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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:43 pm
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Xhefri wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
I'd ask whoever quoted those specs what the source was for the transition Strat Plus in that during all the years of your interest, our discussions, hundred of sales in the use market, we've never seen one. Most recently, we've commented on the AmStDlx which I suggest might be the confusion.

What prompted this donnybrook in the first? Did 'this guy' give Fender a serial number he wanted verified? 'This guy' just opened a can of worms for the 'unreliable Fender' market. People slapping locking tuners and Lacer Sensor pups on 'swimming pool route' guitars and selling them as transition Strat Plus. :oops:

I agree 100% I question it myself and the guy is as bad as the Fire Storm troll, emailing me and threatening me. Crazy people out there. I would guess he has a late 1988 American Deluxe Standard.

Yah!! What thread did we see that guitar in?!? You responded to it. Anyway, THE Strat Plus, as introduced in 1987, and receiving the 1989 Music and Sound Award for Most Innovative Guitar had, by definition...

-a two point trem from the American Standard
-Sperzel Locking Tuners
-Wilkinson Roller Nut
-Lace Sensor Pickups

It is acknowledged that the design of the roller nut, locking tuners and pickups evolved. However, one can reasonably argue that, absent the roller nut, which was essential to the design purpose of the use of the vibrato, it could not be considered a Strat Plus. An American Standard Deluxe of that period could also have locking tuners and Lace Sensor pickups. Whoever alleges otherwise needs to come up with more than just hearsay. Why not tap Dave's Guitars in Illinois, and Gruhn's Guitars in Nashville, on the shoulder and ask..."Ever seen a factory Strat Plus go out the door with a conventional nut instead of a roller nut?"

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:50 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
OK...here we go! Here are some of the things which come to mind. A study in contrast. This article is borrowed from Music Trade Magazine for the benefit of 'the money' knowing how their investment dollars are being applied.
- It catalogs the reign of Larry Thomas from his inception at FMIC in 2010 to the writing of the article, sometime before the coming Winter 2014 NAMM.
-Cites that they turned to private equity for capitalization rather than a public offering which appeared was not going to fly in the financial climate of that moment.
-It cites Thomas' lauding of an 'extraordinary and exceptional team', 'an exceptional organization', 'people in the right positions giving them support and encouragement'.
-Hard on the heels of the date of that article, Eldred is given his walking papers.
- Eight weeks after the article is published in Music Trades, Thomas announces his retirement.
- a TPG partner takes his seat, still sitting as far as I can learn.
- a year later Rob is no longer required
- dealers state that new Fender sales and marketing policies are objectionable
- one dealer writes in the press as to why they 'fired Fender'.
-article written in 2/2015 not hopeful for Guitar Center.

Just say'in.... :?

I really do not want to seem like we're Fender bashing. We are on this forum because we enjoy and love Fender guitars as well as its history. You have made some very keen observations. I think what we really talking about here is that most corporations always think that those at the top know the best while ignoring those at the bottom and often squeezing those that are in between. I know three music stores, one which is owned by some good friends of mine, that have dropped the Fender line. They told me some of the problems they have on the receiving end. Unrealistic quotas, too many warranty problems, poor set ups when the guitars come in, and a company that's not very friendly to deal with. One guy at a music store was telling me that he feels that the Fender guitar company is catering more to the big franchises and being somewhat less friendly towards the mom-and-pop shops and even medium sized, privately owned stores.

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Last edited by Xhefri on Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 4:13 am
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Xhefri wrote:
You have made some very keen observations. I think what we really talking about here is that most corporations always think that those at the top know the best while ignoring those at the bottom and often squeezing those that are in between.

If you look at the roster of the TPG 'suits' running the show out there, many of them appear to be '40-somethings'. Decades younger than the inception of the marque we're talking about, with likely little or no 'feel goodness' about it. Larry Thomas, for all of his love of guitar, is out of the picture, for what ever reasons unknown to us, as well as key members we had grown to trust and rely on. If the 'suits' were the likes of Paul Allen, well, we might have a better case to argue. But these guys are capital investors priding themselves in investing in and grooming what they consider to be 'niche market' plums for profit. They'll do what's necessary to assure that the market continues to yield them a continuously increasing bottom line that stays in the black. Can't argue that, from a business model, but there's a tradition here which is important and you can't always preserve that with infusions of young blood. There's something about apprenticeship and handing down from experienced employees, and taking over the reins that works here, such that the past is not lost. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:56 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
Xhefri wrote:
You have made some very keen observations. I think what we really talking about here is that most corporations always think that those at the top know the best while ignoring those at the bottom and often squeezing those that are in between.

If you look at the roster of the TPG 'suits' running the show out there, many of them appear to be '40-somethings'. Decades younger than the inception of the marque we're talking about, with likely little or no 'feel goodness' about it. Larry Thomas, for all of his love of guitar, is out of the picture, for what ever reasons unknown to us, as well as key members we had grown to trust and rely on. If the 'suits' were the likes of Paul Allen, well, we might have a better case to argue. But these guys are capital investors priding themselves in investing in and grooming what they consider to be 'niche market' plums for profit. They'll do what's necessary to assure that the market continues to yield them a continuously increasing bottom line that stays in the black. Can't argue that, from a business model, but there's a tradition here which is important and you can't always preserve that with infusions of young blood. There's something about apprenticeship and handing down from experienced employees, and taking over the reins that works here, such that the past is not lost. :wink:

And I am sure there has to be a degree of that going on at Fender. It is not like every 55+ year old employee is gone now! Just some key people who, like you said, we trusted and who were always humble, knowledgeable, and considerate to those of us who interfaced with them. Fender still has some great employees, I am sure. The point is what happens at a company when a corporation such as CBS, back in the 1970s, tried to own and operate a company like Fender. They applied all their "knowledge" of marketing and strategies from that day and time into a guitar industry. It was tough times for Fender. And they just couldn't do it very well. I can't help but to think there is a repeat of this going on right now. Anyhow I guess we have beat this drum to death..... ;-)

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 9:34 am
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Xhefri wrote:
Anyhow I guess we have beat this drum to death..... ;-)

Yep...it's all downward and inward from here on! 8)

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 3:18 pm
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I don't know if this has been covered here before...it's news to me.

I found mention of John Page today and thought this would be a good place for the information.

http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/22342-john-page-guitars-announces-the-ashburn

excerpt:

Pittsburgh, PA (April 2, 2015) -- John Page Classic, a new guitar brand that brings the custom design magic of John Page, formerly Fender Custom Shop co-founder and among the greatest living custom luthiers, to production guitars, announced the Ashburn, its initial production model. The double cutaway, hardbody Ashburn was meticulously designed by John Page, produced to his exacting standards in a state of the art workshop in Japan and set up in the US by authorized John Page Classic techs. MSRP is $1499.

“The Ashburn has all the design features in my hand built custom guitars,” said John Page. “It’s the culmination of my nearly 40 years building custom guitars, and through John Page Classic I’m now able to make the Page custom design experience available to more people.”



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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 4:56 pm
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bad timing Bros
danagos wrote:
I don't know if this has been covered here before...it's news to me.

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 8:16 pm
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See www.mikeeldredtrio.com and follow/friend them on Facebook. You're in for quite a treat! :wink: 8)

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:15 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
See http://www.mikeeldredtrio.com and follow/friend them on Facebook. You're in for quite a treat! :wink: 8)


The site was last updated a year ago with:

22/04/14 Coming soon!

... and the menu choices sport Lorem Ipsum text, and the upcoming events say "Nothing".
Not much of a treat...


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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:39 pm
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arth1 wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
See http://www.mikeeldredtrio.com and follow/friend them on Facebook. You're in for quite a treat! :wink: 8)
The site was last updated a year ago with: 22/04/14 Coming soon... and the menu choices sport Lorem Ipsum text, and the upcoming events say "Nothing" Not much of a treat...

Your tastes might run more to their Facebook page. :idea: It's current. 8)

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 5:43 pm
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arth1 wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
See http://www.mikeeldredtrio.com and follow/friend them on Facebook. You're in for quite a treat! :wink: 8)


The site was last updated a year ago with:

22/04/14 Coming soon!



... and the menu choices sport Lorem Ipsum text, and the upcoming events say "Nothing".
Not much of a treat...

:lol: Art

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 6:43 am
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Solid Body Love Songs wrote:
:lol: Art

Yes....we know. That old familiar 'Father forgive him.....' line is appropriate here.

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:18 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
Solid Body Love Songs wrote:
:lol: Art

Yes....we know. That old familiar 'Father forgive him.....' line is appropriate here.

Keep your deity to yourself, and I'll return the favor, 'k?


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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:22 am
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perfect time for a kum by ya hug moment!!!! ...either that....or Electric Flag's Just Got In from Texas"...yeh maybe some blues......that's the ticket....

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Post subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE OLDER EMPLOYEES AT FENDER?
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:48 am
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Solid Body Love Songs wrote:
bad timing Bros
danagos wrote:
I don't know if this has been covered here before...it's news to me.

Thanks for the warning SBLS...but of what? :?

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