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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 4:56 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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Same Cyber II modeling engine, just a few different models and such. But I bet you could tweak either one to match any tone on the other.


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:47 pm
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Hobbyist
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Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 7:36 am
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Location: Dallas, TX
Thanks for that info! First mention I've seen of the modelling engine. I must have seen a guy using an early Fender modelling amp with the Cyber I engine, a Fender Champion--I think it was. I was very impressed with that amp as I watched him do a gig of covers from country to ZZ Top, all without a single stomp box on the floor in front of that amp. The delay on that amp sounded really good!

John


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:31 pm
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Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:07 am
Posts: 116
Roger L. wrote:
Besides to most people who might be listening to your performance they can't tell the difference. Hope you enjoy your Twin


I don't know if I agree with that.

If you look at the wave form of a solid state or digital amp and compare it to an all tube amp, the tube amp wave is smooth and the solid state is jagged kindof like steps.

The smooth wave form interacts naturally with the human ear (even at loud volume levels), and creates endorphans in the brain. "This makes people who hear it have a good feeling.

The jagged wave does not interact naturally with the human ear and the brain has to adjust the hearing before it starts sounding good. And at high volume levels, the jagged wave form causes a harshness in the sound.


Go to a local guitar store and play some solid state amps loud. Then let your ears adjust back to normal and play some tube (all tube) amps the same way. Let you ears and brain be the judge.

I never knew this until I got an all tube amp and wondered why I got such a good feeling, and was so inspired playing it. I asked a guy at the guitar store about it and he told me about the whole wave form endorphins thing, and I believe it.


So, if this is true, most people who are listening CAN hear the difference. They may not know what the difference is, but they can hear (and feel) it.


~just sayin~


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:43 am
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Aspiring Musician
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Myths die hard.

Fact is, modeling and tubes are finally close to merging, and ultimately, the best tones will come from neither.

The best tones will come from a machine, a box, that has neither tubes, nor is modeling anything. It will just be called an amp. And it will sound awesome.


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 2:48 am
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Aspiring Musician
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bcalvanese wrote:
I don't know if I agree with that.

If you look at the wave form of a solid state or digital amp and compare it to an all tube amp, the tube amp wave is smooth and the solid state is jagged kindof like steps.

The smooth wave form interacts naturally with the human ear (even at loud volume levels), and creates endorphans in the brain. "This makes people who hear it have a good feeling.

The jagged wave does not interact naturally with the human ear and the brain has to adjust the hearing before it starts sounding good. And at high volume levels, the jagged wave form causes a harshness in the sound.


So you've never enjoyed a gig at a venue larger than a tiny pub then?

Don't forget that most of what the audience hears at a lot of venues (including guitars) is put through a solid state PA system. Doesn't seem to put them off enjoying it!

Also, to be honest, one of the nicest, warmest tones I've heard live came from BB King, who was using a solid state amp. Loved it. Sometimes a solid state just sound infinitely better for a certain task than any valve gear can.

I love tube amps, and could never be without one, but it's more for the sensitivity and response than the overall sound.


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 6:57 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:10 pm
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I think you are confused about the jagged waveform from solid state amps unless you mean solid state digital amps compared to tube amps,then the waveform in the digital amp will have a stair step kind of waveform where the analog tube amp will have a smooth waveform but the solid state digital amp will most likely use digital dithering(noise shaping)to smooth out the waveform and on a good digital modeling amp like the mustang the difference can be hard to tell in a live setting.


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:16 am
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Aspiring Musician
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In a blind test, few listeners could distinguish between BB playing his Lab or his Twin, which he mostly used in the mid-to-late 60's.

Today 99.999% of all PA's and home theaters and stereos and mp3 players use solid-state amps. Not too many folks holding their ears and screaming.

There are still lousy and cheap SS amps which sound awful. But it's not the buzz saw waveform, it's a coldness and hardness to the sound with odd harmonics accentuated. That's what makes your ears bleed.

The Velvets played through Acoustic 360's when we opened for them. Ugly ugly steel dead clunky sound. That was brutal. Lotsa ear bleed. Those old Kustom pleated SS amps were horrible-sounding guitar amps. Think Country Joe's lead guitarist. Gack! I just used em for PA.

The war is over. And tubes and the latest excellent modeling engines have worked out an Armistice. It's all good. Diversity rules.


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Post subject: Re: Sold my Mustang IV
Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:35 am
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I have a '65 Fender Deluxe Reverb (not a reissue). I love the amp, but the Mustand is the best amp I've ever heard that comes awefully close to the real thing. Volume wise, it still doesn't compete, but its a fanstastic recording and practice amp.

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