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Post subject: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 4:08 am
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Hi

I was wondering what you guys think about using digital effects and multifx. I'm considering a Zoom G3 Guitar Multi Effects Pedal to experiment a bit with effects since I decided that if I buy analog effects, I want to buy good analog effects. It seems pretty nice if I watch youtube reviews but I'd like to find some reliable written reviews too. Not the reviews from ultimate guitar that always say that it is the best thing in the world, they are not really nuanced.

But how do you think about using digital multifx? Do you think it's worth to buy one for experimenting and even play some gigs with it?

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 6:14 am
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I bought my old Boss Gt-6 from new, at first i thought it was the best thing since sliced bread, but the convenience of storing presets as opposed to manual twiddling of knobs is a bonus, i prefere the sounds of individual pedals though. I just bought a Mustang III amp, and if the Floor version is just as good, this is the way to go. The Mustang series modeling knocks spots off anything in its price rannge for sound and quality. It all depends on the sound you are after, we are all different.

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 8:27 am
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I have a Zoom G3X. I've had three multi-effects pedals and two modeling amps. The Zoom is a good one. It has good editing software, but you can easily do all your editing on the pedal without the software if you want. You can create presets and rearrange the pedals the way you want. You can have six pedals in a preset, which is normally enough. You can either switch from preset to preset, or go into an individual preset and turn pedals on or off as you play, just like a pedal board. I also like that it can operate on batteries, so that I can take it to open mic nights, walk up on stage and plug it into an amp and be ready to go, without looking for power or dragging a power cord up there with me.
I also have a nice pedal board and Egnator amp. Sound quality wise, the amp and pedal board wins out. Overall, the factory presets and the individual pedal settings that come with the Zoom, are treble oriented. I guess they want to make sure you cut through the mix and don't think their product is muddy. So I find I have to spend extra effort to not sound ice picky with all my multi-effects pedals.
But I usually use my Zoom for shows and band rehearsal because stomping on one pedal is a lot easier in the middle of a song than doing a tap dance with two or three other pedals. Plus, with presets, there's no more tweaking of knobs between songs, trying to remember how you want each pedal set for a particular song. I usually have one or two presets for each song I do, and keep a list with me on stage.
So my nice pedal board is pretty much relegated to home practice, which bothers me some, but it's reality.
Edit: One thing I've realized is when you ask for peoples opinions on gear, you have to match how they use the gear to how you want to use the gear. To me that falls into four categories: are your gigging or are you playing at home. Are you looking for your own cool sound or are you doing covers and trying to replicate the sound of the recordings?
Right now, I'm playing out with a band doing covers and trying to sound like the recording, not my own cool sound. So having a lot of pedals and effects available and having them set just like each song needs, is important to me. That's why a multi-effects pedal works for me now. If I progress to a band doing mostly originals and I need to develop my own sound, the Zoom will probably stay home and my pedal board will get the call.

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:30 pm
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I used to own the g3. great little multifx unit. when I saw the g-5, I found a good deal on a used one, and my brother now has the g3. the g-5 has 4 pushbuttons, a boost, and an expression pedal.

I have had it a year now, and still find out things that I didn't know it could do. it is literally like having many pedals, all at a good price.

will it ever replace hi priced "botique' pedals? probably not, but for this musician who gigs only occasionally, it is a great choice.


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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 6:36 pm
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IMO, digital, multi-fx processors give OK approximations, but not nearly as good as analog and individual pedals. I own a Digitech RP355 (which is never used anymore) and owned a Peavey Vypyr 75 for over a year and sold it. All these sounds give you a good idea of what they're trying to emulate, but they're not quite IT!

Something to play with and learn by...sure, but when you want the best tone you can get, you'll go elsewhere.

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Last edited by IM4Tone on Mon Dec 22, 2014 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 6:45 pm
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I have a Digitech RP350 that I have been less than impressed with. There is admittedly so much that you can do with it, but a lot of it just sounds "too digital" if that makes sense. For other effects, I have some real cheap Fab effects (chorus and delay pedals) that are actually pretty good that I use instead of the much more capable Digitech (but I don't use them much, just sometimes). That being said, I still use my Line 6 Spyder3 150w head religously. It has built-in digital effects, also. But I use those very lightly .. just the minimum-allowed chorus and tape echo, if any. With the Line 6, I have a handful of killer, killer tones dialed and preset; I have toyed with the idea of changing it, but there is no real reason to.

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 8:46 pm
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I have Plenty of experience with digi/modelling, too.

My first was a Digitech BP350. I got it the same day I bought my first bass and amp. The last two posts were pretty much on target- sounds decent, does A LOT, etc. What they didn't mention is that it is VERY complicated to figure out and use... The old ten pounds in a five pound sack. What I could get it to do sounded very good, but I got so frustrated trying to figure it out, that I abandoned it, and never plugged it in again. To be fair, it probably wasn't the best choice for a brand new bass player...

I also have and have used a LOT: 2 full on modelling amps and a hybrid amp with some modelling.

Vox VT20+
Fender Mustang III
Fender SuperChamp X2

Vox: FX sounded pretty nice, esp the reverb- but they were victims of the usual on-amp fx compromise: controlability was limited to mainly level, plus speed for the mod and time based effects. Ie, if the sound of the included effect is what you want- bingo, you're in luck. If not, Sorry Charlie... The amp models were nice, too. Not as flexible as those on the Mustang, but they didn't need to be- there are 33 of them. Just try another if this one isn't what you want. For home use, or for an originals or narrowly focused covers band, this could fit the bill. They only have 8 user adjustable presets, and only those are footswitchable. Not ideal for someone who needs to use a lot of different sounds on stage, and needs a great switching system.

Musty: This amp is in another league. The amp models are very, VERY good- and EVERYTHING is adjustable. Same for the effects: very detailed, and you can tweak the heck out of them. Best of all, for gigging etc, the switching system is very good! All 100 presets are fully user adjustable, and the footswitch options cover everything- even the tuner.

SC X2. Has a hybrid pre=amp, and an all tube power amp. You get the tubey feel and sound, because it is a tube amp. BUT, you also get the flexibility and options of a digital based system.

I also have plenty of "real" pedals, and quite a few are analog. Personally, I don't see it as an either/or proposition. Both types of fx have their own niche, and both can sound good or bad. It just depends on the context, and the user.

Sometimes tape echo/analog delay is all that will do. Other times, a digi delay would be a better option. All depends on what YOU want it to sound like.

Bottom line:

Digi gear isn't necessarily bad or "inferior". Like anything else, you need to choose wisely- and most importantly: take the time to learn how to get the best out of it. As others have pointed out, it can actually simplify your life. One last example: I have two different delay pedals, an MXR Carbon Copy analog delay, and a TCE Flashback.

The Carbon copy specializes in one type of sound- analog delay, and does it very well. Basic controls, too: level, feedback and rate. It also has a button to add a chorus effect to the repeats. If that's the sound you want Great! It does not, however, do any other type.

The TC, is a digital pedal. along with the normal delay controls, you get a mode knob that allows you to choose between a bunch of types of delay- even reverse. There are also presets here as well. AND there is a mini toggle to switch between quarter notes, dotted eighths, and one other. The pedal has a brighter crisper sound to it, but it does do tape echo and analog, if you like.

I wouldn't say that one is categorically "better" than the other- they both work and sound great. Just depends on what I want at the time. But, if "your" sound is old school analog delay and nothing else- get the Carbon copy, or some other analog pedal of your choosing and rock on. If you need more choices, get something like the Flashback. Or get BOTH!


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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 5:56 am
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Try a bunch of pedals and get what sounds good to your ears. I tried the digital effect route and hated it. I felt it destroyed the tone of both my guitars and amps and made them sound too processed. But, then again I run a tube rig and I'm an older guy and pretty old school. I also build most of my analog effects. I built a digital reverb pedal, and don't care for it either so I'm getting ready to build a tube reverb kit from ModKits Diy. One sound I don't like is the kazoo tone over processed of a lot of bands. Sometimes what some guitarists like don't cut a mix very well either. In the end, It's all up to you. I like the simplicity of analog plug and play. If I want a preset, I just tape the knobs down where I want them. Modeling amps and effects don't do it for me either. I have too much history with the real stuff to buy into the hype that modeling amps sound anything like the real thing. YMMV

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:42 am
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I think there's no one answer in the entire digital / analog spectrum.

I think I do prefer analog, as it tends to add the least amount of sterilization to your tone.


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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:22 am
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Yes, I record and gig with digital multi-fx pedals as I mostly play a lot of space and psychedelic and experimental.

I must say, though, I'm glad I learned to play without the use of them.
It helped to develop the proper understanding of how a guitar works.

In the world of multi-fx, I am loving my Eventide Pitch Factor, Mod Factor, and Space Reverb!
These are some seriously good quality units, a little pricey, but well worth it.
The possibilities are wide open.


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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:35 am
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I agree about this too. Digital multi-effect pedals are okay for some, but not others. There are countless debates still going on over this topic.

I look at it from a reliability standpoint and also from an audio (i.e. stereo system) example.

Digital multi-effect pedal: Everything all-in-one. Everything you need is all right there, built in. No need for daisy chaining pedals and have dozens of power adapter cords. The bad part is that your sound will be processed, integrated, and you're kind of stuck with what kind digital components are producing the effect. The worst part... If something happens to the unit, you're screwed. The whole thing is toast. Think of it like a home stereo system.
* You can have either a giant sized boombox (all in one stereo) where everything is built in. --OR--
* You can have a separate AM/FM Receiver/amp/tuner, a separate CD player, a separate cassette tape deck (if you still use them!), and you can even have a separate graphic EQ system. If one them breaks, you can remove it from the arrangement, and replace it. All the other components will still work.

Individual pedals: You can mix and match analog pedals to suit your taste. They will be more expensive in the long run to be able to do what a multi-effect pedal can do (i.e. 1 integrated unit vs 15 individual pedals), but the sound won't be as processed and/or ubiquitous or whatever. You can sort of create your own style and sound with a variety of individual pedals.

Minimalist approach: Use only a few pedals very sparingly. One analog delay pedal, one overdrive pedal, and maybe a chorus pedal or a really cool tremolo pedal, and that's about it.


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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:53 am
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Or just do what I do. Run a pedalboard and two amps. One amp carries all kinds of crazy stuff. Mostly clones I made like my Ibanez Flying pan clone, Mutron Octave Divider, various Fuzz and Overdrive pedals. My other amp carries the right stereo signal as well as a boost if needed. There are no rules and it depends on the gig. Some gigs I just run my 5e3 clone a guitar and a cord. Don't let rules get in the way. There are tons of really great sounding pedals out there. I've built over a dozen and I keep building them. It's addictive. Let your sonic creativity dictate the outcome.

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 5:48 pm
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I have a Zoom effect/tuner pedal but I don't use it that much. I've always preferred to let the pickups and the amp set the tone.

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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:33 pm
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Post subject: Re: What do you think about using digital effects
Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:26 am
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Nick Le Zens wrote:
I bought my old Boss Gt-6 from new, at first i thought it was the best thing since sliced bread, but the convenience of storing presets as opposed to manual twiddling of knobs is a bonus, i prefere the sounds of individual pedals though. I just bought a Mustang III amp, and if the Floor version is just as good, this is the way to go. The Mustang series modeling knocks spots off anything in its price rannge for sound and quality. It all depends on the sound you are after, we are all different.

I’m totally with you on this.

I too got a GT6 years ago and had a blast with it and was very proficient with it. Then I got an amazon giftcard from work so on a whim got a Mustang II v.2 just to have a little practice amp. The GT6 was immediately kicked to the curb. Now I’m kicking myself for not selling the GT6 first and going with the Mustang III for the LCD screen and footswitch options. Still love my Mustang II but I also have a couple dirt pedals in front of it to augment the limitation of the single button switch. The Fuzz stomp on the mustang isn’t something to write home about but most MultiFx units lack in the Fuzz department anyway IMO. I think that’s definitely one pedal that’s’ best left to real life Transistors and Caps.

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