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Post subject: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:20 am
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Well, I finally bought an HD400 and have hooked it up to my Mustang IV. So far, I really must say I am really digging the sounds. I have it routed as such:

Guitar>TS9>HD400
HD400 left out>Mustang IV Left Effects Return
HD400 right out.Mustang IV Right Effects Return

Now for the fun part. Playing a huge gig on Monday, using this setup for the 1st time in a gig. In fact, the first time I played through it was Wed at our last rehearsal (which by the way I had it going into the normal input for the Mustang and was all too happy with the sound). However, this morning I set everything up as described above..wow.

The touch sensitivity in my opinion is spot on. That little spongy feel you get when you play through a good tube amp spot on as well.

I'm so confident in my tone that I have no concerns at all about running this set-up at the gig. Of course I will have to make some adjustments to EQ for the venue during soundcheck but that is easy. Base sounds are awesome. The Mustang serves as a perfect 150w flat response amp for the HD series.

Just wanted to share my thoughts and how much fun I'm having with this thing.

Let me know if you have any questions of if you just want to chat about these great new tools on the market.

Rob


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:59 am
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Which amp did you choose to set the Mustang on for your "clean" flat amp?


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 1:56 pm
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I just run it into the FX returns. Basically disabling the Mustangs Amp/Cab modeling features. Works great.


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:57 pm
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Is this what you are running?

http://www.google.com/products/catalog? ... CDQQ8wIwAQ

If so I find this very interesting and will have to try running my Guitar Rig4 Kontrol in the same manner Guitar>Kontrol>Effects Return.

I was told in a previous thread you needed to run the amp on a clean selection like the 65 Reverb with all effects turned off and run the Effects Out to my Kontrol unit then back into the Effects return.

Your way I can plug my guitar into the Kontrol unit like I do now for headphone practice and use it as my modeler going directly into the effects return.......doesn't the Mustang amp when turned on go to the last selected amp? I didn't think the amp could run without it's modeling of an amp being on??


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:02 pm
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Perhaps by going through the effects return you are bypassing the modeling section of the amp and sending your signal straight to the power section and out to the speakers?? Didn't think it worked that way but if it's working for you then it must.

What does it say on the LCD screen when you are doing this? or is that irrelevant as you are bypassing that section of the amp?


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:37 pm
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cjburr: it shows i am using the Marshall amp in the window but it is irrelevant as there is no color to the sound other than what I am getting from the POD. Just 150 watts of power.


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:47 pm
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This is an interesting thread - I have a POD HD500 but then got the Mustang IV in large part because it was so much easier to dial in some classic Fender amps and just simplified things all around. Yet the one drawback to the Mustang was the inability to dial out any amp modeling. Now I'm learning about the effects loop capabilities. In short order I will get around to testing out this method to obtain a clean, full frequency sound. I use a Variax sometimes for acoustic guitar models and would love to find out if your approach will work. I will report back. Heretofore the only good acoustic tone to be had is to go through a PA or a keyboard amp. Guitar amps just don't cut a good acoustic tone no matter how you try to dial it in.

Question for anyone who knows - so if the effects loop is used in conjunction with a board like the HD POD, could you also then plug a second guitar into the regular input of the Mustang and be afforded an alternate route to just using the Mustang's modeling capabilities and bypass the effects pedal connected to the effects loop?


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 8:37 pm
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I would get an a/b switchbox so you can switch between the mustangs effect loop with your pod hd500 and the amps guitar input for the mustangs internal amp models.


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 9:12 pm
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Tonedef71 wrote:
cjburr: it shows i am using the Marshall amp in the window but it is irrelevant as there is no color to the sound other than what I am getting from the POD. Just 150 watts of power.


Hopefully Loren will chime in here and let us know if going through the effects return is letting you get only whatever sound is generated by the POD or if you are actually getting what you would hear generated by the POD coming through the Marshall amp model of the Mustang.

I'm not doubting your ears it's just not the way the Fender folks (Loren) explained it to me when I asked about using my Guitar Rig4/Kontrol unit with the amp.

Does the POD have a right and left input and a right and left output? I have this on my Kontrol unit. I plug the guitar into one of the inputs (right or left) and select which one I am plugged into, this allows me to have 2 guitars plugged in at the same time if I want to but I'm unsure if just having my guitar in one input will only let me send a mono signal through whichever output I select or if I can select both outputs and send a stereo signal to the amp, I'll have to investigate my GuitarRig4 manual a bit more. I'm wondering if this is the case for your POD as well.

Thank you for posting your set-up as I am in Afghanistan and can't play with my amp right now. Having you guys play with set-ups is going to let me go home and get to rockin' with minimal hassle :D


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:48 pm
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Guys, any time you plug into the FX Return of any amplifier, it bypasses the preamp. In this case, the Mustang's preamp which happens to model amplifiers, is completely removed from the signal path.

O.


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 11:04 pm
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Orcatraz wrote:
Guys, any time you plug into the FX Return of any amplifier, it bypasses the preamp. In this case, the Mustang's preamp which happens to model amplifiers, is completely removed from the signal path.

O.


sweet, I'm just wondering why Loren told me the best way to use my Guitar Rig4/Kontrol, which is basically the same thing as the POD, was to select a clean amp on the Mustang and then run the Kontrol unit between the effects send and return instead of just plugging it into the effects return thereby not needing to even select and amp on the Mustang.

If that's all you need to do...great!! simple and neat with all the tones/amps/effects one could ever need. :D


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 8:49 am
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cjburr wrote:
sweet, I'm just wondering why Loren told me the best way to use my Guitar Rig4/Kontrol, which is basically the same thing as the POD, was to select a clean amp on the Mustang and then run the Kontrol unit between the effects send and return instead of just plugging it into the effects return thereby not needing to even select and amp on the Mustang.

If that's all you need to do...great!! simple and neat with all the tones/amps/effects one could ever need. :D


Well, did you tell him which Mustang you own? If not, he has to go for the lowest common denominator (MI) and the simplest method of plugging in your modeler. There's also the aspect of you using a competitor's modeling device... infer from that what you will...

O.


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:20 am
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Metalman50 wrote:
I would get an a/b switchbox so you can switch between the mustangs effect loop with your pod hd500 and the amps guitar input for the mustangs internal amp models.



There might actually be a better way.
If the Pod's effects loop is programmable like the Boss GTs (as it should be for the best flexibility), you can program a series of patches that uses either preamp.
Here's the signal chain;
• Guitar - Pod's input - Pod FX Send - Mustang Front Input - Mustang FX Send - Pod FX Return - Pod output - Mustang FX Return.
If you want a patch using the Mustang's models, turn the Pod's FX Loop on and turn off the Pod's preamp models to off or bypass. If you want a patch using the Pod's models, turn the Pod's FX Loop off (effectively bypassing the Mustang's preamp) and turn on its preamp. If the Pod's Cab Sims are their own separate module, that would allow you to use them with the Mustang's amp models - with their Cab Sim turned off of course.

Tonal arguments aside, the Boss GTs were really supremely flexible in this scenario in that you could put its FX Loop ANYWHERE in the signal chain. It also had a couple of modes where you could use it normally or mix the FX Return signal with the rest of the signal in the GT and control how much of it gets through. You could essentially have THREE amp sims going at once - GT8/10s can use two simultaneously plus the Mustang's. You also had lots of flexibility with which cab sims to use on which modeler.

O.


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:35 am
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Orcatraz wrote:
Guys, any time you plug into the FX Return of any amplifier, it bypasses the preamp. In this case, the Mustang's preamp which happens to model amplifiers, is completely removed from the signal path.

O.


Having tried this signal path with a Variax acoustic model and the HD500 (with no amp modeling used from the HD500), I would say the Mustang IV speakers are not truly FRFR. There is still coloring. Not that Fender has said they were FRFR - it's just my opinion that they are EQ'd and designed with the Mustang amp models in mind. My normal rig is an HD500 with a Traynor K4 keyboard amp (true FRFR) and the Variax acoustic, as well as an old analog Martin D-28, are far more realistic than with the Mustang going through the effects loop. Hopefully someday Fender will create an Acoustasonic model for those of us who would like to play acoustics as well. That would be killer. The amp already is, but I'd like to see it even more killerer......:)


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Post subject: Re: Mustang IV with a PodHD 400
Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 11:05 am
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Orcatraz wrote:
Well, did you tell him which Mustang you own? If not, he has to go for the lowest common denominator (MI) and the simplest method of plugging in your modeler. There's also the aspect of you using a competitor's modeling device... infer from that what you will...
O.


Of course I specified which model I have, here is the link to my thread

viewtopic.php?f=26&t=53806

Loren also stated that he is a fan of Guitar Rig4. I don't think they really care if you're using another modeling device with your amp, after all, you bought the amp didn't you??

The manual even tells you how to hook up external effects devices

"Connect external effects devices to your Mustang amplifier using the effects loop jacks.
The Mustang IV & V amplifiers can accept stereo or mono effects devices. Note that a mono-in, mono-out effect unit will use one send and one return, and only effect one side of the stereo image. The Mustang III amplifier only accepts mono effects devices.
Connect the FX SEND jack(s) to the input(s) on your external effects device and connect the FX RETURN jack(s) to the output(s) on your effects device."

Given that they tell you this in the manual I really don't understand your comment about using a competitors modeling device??

Thank you for the info. I guess once I get home I'll try the different methods and see what works best for me.


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