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Post subject: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 7:23 pm
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I recently acquired a vintage Roland Cube 40 in a trade. It came stock with a 10" speaker, but seriously, the speaker really sucks. It sounds like a toy.

The amp is so small that when you turn up the volume, the whole box buzzes which is annoying to no end. However, when I use the "speaker out" with a 12" speaker, the amp sounds just like my JC (without the Chorus of course). So I do like the amplifier itself.

The box is ridiculous. It's particle board, the assembly is all hot glue and staples. When I tried locating the buzzing, 2-cleats broke off just by taking the back off.

So my thoughts are to build my own box for it. I don't care if it has orange vinyl or not. It's not that special.

So then the question becomes, do I build a box made for a 10" or 12" speaker? I already know I like it with a 12", but I've never really tried any aftermarket 10" speakers (Eminence, Jensen, Weber, etc.). Are there really any benefits to having a 10" over a 12" speaker sound-wise? Sure, I could make a smaller box to carry around, but is it worth it as far as the sound?

It definitely seems like the original box is too small to keep things from buzzing like a bee on crack. So, I'd build something bigger anyway.

Any thoughts on 10" speakers? Pros and cons vs. 12"?

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 7:54 pm
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shred6, my only experience with 10" speakers is Ampeg and Acoustic 8x10" cabinets. In that use, it is a lot of air with a very quick response.

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 8:34 pm
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I do miss my HRDV 4x10 man. But I never really was able to compare it to a Deluxe to see what the differences were.

I'm getting a strange idea brewing at the moment. I have an empty pedal board that the Cube's amp might fit in. It's a metal chassis board. How cool would it be to have the amp built into the board with the effects? Then loop the pedals, and use the speaker out to go to a separate speaker box.

I just wonder if stepping on the pedals might set off the reverb springs. Hmmm.

Very interesting idea brewing..

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 8:51 pm
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Ok. That idea lasted all of 5-minutes.

I think it would be more fun to build a box for it. I'm not a metalworker. I do wood.

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 9:21 pm
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As far as 10 inch speakers go, there are some that sound fantastic, and I'm sure that the cab and size of the cab have a lot to do with the sound.

I have a Laney Cub 10 combo (two 6V6) with a Celestion Tube 10 speaker (less than $40) that just rocks, great ceramic sound, classic 6V6 sound from that little amp. I tried a Celestion G10 Alnico Gold speaker ($140), in the same amp and the sound was completely different, and actually too clean for what I wanted.

Probably my favorite speaker cab that I have ever used is a DR Z 2x10, and it sounds absolutely fantastic with a DR head (two 6V6), an Ibanez head (two 6L6) and a custom built head (two 6V6). Clean and driven sounds were just dreamy on all three of those amps.

So it depends on the amp, cab, and the sound that you like. The 10s will generally have less low end, a tighter sound and a bit more articulation that 12s.

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 9:37 pm
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Man, that's the one that got away from me. I ran across one of those cub 10s for $180 and it had an Eminence Ramrod in it.. Didn't have the money at the time.

I went back a week later.. Gone.

I was so bummed. That was a good deal. I like the Cub series.

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Mon May 25, 2015 10:46 pm
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Comparing speakers of 10-inch and 12-inch diameters, simple math reveals that the smaller driver has a radiating cone area of 78.5 square inches while the larger cone boasts 113 square inches -- a differential of nearly 33%. Thus, assuming voice coils of identical diameter and efficiency and similarly-sized magnet structures, the 12-speaker will move more air per watt of input power.

If you plan to build an all-new enclosure, sizing it to accommodate the larger speaker will provide more options when it comes to selecting a driver. The bigger cab can easily fit the ten but the larger speaker size affords more options when it comes to choosing a specific brand and type. And the twelve will produce more volume which may be useful with the smaller smurf-sized amps.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 5:14 am
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I agree with this:

http://www.eminence.com/2011/02/billy-p ... gin-cajun/

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 7:42 am
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Thanks for the link Mike . :D 8)

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 7:43 am
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Going by the input I'm getting from you guys, it's looking like I should go with a 12". The amp sounded really good with an Eminence Red White and Blues and equally as good with a Celestion seventy 80.

With a 12", it sounds like a JC, which is what I'm going for. Not bad for trading a Digitech X-Series pedal for it.

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 8:23 am
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A 10" speaker has it's resonant frequency at @125 Hz. Thats right in the middle of the music. The resonance causes a buzz in your tone. A 12" speaker has its resonant point at 75-80Hz, below the range of guitar. It generally gives a more natural sound to low bass.
The Cube 40 looks like it has a closed back design for extended bass response, but lacks a sealed enclosure that would actually make it work
I would also ditch the metal speaker grille for cloth.


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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 9:58 am
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This is just my own personal opinion as always, however like soooooo many things guitar gear related, it's been my experience that speaker size and brand are very much matters of personal taste more than anything.

Personally I've always felt that 12" speakers (in the broadest general sense) provide the best sound for electric guitars. I've played thru a few amps over the years with 10" speakers...in fact, I still own my old Peavey that's a 1 - 10 combo...and the 10" speakers just always leave me a bit flat. To my ear, they typically sound a bit on the thin and trebly side. I've even played thru some older vintage Fender 4 x 10's...a friend of mine had an older Super Reverb and I've even played thru a couple of old Bassman's and the sound was never really right...at least not for my style of playing. Same goes for the few 1 x15's I've ever tried as well...just doesn't sound right to me. That said however, again I would say that it's more about personal taste...12" speakers just sound "right" to me.

I would add that the same goes for speaker brands as well. For example, it seems a lot of metal players and such tend to favor older Celestion speakers, which I never really cared for. Likewise, I've just NEVER been a fan of Pyle speakers as well...regardless of whether we're talking pro audio or car stereos, Pyles just always sound nasty to me....really mushy with very little projection. My personal favorite has always been the vintage Jensens, although I also have a great fondness for EV speakers as well (can't beat a good EV for massive clean speaker sound). That said, I have Eminence in most of my amps at the moment (including my L5) and I can't really complain. Eminence speakers tend to have a pretty good balance of tone and volume and compared with other quality brands such as EV, Jensen and JBL, they're very reasonably priced too boot.

Now I will say that I'm a bit surprised to hear the comments about the Roland amp. I have one of the Microcubes and granted, I only use it as a practice amp (also great for taking to the park, camping or river side), but I honestly have to say that I've been very pleased with that little amp. For a "cheap" little practice amp, it's rather versatile and even with the tiny little speaker in there, it actually produces some pretty good tones as well. I had also worked with a guy for a brief time who played thru a Cube 40 and again the sound of the amp was really quite impressive.

In any case, if you've tried the amp thru a 12" extension and you're happy with the sound, that's what I'd go for. That said, since you're talking about building your own, you could even design your cab so you can swap out the speaker baffle...make two baffles, 1 for a 10" and 1 for a 12" and just compare. If your sure the problem is with the Roland cabinet itself, you may find that you actually prefer the sound of the 10" (in a good cabinet) over the 12"...everyone's got different tastes.

Anyways, again just my own opinions...please use them for what they're worth.


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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 12:38 pm
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This is my only experience with 10" speakers.
I've used it for about 6 months and I really like it.
It is a bright sound. Sounds great for reggae!

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 3:39 pm
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Just for the record guys, this isn't a newer Cube 40xl amp. It's the older Cube 40. It's not a COSM amp. These Cubes sound truer to the old JC models with the chorus off.

Image

Image

But you can see the size next to my micro-cube. The Japanese really do love cramming things into tight little packages. You can also see that the particle board is even a thinner material than the Micro.

From what I've read, the old Cube 40s, 60s, and 100s are the same amp design. I like the 40 for its manageable lower volume. When I play my JC-50 live, and it gets mic'd, I'm always being told to turn it down. But I'd be teetering between a millimeter around "1" to get it to where they accept it. It just jumps from nothing to too loud with a tiny tap.

With the Cube 40, it's not an issue. From 1-5 is very manageable. But the box needs to go. It's seriously a joke, and the speaker is awful.

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Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 10" speakers
Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 5:17 pm
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Cool photo's Bros !

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