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Post subject: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:31 am
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So, I'm getting a Mustang I that should be delivered today, and I've got a bit of confusion as to the software packages that come with it. I'm a computer geek of sorts, but music related packages are not something I've had much exposure to, so I'm hoping someone can outline the big picture for me.

What I *think* I know:
  • Fuse - For tweaking amp presets. Can't wait.
  • Ableton Live - For recording. Probably need drivers to record from the amp USB.
  • Amplitube - Where does this fit in??? From what I've read, it's for doing sound patches of amps and such... but how does it interface with the Mustang? Does it interface with the mustang? Or is it just a value added part of the whole package?

Thanks in advance


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:55 am
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Correct on the first two, DarthGrumpy.
Amplitube is probably the weirdest inclusion in the software bundle in the it's just another company's software based version of what the Mustangs do. I find it fairly limited - understandable in that it's free - and I don't particularly like the way it "feels" when playing through it. There's a very strange disconnect and non tactile feel to it. You may think differently though when you've played with it. It sounds ok but I'm kinda picky about amp feel.

O


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:06 pm
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Orcatraz wrote:
Correct on the first two, DarthGrumpy.
Amplitube is probably the weirdest inclusion in the software bundle in the it's just another company's software based version of what the Mustangs do. I find it fairly limited - understandable in that it's free - and I don't particularly like the way it "feels" when playing through it. There's a very strange disconnect and non tactile feel to it. You may think differently though when you've played with it. It sounds ok but I'm kinda picky about amp feel.


So, essentially, Amplitube is for playing the guitar through the computer (via USB interface), and tailoring the sound on that end, rather than playing through the amp, and tweaking it there. From my browsing, that's the conclusion I'd come to, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something obvious.

As you say, it seems a weird inclusion in the package, but hey... free toys are free toys! :D

Thanks for the response!


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:04 pm
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Quote:
•Fuse - For tweaking amp presets. Can't wait.

Suggest you download and install the latest version of fuse from fuse.fender.com, rather than using the (almost certainly older) version on the CD. This will also get you the latest amp firmware.


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:46 pm
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AmpliTube is a fantastic software-based amp modelling program. It models all of the workings of the tubes and the amp filters and everything. This allows you to swap tubes in and out in almost half of their amp models. Imagine playing a Marshall JCM800 loaded with 6V6 tubes instead of EL34s. @.@

The thing is, Ableton allows for an AmpliTube patch to work within it, but to use it properly, you'd need a DIRECT recording of your guitar on the track while running the ApliTube patch. Since the Fender Mustang's USB port is ALWAYS running some kind of amp simulation, that makes it very difficult to get a clean guitar signal for recording. I did this by bypassing the amp using a Rocksmith USB cable directly to my computer. I use ASIO4ALL-V2 as my interface driver. It almost completely eliminates Windows lag and gets me a prestinely clean guitar signal. I can record one track and play it back multiple times with different amp patches from AmpliTube "coloring" the sound.

What would this track sound like with a Mesa Dual-Rectifier? What about an ENGL Powerball II? Or a Randall Warhead? Those are all amp models available in AmpliTube.

The thing is, AmpliTube Fender LE - the version that comes free with the Mustang - only has 3 amp models included: Super-Sonic, Twin Reverb, and MetalHead 500.

By the way, the Fender Metal-Head 500 is a bad-ass amp.

To get a bunch of other amps, I downloaded a free copy of AmpliTube 3.8 from IK Multimedia's website and then bought a bunch of them from their Custom Shop. The amps sound incredible, but it takes some CPU power to run properly. I have to run it in "Economy" mode on my netbook, but my Core i7 2.8GHz processor runs it perfectly in Hi-Fi mode.

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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:07 am
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scott-uk wrote:
Suggest you download and install the latest version of fuse from fuse.fender.com, rather than using the (almost certainly older) version on the CD. This will also get you the latest amp firmware.


Glad you brought that up, because I've got an interesting situation. I received my Mustang yesterday at work (I always have stuff delivered to work, so there's always someone to receive it. Sadly, my guitar is at home, so as a quick check, I downloaded Fuse from the website, and plugged the amp in, just to make reasonably sure it wasn't DOA. It wanted to do a firmware update, which I did, and that went well.

Took the amp home, played a bit on it last night, then this morning, downloaded Fuse on my home computer. Plugged the amp in, and it immediately told me the amp was on an older version of the software, and wouldn't work with Fuse, and instructed me to put it in update mode. I did so, and it then updated the firmware, and then wouldn't connect. I restarted my computer, and the amp. This time, it came up, and this time, gave me a similar message to the first one I saw at work, wanting to do a firmware update. Which I did. After restarting the amp, it's now back at the point where it says the amp is on an older version.

I was in the middle of getting ready for work, so I didn't have time to check, but I suspect that I inadvertently downloaded an older version of Fuse at home last night. The download area has 3 versions of Fuse for the PC, and I probably saw 2.6, and clicked 2.3. My guess is that the "older version" message should be "newer version". I work for a software developer, and I see it all the time. A programmer does a version check, and if the version number doesn't match, it's automatically assumed to be older, when in fact it may be newer.

Meanwhile, back at the amp... me and my son both played through it last night, me on my 1980 LP Custom, him on his Ibanez.

In the interests of not having a tldr post, I'll just say WOW, and leave it at that. Maybe I'll gush in another thread. :lol:


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:29 am
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FFXIhealer wrote:
AmpliTube is a fantastic software-based amp modelling program. It models all of the workings of the tubes and the amp filters and everything. This allows you to swap tubes in and out in almost half of their amp models. Imagine playing a Marshall JCM800 loaded with 6V6 tubes instead of EL34s. @.@

<snip>

To get a bunch of other amps, I downloaded a free copy of AmpliTube 3.8 from IK Multimedia's website and then bought a bunch of them from their Custom Shop. The amps sound incredible, but it takes some CPU power to run properly. I have to run it in "Economy" mode on my netbook, but my Core i7 2.8GHz processor runs it perfectly in Hi-Fi mode.


Thanks for the rundown, and thinking a little bit about it, that makes the inclusion of Amplitube make more sense. The Mustang series seems to be positioned for a) new guitarists, searching for "their sound", and more experienced guitarists who want amp versatility. Perfect example, last night my son was alternating between "Miserlou", on a surfed out 60s preset, "Smells Like Teen Spirit" on American 90s, and some gawd-awful death metal (at which point, my wife insisted on a test of the headphone jack.)

If you think about it, the whole Mustang package is geared to encourage users to embrace the computer as a musical tool. If you look at other mediums, Amazon allows authors to self-publish e-books, bypassing the traditional brick and mortar publishing house. The Mustang package gives musicians a start down a similar avenue musically.

This strongly suggests a new new feature for the next generation of Mustangs: a bypass mode that allows the Mustang to simply function as a USB interface to the computer.


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:18 am
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Quote:
The download area has 3 versions of Fuse for the PC

That's why I always tell people just to download the version on the front page of fuse.fender.com (as per my post earlier this topic...), that's always the latest/current version. I've commented before that the Fender support/download area is very confusing, as it contains multiple versions of things, all still sporting their original "I'm the newest, latest version - download me!" banners. I wish Fender would clean it up and either remove old versions or update their download pages to make it clear that something is no longer the current version. That would prevent problems such as you are having.

FUSE will tell you the exact versions of both itself and the firmware on the amp (MAIN MENU > HELP > About Fender FUSE). That should help you work out which versions you have where, and hence what to upgrade. You can download the newest firmware separately from the FUSE instalation, then get your FUSE to update the amp with it. The current amp firmware is 1.10, and note you must have the very latest FUSE version in order to use that.

These links/articles may be helpful:
viewtopic.php?f=27&t=72279
http://www.fender.com/en-GB/support/art ... amplifiers

This link is the 1.10 firmware download file.
http://support.fender.com/software/fend ... 1_1.10.upd

And here is the download link for the latest FUSE (2.6.0.25) - this is the exact link on the fuse.fender.com homepage (for PC; if you have Mac, click the Mac link on that homepage):
http://wpc.077d.edgecastcdn.net/00077D/ ... 6.0.25.exe

For completeness, note there may be newer versions than the above available in "public beta" - Fender has posted various links in this forum. Personally, I'd wait for those versions to become 'final' releases, unless I encounter a problem the beta specifically addresses.


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:16 am
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Yeah, checked when I got home, and as it turns out, I had downloaded the right version - and it wasn't seeing the amp. I installed the latest build that was linked in another post, and no luck, still not seeing the amp. Finally, I rebooted, and then it recognized the amp, and no odd messages.

However, as I type this, I ran Fuse, and it doesn't see the amp, which is another clue. My computer is configured to power down when idle. I suspect that the USB drivers aren't waking out of the hibernate mode properly. I'll reboot in a few minutes, and I suspect it will connect fine.


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:47 am
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The saga continues: This morning, Fuse wouldn't recognize my amp. Rebooted, still no joy. Went through my USB composite devices in Device Manager, figured out which one was the Mustang, uninstalled the driver, and then plugged in the amp, let the driver re-install. Still not seeing it. I don't recall the exact sequence next, but it was a combination of rebooting, turning off the amp, unplugging and re-plugging the USB cable... it gets blurry. It may have actually involved the sacrifice of a live chicken.... I don't really remember. In the end, Fuse saw my amp fine.

My suspicion is that the problem lies in my USB ports. I need to try the rear USB ports, to see if that makes any difference. As a side note, when tech support tells you to try another USB port, always try to switch front to back, or vice-versa, as they come off different controllers/hubs internally.

As a suggestion to Fender Tech Support, if you go into Device Manager, and look at the properties of different devices, on the Details tab, you have a dropdown that will select various properties of a device. The dropdown defaults to the DisplayName property. One of the properties is Hardware ID. Select that.

Under Hardware ID, you'll see a string of letters and numbers like this:
Code:
USB/VID_0B0E&PID_9350&REV_0100


The number after VID_ is the vendor ID, and I believe it's unique to a given software developer. If you could find out Fender's assigned ID, and add it to a FAQ, it would be helpful in aiding users to identify which device is their amp. "USB Composite Device" is unfortunately pretty generic.


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:24 pm
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Hi DarthGrumpy,

In Device Manager, you can look in the "Sound, Video and Game Controllers" list for a Mustang device. That may be easier than looking for the device ID. Also, I would suggest that you try our newest public beta build of Fender FUSE, which should improve connectivity with your PC. You can find that here: http://wpc.077d.edgecastcdn.net/00077D/ ... 6.1.35.exe. Please let us know how it is going. Thanks.

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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:58 pm
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Fender TSL wrote:
Hi DarthGrumpy,

In Device Manager, you can look in the "Sound, Video and Game Controllers" list for a Mustang device. That may be easier than looking for the device ID. Also, I would suggest that you try our newest public beta build of Fender FUSE, which should improve connectivity with your PC. You can find that here: http://wpc.077d.edgecastcdn.net/00077D/ ... 6.1.35.exe. Please let us know how it is going. Thanks.


I'll check the beta... the one I downloaded was from another post you made, in which you referred to "the latest build". Not sure of the exact revision.

Thanks!


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:58 pm
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FFXIhealer wrote:
Since the Fender Mustang's USB port is ALWAYS running some kind of amp simulation, that makes it very difficult to get a clean guitar signal for recording


Try the "Empty" preset; I'm able to record direct signals, reamp, etc., with it. E.g., you could record a lick or riff or lead line, then loop it in the DAW while tweaking your favorite amp model (in DAW, or even play it back into the Mustang's input itself).

If I understand correctly, the Mustang Floor *will* allow preamp bypass.

PITA


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:28 pm
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The reason I bypass the Mustang amp entirely is because the "EMPTY" preset is actually a glitch in the DSP. I had it once on my Mustang V. But I get better signal from my Rocksmith USB cable anyway, so why would I do that?

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Fender Mustang V + V412
Fender Mustang II
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Gibson Les Paul Custom Silverburst
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Fender American Special Stratocaster
Hagstrom Ultra-Swede
Custom Warmoth Strat


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Post subject: Re: New Mustang I Owner - Quick Question
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:32 pm
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FFXIhealer wrote:
The reason I bypass the Mustang amp entirely is because the "EMPTY" preset is actually a glitch in the DSP. I had it once on my Mustang V. But I get better signal from my Rocksmith USB cable anyway, so why would I do that?


That's cool, it sounds like you don't want/need to since you have a better alternative.

It might still be useful for someone who doesn't already have another purpose-built DI and doesn't care to invest in any more hardware--just for giggles, if nothing else, especially if they'd like to fool around with AmpliTube and its preamp emulations.

PITA


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