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Post subject: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:14 am
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Hello,

I am currently looking to buy some equipment as I am going to be playing a lot of small venues over the summer - mostly coffee shops and bars, and possibly a couple of local venues. I am pretty new to the world of guitar effects in that I only own a couple of pedals - a OD and fuzz - and a Fender Frontman 25R amp, which I think sounds pretty great for what I'm doing with it. I have a pretty low budget, but I am considering the Mustang Floor and III because of the wide variety of tones available a at a great price. I have a couple of questions about things that are keeping me from buying one as of yet.

1) On the Mustang floor, how do outside pedals sound in the FX loop? Do the amp tones come through properly if you use a looper pedal in the FX loop? Is there any way to move the FX loop around?

2) On the III, the one thing that has stopped me is that I noticed the headphone jack is a 1/8". For the small places I've been playing at, I usually use the headphone jack on my Frontman to plug into their PA system via 1/4" cable, and as far as I know they do not have XLR cables available (but again, I am pretty new to the effects world). There doesn't seem to be an unbalanced out on the III either. Is there any way to use a 1/4" to go out from the amp?

I have also been reading some speculation on here that Fender may be releasing a Floor v2 at summer Namm, in which case I might want to wait it out, but the only update I would be really interested in is the green box and being able to use outside pedals more places in the effects chain.

Thank you very much.


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 7:25 am
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I own both products, so here are some answers:

1) The floor fx-loop is probably the less useful feature of the floor :)
The floor fx-loop is in a fixed position, between the guitar input and the pre-amp-emulation effects. effectively is the same as connecting the pedal between your guitar and the instrument input. in other words useless, particularly if using a looper. position is fixed and can not be customized.

2) Mustang 3 V2 has 3 options for a line-out:
-the stereo XLR outs, recommended, particularly for connections of more than 20 feet or so. My 80$ Behringer mixer has XLR inputs so I'm guessing most venues would have those (maybe). You can still use the mustang speaker as a stage monitor as it is not silenced.
-mono unbalanced 1/4 line-out (using fx-send, identical to what you get on XLR outs but in mono). you can still use the mustang speaker as a stage monitor as it is not silenced.
-phones out (stereo 1/8, will silence the mustang speaker AND change the cabinet emulation to sound more flat, not recommended for line-out purposes)

Regarding Floor v2, NAMM came and went and nothing happened :) If a V2 comes out I would probably buy it but this could happen later or never, no info from Fender.


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:10 am
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The Floor, could mean one less piece of large gear to haul.
If you are bringing a PA with you, you just bring the Floor and play straight through.
If you intend to have a personal monitor as your "amp" then you may as well get the combo... as far as set up goes anyway.

The floor has much more robust switching options as well as having an expression pedal built in. Plus the option to add a second expression pedal.

It is also midi controllable which opens up more switching options

The fx loop is a downer, but it still has it's usefulness... Especially if you had several pedals in it... you could leave them all on and switch them ALL in and out together with just one click.


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:36 pm
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Thank you guys for your quick responses! I have a couple other questions that I thought of:

1) Do outside pedals, in particular analog, interact well with the modulations and amp simulators? Does it sound as legit as using the onboard effects?

2) I don't really understand how the send/recieve in/out of the FX loop on the amp works.Could you explain to me how that works?

Thanks again!


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:54 pm
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The headphone jack on the III is cheap, as in the cheapest possible part available. The first time you insert a plug into it, you'll be shocked (not electrically, mind you!).

If you were to use it as any form of regular output, you'd be better off voiding the warranty and mounting/wiring in a proper metal 1/4" jack (mounted in a drilled hole on a strong part of the cabinet).


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:23 pm
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adiabatic wrote:
The headphone jack on the III is cheap...If you were to use it as any form of regular output, you'd be better off voiding the warranty and mounting/wiring in a proper metal 1/4" jack

I don't know why anyone would with a Mustang III v2, those XLR stereo outputs are perfect for going to a PA, or any amplifier for that matter.

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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:00 pm
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If you go with the Floor you will have to tweak your presets every time you plug it into a new PA. If you go MIII you won't even need to plug into a PA for coffee houses... just use the PA for vocals or plug in with XLRs and use the MIII as a monitor.

With MIII you have the option of getting the V2 which gives you considerably more dirt effects and some good and useful new amp models. I seriously doubt a Floor V2 is coming out. Fender has really missed its window on that. I wouldn't be surprised if Mustang doesn't stay around for a V3... I think Fender will come out with a line of Bluetooth wireless Android/iOS compatible modelers (like the new Line 6 AmpliFI - notice they ditched "Spider") and badge it as a new line of amps. I think Fender didn't penetrate enough into the oversaturated floorboard effects processor market and is bowing out of that competition. Having said all that, it is a sweet board for $200 or less if you snag one!

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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:37 pm
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Andy2theT wrote:
Thank you guys for your quick responses! I have a couple other questions that I thought of:

1) Do outside pedals, in particular analog, interact well with the modulations and amp simulators? Does it sound as legit as using the onboard effects?

2) I don't really understand how the send/recieve in/out of the FX loop on the amp works.Could you explain to me how that works?

Thanks again!


The floor takes pedals ok... It depends on the amp sim... at least this is my findings with what I am playing through.

The marshall sims seem to me to do the better job of taking outboard ODs.
I am using a Fulltone Full-Drive most of the time, and use the the onboard "stomp" as a compressor for lead boost.
The built in drive on the floor is pretty good too tho... it has bass treble and mid controls which is a big plus!

The FX loop on the floor is just a basic insert loop. It is located right after the guitar input... ergo, it is the same as putting the pedal right before the floor.
Not a great Idea... but it depends on what your needs are...
It may serve others very well in that one fixed position.

Image

This is what I am doing currently.
I can't seem to get the delay in the floor to do just right, so I use my delaylab which is pretty hard to beat! and in doing that I had to go with an ext reverb.
The chain runs thus:
guitar>fulldrive>floor>delay>reverb>amp.


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:10 pm
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mojo_plasma,

Why is your Floor off the floor if I may ask? Ergonomically speaking it seems like you would have a much harder time that high up especially while operating the expression pedal. I am not angry about this :wink: and I understand different strokes for different folks.

Not to sound too cliche, but just sayin!

Never mind I get it. :idea: You got your mojo rising, Mr. Mojo Risin'

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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:37 am
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HIO wrote:
mojo_plasma,

Why is your Floor off the floor if I may ask? Ergonomically speaking it seems like you would have a much harder time that high up especially while operating the expression pedal. I am not angry about this :wink: and I understand different strokes for different folks.

Not to sound too cliche, but just sayin!

Never mind I get it. :idea: You got your mojo rising, Mr. Mojo Risin'


MR MOJO RISIN'! :lol:
Good one!
This is kinda temporary, but the board I build will still be something like this.
Reason is... I HATE trying to reach pedals on a regular flat board... wherein you have to step "over" one pedal to get to the other. I do a lot of the singing and cant be looking down too often.
I also switch the floor way less often that the rest of the stuff. I am constantly tapping tempo or switching delay as well as the drive on/off. So I keep them on the floor.
The expression pedal up high like that is kinda comfy.


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 1:19 pm
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I built a very sophisticated pedal board around six years ago. Believe it or not I started with an architectural draft, prototype, and then had a sheet metal company build the foundation and then I had another third party build my top where I used velcro to attach all of my pedals.

I even had a large electrical outlet strip hidden away in the back. The metal part was finely spray painted and I was so proud of this beauty and was even considering marketing it all over the world.

Bottom line: I did not like the ergonomics when using this thing so I ditched the whole dang thing. :(

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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:41 pm
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Thanks guys for all the input.

I think tomorrow I'll go over to GC after work and play with the mustang iii. So far I am leaning toward getting the floor, which I'll have to order, but I want to check out the iii some more first. From demos I've listened to it seems all the mustangs have great clean tones (which is mainly what I need) and so-so higher gain sounds. It's very important to me that it responds to dynamics and such like a normal amp.

Mojo, that is a nice setup! I plan to build myself a board as well.


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:20 pm
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HIO wrote:
I built a very sophisticated pedal board around six years ago. Believe it or not I started with an architectural draft, prototype, and then had a sheet metal company build the foundation and then I had another third party build my top where I used velcro to attach all of my pedals.

I even had a large electrical outlet strip hidden away in the back. The metal part was finely spray painted and I was so proud of this beauty and was even considering marketing it all over the world.

Bottom line: I did not like the ergonomics when using this thing so I ditched the whole dang thing. :(


:lol: :lol: :lol:
That was a lot of work!!
I usually just use plywood strips.
With the slats I am able to use zip-ties to hold the pedals down and easily change them out... as I am prone to do.
Notice the elevated pedals in the back 8) I hate to reach or step over pedals!
plus it cost next to nothing when I buy a new pedal and have to biuld a new one
Image


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:26 pm
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Andy2theT wrote:
Thanks guys for all the input.

I think tomorrow I'll go over to GC after work and play with the mustang iii. So far I am leaning toward getting the floor, which I'll have to order, but I want to check out the iii some more first. From demos I've listened to it seems all the mustangs have great clean tones (which is mainly what I need) and so-so higher gain sounds. It's very important to me that it responds to dynamics and such like a normal amp.

Mojo, that is a nice setup! I plan to build myself a board as well.


Thanks!
...and for sure check out the Miii. There's a lot to like about the convenience of a good sounding combo amp!
It will prolly take out board drives better that the floor... Like i said the floor is OK, but I wouldn't say great at it!


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Post subject: Re: III vs. Floor
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:30 pm
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Andy,

The MIII V.2 really boosted the Stang in the area of dirt and distortion (Tubescreamer, ProCo Rat, BOSS DS, Big Muff clones and the Orange and Silvertone amp models etc.)

If you are looking mainly for Fender cleans and are considering a Floor (which only has the V.1 modeling and effects anyway) then be sure to scout around for a used MIII V.1 which you can easily score for the price of a new Floor or less these days! Just make sure it isn't fizzing and try to find one that still has its footswitch.

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my gear:

Jackson USA Phil Collen PC-1
Warmoth Custom-Build Stratocaster (The Andersong)
Fender American Special Stratocaster
Squier J. Mascis Jazzmaster
Fender Mustang GT40
Eleven HeadRush w/ two Alto TS212 FRFRs


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