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Post subject: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig.
Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:56 am
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I came across a thread from April through current about "Good gigging tube amp". I would like more information as I am at a crossroads, so I thought I should break it off into a new thread.

I grew up with the Showman/2 x 15 JBL...you've seen the pic when I was young, thin and had hair. Earlier this year I picked up a Bassman 135 and then found a older 2 x 15 JBL cab for it. You've seen that pic as well.

I absolutely love the sound. I can barely touch the volume in my small office/music room. Like other posters, lugging it around is not fun anymore....I use a hand truck now...but it usually just sits in my music room and gets used as a practice amp.

What a waste, I thought. So I packed it up and took it to a gig at an outdoor venue. I was very disappointed at the carry and actually ended up mic'ing it through my Yamaha PA. I don't remember that being an issue back in the day. (of all the things I miss, I miss my mind the most)

Okay, it still has great tone, really, really, great tone, but I need more carry - with a rig as light as possible, for these type venues. Besides the Bassman 135, all I have is a Rumble 100, which has given me some serious issues lately, and a little Crate 50. I do have the option of mic'ing them, but I really want something that can stand alone for those times when we are using someone else's PA...which can be nasty.

So, lead me down the path. We play primarily Classic Rock, Pop and Blues, and a lot of Motown crossovers, although other stuff sneaks in, like a little jazz and even some CW. I like my bass to sound like a bass, nice and deep. I do not slap, tap or even pic. I am kind of a one pony horse show.

I have started thinking about three pieces. A head, a 1 x 15 cab and a 4 x 10 cab. I grew up thinking you needed the 15s, I know this is not true any longer, but it is still important in my brain. I don't even know if this is right for what I need, just a suggestion from another bassist.

Starting from scratch, build an outdoor rig for me, and make it as light and easy to handle as possible. Looking at the websites for Fender, Mesa, Hartke, etc. is giving me a headache. While money will come into play, please do not let it interfere with building the perfect indoor/outdoor rig for medium venues. (Except for the blues fest, which is wide open outdoors but also has a huge PA, I don't think we have ever had more than 400 or so.)

Thanks in advance for your thoughts. If you need more input from me, just let me know.

Steve

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:16 am
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If tubes are a prerequisite, make it an Ampeg SVT or a Sunn 300T with a pair of 4 x 10 cabs. The head will still be a bytch to hump but the smaller cabs will be more manageable than the 8 x 10 or 2 x 15 behemoths.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:27 pm
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For an all tube rig: Fender Super Bassman and matching 610 (4 ohm) Neo cab. Heavy & Expensive. Those that own them love them.

Another damned expensive all tube rig is the MESA Prodigy 4:88 and a couple of matching 115 cabs. I've not heard one, but I've never heard a bad sounding MESA.

For a smaller & lighter rig (but still expensive): Genz Benz Streamliner 900 or 600 and the matching 212 Neo cab. I've heard this rig live outside and it is absolutely killer! Bass player was playing a five string Music Man. Had about the best low B sound I've ever heard.

Even smaller & lighter, and at less than half the price: Fender Rumble 350 head with two of the matching Rumble 112 Neo cabs.

Like you, Steve, I'm an old Bassman with 15's from way back but, I LOVE the sound of todays twelves even better than fifteens. I'm not a fan of tens but, to be fair, todays tens also sound a whole lot better than they used to.

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:51 pm
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linnin wrote:
I'm not a fan of tens but, to be fair, todays tens also sound a whole lot better than they used to.


+1!

I played with a bassist years ago who used a big QSC head with two cabs -- a 1 x 15 and a 4 x 10 (with horn). It would rattle billiard balls off of a slate pool table from sixty feet away! Just a real primo rig.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 3:14 pm
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Not sure if SWR are tube amps (prolly not) but I always find them to be powerful and nice sounding for what they are.


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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:04 pm
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Thanks all, for the input. There are a couple other amps that have been pm'd to me. An older Sunn and the Fender twin after the merger. I am leaning toward the Super Bassman. I like some of the features a lot, but it has a ton of stuff I will never use. And it is a pile of cash, too.

I have made an appointment to take my Bassman 135 and the 2 x 15 cab in for a check up. I started thinking of some of the gigs I played back in the day with a Showman 100, same cab, and it was never an issue. Maybe there is something wrong that I just don't understand. My tech said he would give me a freebie inspection, so what the heck.

Still working on a cab configuration if I go new. So many choices. I get excited buying basses. Looking for an amp is more like work.

Thanks again. If any other ideas pop into thought, please let me know.

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:51 pm
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Assuming your Bassman 135 is operating correctly, it should have sufficient grunt to fill a modest-sized indoor venue. I have one and it positively rawks. Your issue may in fact be cab-related. The Dual Showman enclosure, like most Fender bass-reflex boxes, is not exactly the pinnacle of sonic efficiency. You might try your head with a variety of modern enclosures to determine if it's able to move more air. Years ago one of my favorite local bass players used a pair of silverface Dual Showman heads through two Sunn 200S cabs. It was as punchy as it gets, indoors or outdoors. Their folded-horn design is superior to merely stuffing a pair of D140Fs into a plain box. And I'm told that the modern 4 x 10 enclosures are nearly as efficient.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:24 pm
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Thanks Arjay, that is an outstanding idea. The new Super Bassman head is $1799, so if the 135 works great on new tech cabs....well that was a great idea. Thanks.

Steve

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:45 pm
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The beauty of the 135 is, with its multi-tap output tranny and self-switching output jacks, it'll run virtually anything down to a 2Ω load. That allows quite a bit of latitude when it comes to cab selection.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:25 pm
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Okay, for the past month I have played more amp models than in the rest of my life put together. These are my semi final thoughts.

The nicest sound was a tie between an Ampeg SVT and the Super Bassman, but the Ampeg is too heavy for me to comfortably transport and set up. The Super Bassman felt lighter than its advertised 65 pounds, maybe because of the cool handles, but I wonder how many more years before that becomes physically challenging.

I put my Bassman 135 on both a new Fender 6 x 10 and a Mesa 2 x 10 stacked with a 1 x 15. Both Sounded great, but the difference between the 135 and Super Bassman is a lot larger than I would have guessed. Mesa has a new tube pre amp project called Prodigy, but it was not in stock to try. 29 pounds!

The Super Bassman I played through the same two cab setups. Wow. The 6 x 10 is a weight issue, and maybe it is mental, but I liked the Mesa stack better, sounded fuller. The 6x10 rolls nicely but it still has to get off the ground and into the car. I think I am back to the 4 x 10 and 1 x 15, but Fender instead of Mesa. (Unless two more 10s effects the sound badly)

One of the most enjoyable things was playing through a wall of Mesa cabs. No idea what kind of amp, he just gave me a remote to plug in and said "Try this". Almost knocked me off my feet. While totally unrealistic, it did bring a smile to my face.

Bottom line. I think Fender is as good, or darn close, to most of the amps out there. It is certainly everything I will ever need. In fact it has more than I want or need in features. Too bad some cannot be removed to lighten it up a little more. I can handle the pieces. And it just feels good to plug into a Fender amp. Still thinking. This is my last amp, so I want to get it right. Wish I knew what my body would be like in ten years.

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 8:15 pm
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So don't tell me it sucks, because I bought it today from MF. 15% off the street price and they waved the shipping on the cabs - amp was already free shipping.

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 8:16 pm
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Wooo-Hooo! Sounds like you've had great fun, Steve!

Yes, you do need to try this before you buy :idea: :arrow: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ProdigyHD/
Too bad they didn't have this in stock for you to audition.

A Fender Super Bassman has just got to sound heavenly! Especially on top of the new Fender Neo 610 :mrgreen: If you don't want that rig just send it to my house. It's Christmas You Know. :wink: Joy of Giving :wink:

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 8:26 pm
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affprod wrote:
So don't tell me it sucks, because I bought it today from MF. 15% off the street price and they waved the shipping on the cabs - amp was already free shipping.


Woooo-Hooooooooooooo! Steve's A Super Fender Bassman Now!

:D 8) :mrgreen: :lol: :D :lol: :mrgreen:

What cabs did ya get?

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:52 am
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Hey Linnin,

I chose a 1x15 and a 4x10. Individually they are something I can handle more easily.

Steve

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Post subject: Re: RE: Good gigging tube amp thread. build the perfect rig
Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:57 pm
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affprod wrote:
Hey Linnin,

I chose a 1x15 and a 4x10. Individually they are something I can handle more easily.

Steve



Burgers & Cheese, Baby, Burgers & Cheese

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