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Post subject: Mic suggestions
Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 8:23 am
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I am am pretty skilled electric guitar player, and I recently just bought a bass. I have started to record some demos and stuff on my own as well as some in my band. I previously used the built in mic in my computer because that was one of my only options at the time however I found online that you can use rock band mics through your computer lol. I started doing that and it sounds good however I am wanting to purchase a mic that will better record my guitar and bass amp as well as some singing. I am only using one mic so I'm not sure whether I need to buy a normal mic and buy a mixer to transfer it to a computer or buy a USB mic that will plug directly into a computer. Due to the fact that I just spend almost $500 on a new bass and amp and that I am only 15, I want a mic that is not extremely expensive but will get the job done nicely. Please feel free to give me suggestions on possible mic ideas!!!
Thanks!


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 8:40 am
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A lot of people use the Sure SM57 as a "go to" mic for anything from instruments to amps to vocals to drums. They are around $100 but a great investment. Is that too pricey for your budget?

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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 12:11 pm
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Quote:
not sure whether I need to buy a normal mic and buy a mixer to transfer it to a computer

You may not need a mixer. Most computer soundcards have a microphone input. However you'll need to check whether this really accepts a microphone-level signal or is actually a line-level input. Or it may be software-configurable what level signal it expects.


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 2:43 pm
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A USB mic would be your cheapest route for sure. But I don't recommend it because you will quickly out grow what it can do. Looking ahead and starting on a path which you can expand upon is the best way to go IMO but you will probably have to spend about twice as much as you would for a good USB mic.

If you decide to go the second route, I have a few recommendations...

I have a couple Digital Reference DRI-100s in my home studio that I use in place of SM57's. A good budget all around general purpose mic in my opinion but read the reviews and watch this video and decide for your self.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4SmM61km44

Of coarse, that leaves you with needing a mixer. I would suggest one of these. I believe jedi2b uses one also or a XENEX-802 which is virtually the same thing (I have one of those also). Even as your studio grows and you get a bigger mixer, you can always use of one as a sub-mixer - trust me.

I am still on XP in my studio, so I have no budget audio interface to recommend as I am sure there are better choices than what I have.


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:23 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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indeed, I use a behringer 802 mixer as audio interface (around 85$)
For a while I tried to use the Mustang USB interface but it really sounds bad (too harsh)
So instead I mic the mustang with an all purpose peavey dynamic mic (around 25$)
http://www.amazon.com/Peavey-Dynamic-Vo ... B000W348OO
Excellent mic for the price.

from the mixer i usually go thru the mic input, as USB recording on windows is a pain in the back.
Wonderful combination. I don't think I will ever outgrow that setup :)


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:57 pm
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SM57 is what you want. Its the workhorse. Cheap and just plain works.

I used to work in a recording studio and the mics we used for the Guitar tracks were SM57, AT 4033 and U87 for acoustic.

Studio work has shrivelled up with the onset of cheap DAWs but the SM57s versatility has not.

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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 5:01 am
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Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:11 am
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kdogex wrote:
I am am pretty skilled electric guitar player, and I recently just bought a bass. I have started to record some demos and stuff on my own as well as some in my band. I previously used the built in mic in my computer because that was one of my only options at the time however I found online that you can use rock band mics through your computer lol. I started doing that and it sounds good however I am wanting to purchase a mic that will better record my guitar and bass amp as well as some singing. I am only using one mic so I'm not sure whether I need to buy a normal mic and buy a mixer to transfer it to a computer or buy a USB mic that will plug directly into a computer. Due to the fact that I just spend almost $500 on a new bass and amp and that I am only 15, I want a mic that is not extremely expensive but will get the job done nicely. Please feel free to give me suggestions on possible mic ideas!!!
Thanks!


Welcome to your expensive new hobby!!! ;)

One thing to consider here is where this will all eventually go if you continue. Ultimately to get the best recordings you will undoubtedly need to get an audio interface which will provide multiple inputs for guitar, bass, and vocals through a USB or Firewire port into your recording software on your computer. In some ways that would be your mixer for recording as well as playback either through headsets or monitors plugged into the audio interface. Basically it takes the place of the audio card in your computer. There are any number of good ones and the prices are coming down all the time.

For the most part these audio interfaces will take XLR or 1/4 inch inputs either from a mic (typically for vocals) or as a direct in from the XLR outputs of your amps (the preferred method) or by mic'ing the amps. It might be penny-wise but pound-foolish to get a USB mic as this will be useless once to get to the next logical stage of recording with an audio interface. Something like an SM-57 would likely last a long time for both recording and live performance. But without an audio interface you would need to get a patch cable or some other direct in box to convert from the XLR to the 3.5mm mic input on your computer.

I'd hate to see you spend money on a USB mic that you would outgrow in probably less than a year once you really get into recording.

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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:35 am
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Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 4:04 am
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+1 SM57


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:43 am
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:08 am
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totally agree with dunedindragon. I do not see any use for USB mics in the mid/long term.
there are 3 ways I would suggest you get the audio into your computer:
-an external USB/Firewire audio interface with multiple inputs/outputs, something like any focusrite interface
-an external analog mixer (I would recommend 8 channels as a minimum), and then get from the mixer to the pc thru the PC mic input:
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/802.aspx
-an external analog mixer (similar to previous one), and then get from the mixer to the pc thru usb output on the mixer
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/Q802USB.aspx

the advantage of the mixer setups is that you do NOT need a pc for live/jams music. Additionally I prefer using real knobs for mixing compared to software controls. The other thing is, if you are using a PC with windows, doing USB recording will drive you nuts, windows is terrible compared to OSX in this respect.

now, for getting your audio from Mustang to either external USB interface or mixer, you have essentially two methods (if you disregard going from Mustang direct to PC thru USB):
-take mustang outputs from XLRs/unbalanced/phone out to the mixer/usb interface: i do not like this method because the tone you will record will not match what you will hear while playing thru mustang speaker
-mic Mustang speaker using some sort of dynamic (cheap but acceptable) or condenser mic (not cherap but great) in front of the mustang, and from there to the mixer/usb interface


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 9:45 am
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:43 pm
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I'd like to add a comment on the Shure SM57 mics that others have suggested.

What makes these mics so often used in recording studios and live sound reinforcement is their ruggedness. It's not so much the frequency response specs, feedback characteristics, SPL levels they can take etc. - there are a number of mics have specs that meet or exceed those specs and some for far less money.

But, SM57s will stand up to the rigors of usage in professional studios and professional live stage work - day-after-day, year-after-year. Chances are, if you buy a SM57 today, it will still be working 20 years from now - battle scared and ugly but still doing it's job admirably. And that truly makes them worth their salt. They are dependable.

If you don't need that ruggedness, there is nothing magical or exemplary about their specs where another cheaper mic with similar specs won't work just as well - they just might not stand up to the abuse a SM57 can take. Because of their popularity (and the fact they have been around forever), there are actually a wide assortment of mics with similar specs on the market (some that even look similar and even some down right fakes).

Same thing applies to the SM58.


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:23 am
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:08 am
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hey p90sdude,

I have not much experience with Sure's but you seem to know them well. I heard somewhere that the SM57 is an "instrument" mic, vs the SM58 which is supossed to be a "vocal" mic. Any real differences there?


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 11:27 am
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:43 pm
Posts: 318
jedi2b wrote:
hey p90sdude,

I have not much experience with Sure's but you seem to know them well. I heard somewhere that the SM57 is an "instrument" mic, vs the SM58 which is supossed to be a "vocal" mic. Any real differences there?

Oh, hey, I am no expert. I just learned to get a hold of the spec sheets for mics I consider buying a long time ago. A lot of times they will come with the mics you buy but that doesn't help you before you buy...

If you read the spec sheets for the SM57 and the SM58 you will see that the mics are really very similar with the big difference being in the frequency response. The SM57 has a bit of better lower end response at 40Hz compared to the 50Hz response of the SM58. The SM58 has a bit smoother high end response that the SM57.

The SM58 is called a "vocal" mic because of the smoother frequency response curve especially on the high end and the SM57 is called an instrument mic because it is capable of picking up lower frequencies.

The reality is that the differences won't matter much for instrument micing unless your micing a bass, kick drum or tuba. They both have the same SPL and similar cardioid patterns.


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 11:46 am
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:08 am
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hey thanks, that is good info right there.

Actually I'm a bit confused now, because looking at the freq charts, I would say the SM58 is a better guitar-amp mic than the SM57 for one particular reason: 100 Hz response

-at 100Hz the SM58 is rated at 0dB response: great!
-at 100Hz the SM57 is rated at -5dB response: boooooh!

100Hz is important enough for guitar bass notes IMO, and frankly I prefer to cut the lower freqs on demand at the mixing board if I want to, compared to the mic actually limiting gain on that freq range

did I just say something totally stupid? :)

edit: this video shows some comparissons among several mics, including sm57 and 58, not the best video as mics are moves a bit around during the recording, but not much.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k3AleGhl7Q
actually I like the sm58 more as it has some extra bottom end and is less harsh on the top end


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:46 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:43 pm
Posts: 318
jedi2b wrote:
hey thanks, that is good info right there.

Actually I'm a bit confused now, because looking at the freq charts, I would say the SM58 is a better guitar-amp mic than the SM57 for one particular reason: 100 Hz response

-at 100Hz the SM58 is rated at 0dB response: great!
-at 100Hz the SM57 is rated at -5dB response: boooooh!

100Hz is important enough for guitar bass notes IMO, and frankly I prefer to cut the lower freqs on demand at the mixing board if I want to, compared to the mic actually limiting gain on that freq range

did I just say something totally stupid? :)

edit: this video shows some comparissons among several mics, including sm57 and 58, not the best video as mics are moves a bit around during the recording, but not much.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k3AleGhl7Q
actually I like the sm58 more as it has some extra bottom end and is less harsh on the top end

:lol: , that's because as with many things, lables can be pretty abitrary... the real "proof is in the pudding" as they say.

What a truly amazing age we live in where there is a YouTube vid for just about everything and anything you can think of... who needs schools? (jk).


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Post subject: Re: Mic suggestions
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:55 pm
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Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician

Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:08 am
Posts: 824
somebody told me once that if there's not an online video answering my question, probably my question is irrelevant :)


for anyone trying to learn more about home sound production, I strongly recommend the following coursera course:
https://www.coursera.org/course/musicproduction


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