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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:01 pm
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Orcatraz wrote:
First, let me say that for the Fender amp simulations, the Mustangs are killer but for me, it's three things missing on the Mustang Floor that has forced me to look elsewhere. A Parametric EQ, the ability to have an over drive and a compressor simultaneously and (and this is the big one) an effects loop that can be Pre or Post amp sim. As good as the M-Floor sounds, it is completely hamstrung by the lack of this last feature.

I realize that the V2 Mustangs have that last ability that I mention but alas... there is no Mustang Floor V2. And no, I do not want to get one of the new amps as they don't give me instant access to the presets I use and I can't run acoustic sounds out of an amp. Well, I could but it sounds like Krap.
An updated brand new Series 3 Mustang Floor, debuting Fender's state-of-the-art technology would be a terrific way to launch a new realm of Mustang products! Who knows if we'll ever see anything of the sort. It likely would be nice. Time will tell....

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 5:56 pm
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Orcatraz wrote:
First, let me say that for the Fender amp simulations, the Mustangs are killer but for me, it's three things missing on the Mustang Floor that has forced me to look elsewhere. A Parametric EQ, the ability to have an over drive and a compressor simultaneously and (and this is the big one) an effects loop that can be Pre or Post amp sim. As good as the M-Floor sounds, it is completely hamstrung by the lack of this last feature.

I realize that the V2 Mustangs have that last ability that I mention but alas... there is no Mustang Floor V2. And no, I do not want to get one of the new amps as they don't give me instant access to the presets I use and I can't run acoustic sounds out of an amp. Well, I could but it sounds like Krap.

Not ideal for what you are asking and not a fix all but you could always get an outboard EQ, overdrive, or compressor pedal. Expensive and more of a hassle but the Floor takes foot pedals well; I agree with you though.

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 7:18 pm
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Yes, I think it's pretty obvious that Fender is done with the Mustang Floor. It's really too bad. I owned the floor twice, the first time I returned it because I needed some quick cash, and the second time I returned it because I compared it to the V2 amps and it just couldn't hold its ground anymore...I mostly play coffee shops and dive bars, so I liked having something super portable that I could just plug into the PA, but the Floor just wasn't doing it for me. Like you've said, even if the effects loop was post amp I probably would have kept it, because looping is a big part of my playing, and I could always put a couple pedals in front of the floor, but alas, Fender never fixed it.

Now I have a Mustang III V2, and it's light enough to carry around and I can just mic it up and I've got all my presets dialed in for the footswitch.

I think the biggest turn-off when using the Mustang is how outdated the fuse software feels. That said, I love the amp and I think it's gonna keep me going for a long time.


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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 2:05 pm
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HIO wrote:
Not ideal for what you are asking and not a fix all but you could always get an outboard EQ, overdrive, or compressor pedal. Expensive and more of a hassle but the Floor takes foot pedals well; I agree with you though.


Well, that certainly would be a solution if it weren't for the Floor's fixed effects loop position. I have the Helix now and sonically, it is simply incomparable. Flawed? Yes. They have some interesting takes on certain aspects of the UI that I simply do not agree with. That said, the Floor is now just a backup.


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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 6:12 am
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Orcatraz wrote:
I have the Helix now and sonically, it is simply incomparable.

well dayum, for that price, it certainly should be.

Line 6 Helix Multi-Effects Guitar Pedal
$1,499

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:07 am
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strings10927 wrote:
Orcatraz wrote:
I have the Helix now and sonically, it is simply incomparable.

well dayum, for that price, it certainly should be.

Line 6 Helix Multi-Effects Guitar Pedal
$1,499

Ouch, for that price I would have opted for the new Fractal Audio AX8 modeler, effects and pedalboard. I think it is even cheaper.

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:11 am
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HIO wrote:
strings10927 wrote:
Orcatraz wrote:
I have the Helix now and sonically, it is simply incomparable.

well dayum, for that price, it certainly should be.

Line 6 Helix Multi-Effects Guitar Pedal
$1,499

Ouch, for that price I would have opted for the new Fractal Audio AX8 modeler, effects and pedalboard. I think it is even cheaper.

If the Fender Mustang Floor was still available I could have bought eight or nine of them for that price. Glad I got mine, even does MIDI.

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 1:56 pm
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Orcatraz, if my memory serves me correctly, you bailed on the Mustang line a few years ago and came back for another ride. I could be wrong and I have *not* done any Forum searches.

We will see though how long you own your Helix but I want to warn you to not listen for and I shouldn't say this word here on the forums but some are talking about *Fizz* on many of the Helix amp models. For that amount of money and only if you can get your hands on check out the Fractal AX8; it has a built in looper as well. Just my measly 2 cents which isn't worth much these days. You used to be able to buy a bubble gum with a cartoon wrapped in it for a penny.

I only say all this because it sounded like from your previous post that you were already not completely happy with Felix. I mean Helix, Felix was that odd couple guy.

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2016 10:09 pm
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HIO wrote:
Orcatraz, if my memory serves me correctly, you bailed on the Mustang line a few years ago and came back for another ride. I could be wrong and I have *not* done any Forum searches.

We will see though how long you own your Helix but I want to warn you to not listen for and I shouldn't say this word here on the forums but some are talking about *Fizz* on many of the Helix amp models. For that amount of money and only if you can get your hands on check out the Fractal AX8; it has a built in looper as well. Just my measly 2 cents which isn't worth much these days. You used to be able to buy a bubble gum with a cartoon wrapped in it for a penny.

I only say all this because it sounded like from your previous post that you were already not completely happy with Felix. I mean Helix, Felix was that odd couple guy.



Felix: Oscar, Oscar, Oscar... LOL.

Here's how I feel about it so far.

• Sonically, I have zero complaints.

• It took a little over 2 hours to create the 7 patches that I use.

• It is the first modeler I've owned that didn't have me reaching for some knob to tweak at the first gig I used it on (Saturday) . All the presets I created sounded exactly right. Unlike all the other modelers I've owned that had me periodically reaching down to adjust some damned thing or another for the next few months. The GT-5 and 8 had me goofing around with the controls for the next year, nearly. Not an exaggeration - I mostly only play on weekends.

• It's the first modeler I've owned that really truly nails "on the edge of breakup" sound. Single notes sound clean but sustainy. Playing two notes or more just gives the sound a bit of fur. Not fuzz, not fizz nor buzz but just a warm furriness. The M-Floor does it ok... almost... but not like this. This to me, is an epic achievement.
There's an eerie silkiness to the way it sounds that I've never experienced in a modeler before.

• I appreciated the Boss GT-X's flexibility which allowed it to compensate for its rather average innate sound to some degree. You could get very very inventive with it. But that same flexibility was accompanied by an inelegant and needless complexity in its UI. It was a completely aggravating experience trying to create patches on it. I missed that flexibility in the M-Floor but it's sonic superiority allowed me to tolerate its shortcomings. For a while, I was happy because it just naturally sounded so much better than the GTs. Then came the Helix.
For years I loathed the Pods because I found them to be very static and not really responsive to pick attack. Line 6 also seem to have no clue as to what a compressor actually does so I was really taking a chance on the Helix.
The Helix sounds amazing to me and surpasses the GT's flexibility and its truly excellent UI only falters on the more obscure procedures. I blame the really crappy manual mostly but there are some UI things that I think could be a lot simpler.

• Are there things I wish it would do or wish it had? Absolutely. But they're mostly fixable via firmware updates and my list is pretty short.

I'm keeping the M-Floor because I do need a backup and I do still kinda like it.


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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:35 am
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does it give you that "O-face"? :lol: So what do you have this pedal plugged into?

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 7:36 am
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Orcatraz wrote:

• It's the first modeler I've owned that really truly nails "on the edge of breakup" sound. Single notes sound clean but sustainy. Playing two notes or more just gives the sound a bit of fur. Not fuzz, not fizz nor buzz but just a warm furriness. The M-Floor does it ok... almost... but not like this. This to me, is an epic achievement.
There's an eerie silkiness to the way it sounds that I've never experienced in a modeler before.


Then you just never found it in the mustang because thats the sound i live for, and it IS in there. It's the #1 thing by a mile, almost the ONLY thing i base my purchase on when looking for a amp ! And after 2 years i'm still very happy with my V2 III and have no desire to look elsewhere. And every so often i get the bug to try and improve it and usually find a way because the possibilities are almost endless and new ideas often pop up that make me wonder why i didn't try them before, but the answer is there are endless possibilities. You probably just never had the right ideas pop up. But it CAN do that and very well. But i agree, it's the hardest thing to get right, even with a lot of regular tube amps. It;s where the magic is for me.


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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 11:57 pm
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oczad wrote:
Then you just never found it in the mustang because thats the sound i live for, and it IS in there. It's the #1 thing by a mile, almost the ONLY thing i base my purchase on when looking for a amp ! And after 2 years i'm still very happy with my V2 III and have no desire to look elsewhere. And every so often i get the bug to try and improve it and usually find a way because the possibilities are almost endless and new ideas often pop up that make me wonder why i didn't try them before, but the answer is there are endless possibilities. You probably just never had the right ideas pop up. But it CAN do that and very well. But i agree, it's the hardest thing to get right, even with a lot of regular tube amps. It;s where the magic is for me.


Oh, I found it in the mustang and it was pretty good... but not this good. The smoothness of the sounds in the Helix are something that the mustang does not and cannot equal. Then, there's the flexibility. That is absolutely inarguable. I tried to live with the M-Floor's limits and its maddening placement of its effects loop. In the end, I realized that I really needed more flexibility than the mustang can offer. Unlike the mustang, the Helix's routing, signal chain possibilities and its ability to import impulse responses are something the mustangs simply cannot even approach.

The fact that retailers are having a hard time keeping the Helix in stock shows that Fender missed an opportunity. They viewed the Mustangs as a low end product and they likely didn't want to make a pro level modeler to cannibalize sales from their high end tube products. I think they could have had both.

There will always be people who have to have tubes while others are willing to explore newer technologies... and spend money at professional level price points. Sorry, Fender. This was your loss and Line 6's gain. There are quite a few professionals willing to shell out $1500 for a well made, well designed and well executed device. Lots of people were willing to pay for a pro level mustang but you failed to deliver. Too bad.


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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:06 pm
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Orcatraz wrote:
oczad wrote:
Then you just never found it in the mustang because thats the sound i live for, and it IS in there. It's the #1 thing by a mile, almost the ONLY thing i base my purchase on when looking for a amp ! And after 2 years i'm still very happy with my V2 III and have no desire to look elsewhere. And every so often i get the bug to try and improve it and usually find a way because the possibilities are almost endless and new ideas often pop up that make me wonder why i didn't try them before, but the answer is there are endless possibilities. You probably just never had the right ideas pop up. But it CAN do that and very well. But i agree, it's the hardest thing to get right, even with a lot of regular tube amps. It;s where the magic is for me.


Oh, I found it in the mustang and it was pretty good... but not this good. The smoothness of the sounds in the Helix are something that the mustang does not and cannot equal. Then, there's the flexibility. That is absolutely inarguable. I tried to live with the M-Floor's limits and its maddening placement of its effects loop. In the end, I realized that I really needed more flexibility than the mustang can offer. Unlike the mustang, the Helix's routing, signal chain possibilities and its ability to import impulse responses are something the mustangs simply cannot even approach.

The fact that retailers are having a hard time keeping the Helix in stock shows that Fender missed an opportunity. They viewed the Mustangs as a low end product and they likely didn't want to make a pro level modeler to cannibalize sales from their high end tube products. I think they could have had both.

There will always be people who have to have tubes while others are willing to explore newer technologies... and spend money at professional level price points. Sorry, Fender. This was your loss and Line 6's gain. There are quite a few professionals willing to shell out $1500 for a well made, well designed and well executed device. Lots of people were willing to pay for a pro level mustang but you failed to deliver. Too bad.


They delivered, you just found something better years later and paid 8x more Mula, and Dinero. I am very happy for you O and with all due respect.

I would have checked out Fractal for that amount of money which you do not allude to but that is totally okay. Cheers!

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 5:05 am
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Orcatraz, what are you plugging that pedal into? A pignose?

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Post subject: Re: I may be jumping ship as well...
Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 6:27 am
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J.LaGrassa wrote:
I just bought the Mustang IV again clearly knowing that Fender isn't putting much effort into the Mustang amp line it's still a fine amp. It would be nice though to see some updates to the firmware but it does seem like the Mustang Line will be gone soon... plenty of other choices out there.

I quite fancy the new line of Code amps from Marshall , even if i do dip my toes i still love the tone of my MIII enough to keep it. :wink:


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