It is currently Mon Mar 16, 2020 8:14 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
Post subject: Which amp?
Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:36 pm
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:33 pm
Posts: 9
Hi, I'm looking for an amp that I can play modern country through, as well as 80s rock wich nowadays they're about the same. I would like to have some versatility, and be able to get that clean sound as well if possible.I'm willing to spend up to $2,000. Any suggestions? Thank you


Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 1:10 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star

Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:53 am
Posts: 4240
Twin Reverb plus the overdrive/distortion/fuzz/delay/etc. pedals of your choice.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 4:13 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician

Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:27 am
Posts: 396
I'd go for a Deluxe Reverb + effects. Twin is too big, unless you're constantly playing in stadiums in which case you wouldn't need our help :)
I can tell you the effects I use with my Deluxe, if you're interested.

_________________
Image
Gear: Gibson Les Paul Studio Limited WBCR (2 Burstbucker Pro PUPs)
Fender Stratocaster Highway One
'93 Fender Deluxe Reverb Reissue


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 6:17 am
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 4:31 am
Posts: 14045
Location: Province de Québec, Canada
Which amp did you bought ?


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 4:51 am
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:01 pm
Posts: 1598
Neimenljivi wrote:
Twin is too big,


A Twin is too big for what? Bars & clubs?? You're joking right? I could be wrong, but I strongly suspect that the Fender Twin has seen more roadhouses than any other amp ever built!

While I play mostly classic rock, blues and oldies, I actually play a pretty wide range of material from Southern rock and country to some classic metal. I've used Twins on occasion (a 70's Master Volume version), I'm very fond of Roland JC-120's and currently I use a Lab L5 (which is about as close as you can get to a Twin in a Solid State)...to me at least, the 100 watt 2 x 12 combo is the perfect size amp for gigging.

Particularly with stuff like country, you just really can't have too much clean headroom. While this is just my own experience, in a medium to large size club and particularly in a well crowed club, 22 watts (even with some hot tubes) really just doesn't cut it. It may be fine if the bar is empty, but if you have a good crowd, forget it. You can get some great distortion at that lower wattage, but trying to get a solid clean sound can be really difficult....if you have to turn everything up to 10 just to be heard over the drummer, then you're NOT going to get a good clean tone. Sometimes you can mic the amp into the PA, but not everyone has that luxury (and personally I don't like to have the guitar amps on the monitors on a small PA anyways as it tends to muddy up the vocal mix).

I can't speak for others, but personally I just can't imagine gigging with anything less than a 40 - 60 watt amp...again 80 - 100 watt 2 x 12 seems to be ideal to cover the majority of venues I play at.

Just my own opinion.

______________

To the OP...

I suspect that you're probably gonna find that everyone and his brother has an amp they're gonna recommend. Amps, like the guitar you play and the pedals you use, are a very personal choice for most....every one has different taste. Aside from the power issue I mentioned above (I recommend at least 60 watts for average club gigs), as with guitars, my advice would be to take your favorite guitar with you to the music shops and play thru AS MANY amps as you can get your hands on and simply get the amp that sounds best to your ears. You are the one who's gonna be playing thru it, so you're the one who has to live with the sound.

That said, I have to second jmartis there...if you're doing country and you need clean, you can't go wrong with a Twin. Country, blues, jazz, classic rock...a good Twin Reverb pretty much does it all. It really is the "working musician's amp".

Good Luck!


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 5:15 am
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 4:31 am
Posts: 14045
Location: Province de Québec, Canada
lomitus wrote:
Neimenljivi wrote:
Twin is too big,


A Twin is too big for what? Bars & clubs?? You're joking right? I could be wrong, but I strongly suspect that the Fender Twin has seen more roadhouses than any other amp ever built!

!


Yes Twin was a must before every amp are miked to a club's sound system.

For 2015 use, Twin is too heavy first and no need for this power .


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 11:18 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:50 pm
Posts: 7998
Location: ʎɹʇunoɔ ǝsoɹ pןıʍ
I can count on one hand the number of country music guitarists I've seen who didn't use a Twin Reverb. IMO it is an essential ingredient.

_________________
Image
Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 11:22 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:50 pm
Posts: 7998
Location: ʎɹʇunoɔ ǝsoɹ pןıʍ
OK, maybe not one hand. I've prolly seen a dozen or so who used a Dual Professional .... Which is basically a Twin Reverb on steroids.

_________________
Image
Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:46 am
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:01 pm
Posts: 1598
stratele52 wrote:
For 2015 use, Twin is too heavy first and no need for this power .


"Too Heavy"...
As one who's approaching 50 years old much faster than he'd like to admit and particularly as one who has lower back issues and such, I can make some concessions regarding weight, however I equally have to feel this is also a matter of perspective as well. Yea, when I was MUCH younger, I used to haul around a half stack. Back in those days my friends and the majority of people I worked with were certainly younger too and I could usually sucker somone into helping move my gear around, LOL! I will even admit that yes, today if I'm just going to a practice or jam or something, I will take a smaller amp (usually my little Peavey) just because it's soooooo much easier on the back. However...

A simple fact here is that for a working musician, unless you're bringing down enough coin to hire some roadies, the truth is that moving gear goes with the turf. One of the bands I'm currently working with has a show coming up on the 18th and yes, I not only get to move all my guitar gear (going to use 2 amps at this show along with 3 or 4 guitars), I also have the monitor system as well (the bass player has the mains)...I get to drag all that stuff up from the basement studio, pack it into the van, unload it at the bar, then after a 4 hours show at 2 in the morning, I have to break it all down, load it back into the van and move it all back into the basement when I get home. It's goes with the job.

I can't speak to others here, but personally moving a 2 x12 combo amp (Twin or otherwise) is MUCH easier than moving a half stack around and it's NOTHING compared to moving the damn PA system in and out of the club at night (or even drum hardware)! At this point in my life and my career as a musician, when I get payed to do a gig, I don't look at the money as getting "payed to play" as much as simply getting payed to move the gear in and out of the bar, LOL!!!

Sorry dude, but moving that gear around goes with being a working musician.


"no need for this power"...
I have to completely disagree with this for all the reasons I've already mentioned. Except for some dinky little coffee house with only 10 or 15 patrons, I honestly can't imagine going on stage with anything less than 40 to 60 watts of power in my amp....80 to 100 watts is usually ideal. In an average bar where we may be playing to 100 people or more, then having a powerful amp is absolutely essential. My philosophy is simply this; if you're too loud you can always turn down (something a lot of people seem to forget), but if you're amp isn't loud enough...you're screwed. Unless you mic it into the PA (not everyone has that luxury), there's just NO WAY to make up for an under-powered amp.

Again I usually play thru my Lab L5 at gigs...the L5 is quite possibly the loudest 100 watts you'll ever hear in a 2 x12 combo (that sucker really can shake the floor, LOL!). Sure...most shows that thing never goes past 4 or 5 tops and for smaller shows, it's usually set around 3, however -if- I need the power, it's there...I have the headroom available and there have been shows where that amp gets pushed A LOT harder where a smaller amp just would NOT cut it.

I would quickly add that an amp is simply a tool...and as always, you should use the right tool for the right job. If I'm sitting here next to my computer in the upstairs bedroom just jamming with some mp3's for practice (or fun), then sure...I use my little Roland Microcube (pretty wicked little amp really). For full band practices or the occasional weekend jam, I'll typically use a more mid-sized amp such as one of my Peavey's or my Bugera. For recording, I'll simply use whichever amp sounds best for the type of music I'm recording (and often I've just gone direct into the board). For a live gig however, you need to have that power to reach the folks in the back row...there's no two ways about it. If people can't hear you over the drummer and the bass player, then there's just no point in playing.

I play mostly classic rock, blues and oldies and quite frankly, trying to play contemporary music with a small amp at a club with a live band is akin to trying to merge into 55 mph traffic on the highway while riding a bicycle...ya just can't do it because no matter how hard you peddle, you're never going to be going fast enough. If you're only playing small coffee house type gigs or you're only playing in your bedroom or basement, then a Twin may be a bit too much power (although I certainly used a Twin in my basement for a while), however for many working musicians in most genres of contemporary music, it really is a pretty ideal size.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 10:40 am
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:25 pm
Posts: 1022
As you can see from previous posts, where you will be playing will determinte your power requirements. How much you can lift also is a consideration.
As far as clean country, no amp with a tone stack will do it right. The tone stack distorts through the midrange. This eliminates most tube amps. If you can find an Alamo Fury or a Standell, these have clean SS tone controls, preamps and tube outputs
For clean clean and lots of headroom, find a solid state bass combo. A small 60-150 watt should do.
Obviously, this won't do for R&R. Yes, I'm suggesting two amps. An amp that does both will probably do neither very well.
A tube amp with foot-switchable channels of appropriate wattage will do you nicely for modern rock. Don't expect the drive channel to be sufficient for all overdrive tones. Use pedals as well. Try out a Fender Blues Deluxe


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 2:10 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:01 pm
Posts: 1598
TimsAudio wrote:
As you can see from previous posts, where you will be playing will determinte your power requirements. How much you can lift also is a consideration.
As far as clean country, no amp with a tone stack will do it right. The tone stack distorts through the midrange. This eliminates most tube amps. If you can find an Alamo Fury or a Standell, these have clean SS tone controls, preamps and tube outputs
For clean clean and lots of headroom, find a solid state bass combo. A small 60-150 watt should do.
Obviously, this won't do for R&R. Yes, I'm suggesting two amps. An amp that does both will probably do neither very well.
A tube amp with foot-switchable channels of appropriate wattage will do you nicely for modern rock. Don't expect the drive channel to be sufficient for all overdrive tones. Use pedals as well. Try out a Fender Blues Deluxe


While I do fully agree with your comment regarding power needs vs. venue and I can even give you some degree of concession regarding the use of two amps (I do this occasionally myself), I have to totally disagree with your comment about the use of tube amps for country. As BMW points out up there, MANY country artists use Twins and Dual Showman's, etc. (both all tube) and I suspect there's probably a few old Supers still floating around out there. In fact going back to Fender's early days, there' was always something of a relationship between Fender and country artists. While this is obviously a broad generalization, it also tends to be true more often than not...Marshall's were always great for rock and roll and Fenders were the amp of choice for blues and country players.

In general, a ss will usually give one more clean headroom than tubes, however how much of that headroom is needed comes back to the power issue...and that's not necessarily indicative of tubes or solid state as either will do the job.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2015 10:16 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star

Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:53 am
Posts: 4240
TimsAudio wrote:
Yes, I'm suggesting two amps.
A Twin does both jobs, but I might still reprase my previous to two Twin Reverbs - after all, it's always good to have a backup amp... :lol:
TimsAudio wrote:
Alamo Fury or a Standell
Alamo Fury is sort of a Bassman, right? And the (vintage) Standel's were in many ways the predecessors to Fender amps?

@jfk, maybe it's time to tell us what you got. BTW, is there a difference between traditional country cleans and modern country cleans?


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 9:31 am
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:25 pm
Posts: 1022
Please forgive my technician's impertinence. I didn't mean to suggest all these talented musicians were doing it wrong. It's just that, from a design standpoint, the amps designed for clean country playing used a clean tone control, not a tone stack. I also use a screwdriver as a prybar or pliers as a hammer and it works fine. So I'll allow them all the creative leeway they need.
The Standell and Alamo amps that came across my bench both had clean transistor preamp and tone controls. Both used HiFi power tubes for a clean power stage, unlike anything that Fender or Musicman ever built.
Since modern country has adopted a rock beat, I would expect they also adopted rock amps, so a Twin would work in both circumstances. But the poster did not indicate if they would be playing bedrooms or taverns, It seems unlikely they would be playing both types of music at the same gig, so two amps are indicated. For $2000, he could buy both.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 6:54 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 12:45 pm
Posts: 1169
TimsAudio wrote:
Please forgive my technician's impertinence. I didn't mean to suggest all these talented musicians were doing it wrong. It's just that, from a design standpoint, the amps designed for clean country playing used a clean tone control, not a tone stack. I also use a screwdriver as a prybar or pliers as a hammer and it works fine. So I'll allow them all the creative leeway they need.
The Standell and Alamo amps that came across my bench both had clean transistor preamp and tone controls. Both used HiFi power tubes for a clean power stage, unlike anything that Fender or Musicman ever built.
Since modern country has adopted a rock beat, I would expect they also adopted rock amps, so a Twin would work in both circumstances. But the poster did not indicate if they would be playing bedrooms or taverns, It seems unlikely they would be playing both types of music at the same gig, so two amps are indicated. For $2000, he could buy both.


How does a traditional tone stack, which is completely passive, distort?

_________________
In my opinion Leo Fender had essentially perfected the guitar amplifier by 1964.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Which amp?
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 9:25 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician

Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:25 pm
Posts: 1022
The tone stack distortion comes from phase error. The preamp signal is fed into a 250 pf treble capacitor and a .1uf bass capacitor. Their output is fed to the ends of the treble control.

Each capacitor has its own passband of frequencies. They are chosen to overlap through the midrange, from 150Hz-600Hz.

Each capacitor has a time constant, which translates to a small delay in its output. The larger capacitor has more phase lag in the output compared with the smaller treble cap.
When these out-of-phase signals are mixed at the wiper of the treble control, they interact to distort the sine wave and reduce the midrange response.
This is the classic , "scooped midrange response" of the tone stack. By reducing mid response, it compensated for high midrange sensitivity of the human ear to balance the sound.

You can discern the dirt produced through the midrange when you swing the treble control lock to lock.
If you play at 5, then 1, then 10, you will hear the tone slightly clean up at each lock compared to the center. This is because you are selecting only one capacitor at 1 & 10

But more than that, the phase error essentially produces the effect of two guitars playing. As the out-of-phase signals interact, they add and subtract their signals to produce the classic, "Fender Shimmer"through the sustain of a decaying note

When Marshall,"adopted" the tone stack, the .1 was changes to .02 for less bass and less phase distortion for clean hi lead guitar. I think some of the Fender Supers and the Blues Jr also used the .02 for Bass.


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: