raised the strings it seems, so I don't know what the deal is there. My bridge floats and sits up about 2.5mm from the body. I'm not going to mess with neck angle and I can live with it. Just wondering if this is common or unusual. Any thoughts from anyone about saddle screws and trem arms?


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 2:06 pm
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The trem arms have the same thread size but are sold with different part numbers, so they may sit differently on the guitar.

@PeterS, my guess (as above Waymore's) is that there's something fishy on your trem block threads. Doable to fix, but often it's a lot easier to get a new block.

@LawFlow, there are options for the too long, too high, too curved (etc.) trem arm fix. The old school way is to bend/shorten etc. the trem arm to your liking. One remark: if a trem arm sits real low, one can only use it till it hits the body (the story goes Hendrix bent his trem arms higher to be able to dive more...).
If you don't want to risk breaking the arm, you could check out commercially available shorter trem arms, e.g. "the Gilmour arm"
On the too long screws issue, check the previous pages of this topic... OK, I'll make it easy and give a summary: a) shorten the existing screws, b) buy new shorter screws or c) shim the neck.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 9:21 pm
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jmattis wrote:
The trem arms have the same thread size but are sold with different part numbers, so they may sit differently on the guitar.

@PeterS, my guess (as above Waymore's) is that there's something fishy on your trem block threads. Doable to fix, but often it's a lot easier to get a new block.

@LawFlow, there are options for the too long, too high, too curved (etc.) trem arm fix. The old school way is to bend/shorten etc. the trem arm to your liking. One remark: if a trem arm sits real low, one can only use it till it hits the body (the story goes Hendrix bent his trem arms higher to be able to dive more...).
If you don't want to risk breaking the arm, you could check out commercially available shorter trem arms, e.g. "the Gilmour arm"
On the too long screws issue, check the previous pages of this topic... OK, I'll make it easy and give a summary: a) shorten the existing screws, b) buy new shorter screws or c) shim the neck.
Hey, I appreciate that. I ordered the shorter, lower arm today. Exactly what I'm wanting. I got the 4 1/4" drop down which was noted as the most popular. Even has the matching parchment tip. For less than $20, it's worth a shot. Also ordered 2 more Trem springs. I can live with the saddle screws which aren't bad, just not flush. Thanks.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:34 am
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OK chaps - I've now doctored my saddle screws to my satisfaction - no lacerations, guaranteed!

However, measured against one of my AmStds, the threaded trem arm hole is about 1/4" shallower! This means I'm missing about 8 turns when screwing the arm in. Have run a tap down the hole, inspected it with a magnifying glass, dug it out, you name it, but it just seems to be a simple manufacturing difference. Either that or there's something jammed in there that's resisted all efforts to either see, feel or dislodge. The arms themselves (AmStd or Special) are indeed roughly the same, as you all suggested - certainly the threaded part is the same length on each.

Thought you might like to see a photo anyway! The trem arm shown is an old one which I cut about half the threaded portion off years ago. Looks fine but isn't how I like it, so the whole unit will be replaced at some point. No rush, though!

Cheers - Peter.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:06 pm
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Wow it's a beauty! Realy like it
Also I see you like your floating bridge around the same height as me.
Cheers


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:10 pm
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Also I see on the second pic your neck is set lower than mine, at least it looks like that and if pups are set to Fender specs (3.2 bass 2.4mm treble)

Image


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:13 am
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Thanks Waymore - at least the surf green came out reasonably well on the main photo. Surf or Sea Foam often looks more blue, doesn't it?!

Just noticed on the 2nd photo that the saddle screws aren't as 'even' as I thought - because I moved the shorter E screws around a bit and shortened the others. Bit more swapping around should do it, from a cosmetic point of view!

Maybe my neck's lower than yours - it would certainly explain why your saddle screws don't stick up like mine did - but I wouldn't necessarily base that on the p/up positions as shown. It takes me weeks, if not months, to get a new Strat adjusted to how I like it (and will keep it). So at present the p/ups might be in the Fender-recommended positions - or they might not!

Funnily enough, when I took the neck off (I always check for nasty paper labels between the wood-to-wood joint) there was a thin strip of ply already shimming the neck back a bit. Looks factory original to me - do they do this - it's a new one on me? Surprised they didn't make it a bit thicker while they were about it and get the saddle screw height right!

I'm not a fan of shimming, but may make an exception in this case if/when I get a new trem unit and string height is greater.

Cheers - Peter.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:53 pm
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Peter S wrote:
Thanks Waymore - at least the surf green came out reasonably well on the main photo. Surf or Sea Foam often looks more blue, doesn't it?!

Just noticed on the 2nd photo that the saddle screws aren't as 'even' as I thought - because I moved the shorter E screws around a bit and shortened the others. Bit more swapping around should do it, from a cosmetic point of view!

Maybe my neck's lower than yours - it would certainly explain why your saddle screws don't stick up like mine did - but I wouldn't necessarily base that on the p/up positions as shown. It takes me weeks, if not months, to get a new Strat adjusted to how I like it (and will keep it). So at present the p/ups might be in the Fender-recommended positions - or they might not!

Funnily enough, when I took the neck off (I always check for nasty paper labels between the wood-to-wood joint) there was a thin strip of ply already shimming the neck back a bit. Looks factory original to me - do they do this - it's a new one on me? Surprised they didn't make it a bit thicker while they were about it and get the saddle screw height right!

I'm not a fan of shimming, but may make an exception in this case if/when I get a new trem unit and string height is greater.

Cheers - Peter.


I didn't use pups a reference point only take a look at the thickness of the neck above scratch plate at your pic and mine, looks like there considerably higher in my case.

I didn't noticed anything between the neck and the body seems flush without shims.

I also heard many guys finding on necks of Specials when they removed em a stamp "Highway 1 upgrade"

It also takes me a few weeks of tweaking to get exactly how I like it, I finally finished few days ago. I'm bit OCD when it comes to setup.

So all my strings are 1.6mm or 4/64 at 17th fret with capo on first and neck relief is .010 (no fret buzz even with my Knopflerian style of picking) and I found that I like the tremolo bridge sitting half of Fender's recommend so around 1,5-1,16 mm and all 5 springs pulling it back.

If you decide to shim the neck I would always use a thin piece of wood, any wood but definitely thin piece, you can get made at local wood shop.

Cheers.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 3:46 am
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I didn't use pups a reference point only take a look at the thickness of the neck above scratch plate at your pic and mine, looks like there considerably higher in my case.


Ah yes - I see what you mean. You'd have thought, as mine is shimmed, it'd be the other way round. Manufacturing tolerances, I suppose. It's definitely all Am Special - all stamps/labels say so.

Having now compared overall string height (off the body/scratchplate) with my other Strats, it's about the same, so I doubt I'll need to fiddle with it. The guitar's now comfortable to play, with the only problem being the much-discussed and very puzzling trem (block), which is pretty much unusable for me!

I may try the CS '69 p/ups again, or several others I have kicking around, but that's minor. I always find that certain p/ups sound good in one Strat and bad in another, so I like playing around with them a bit when it costs nothing to do it!

Cheers - Peter.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 4:57 am
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Peter S wrote:
Having now compared overall string height (off the body/scratchplate) with my other Strats, it's about the same, so I doubt I'll need to fiddle with it.

This puzzles me totally - maybe I understood you wrong.
Anyway, string height above the body/pickguard can and may be totally different between different guitars (even Strats of the same model series), it's the 17th fret string height = action = gap from fret top to string bottom at that point that counts.


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Post subject: Re: Callaham VN bridge or what?
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 5:30 am
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maybe I understood you wrong


Just a bit, JM - I'm obviously very poor at making myself clear!

Obviously the action is the thing that matters. But I also like my Strats to have roughly the same feel. For me, part of that means that the strings are around the same distance from the body/scratchplate. Nothing to do with action.

If that's not clear, I give up! Cheers - Peter.


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