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Post subject: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference?
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 12:36 pm
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Whats the difference in modern C vs regular C shaped necks?

Also, why do a lot of people say big hands wont work with 7.25? I have huge hands and came to the conclusion that I much prefer the 7.25/vintage fret combo instead of the 9.5/medium jumbo combo...


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:07 pm
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teleric wrote:
Whats the difference in modern C vs regular C shaped necks?

Also, why do a lot of people say big hands wont work with 7.25? I have huge hands and came to the conclusion that I much prefer the 7.25/vintage fret combo instead of the 9.5/medium jumbo combo...

The nut is usually narrower too - 41.3 vs 42.8 mm. Big hands usually means big fingers too, and it becomes hard to do some chords without muting adjacent strings.
When I press my first three fingers together as tight as possible, and measure the three fingernails, I get 43 mm. I.e. I can press down all six strings with three fingers, and doing several of the open chords the "standard" way is impossible. And more so on a narrower neck.


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2014 3:15 am
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The most comprehensive (and thus also the most confusing) view to Fender neck shapes

On the big fingers vs guitar neck issue, it's all about personal preferences - and getting used to something ('taming the beast', so to speak). Jumping from a wide neck acoustic to a tiny mandolin is a challenge, but hey, that's the fun in playing.


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 6:56 am
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Compare and contrast the specs between the American Standard Stratocaster and the David Gilmour Stratocaster. :idea:

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 7:02 am
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jmattis wrote:
The most comprehensive (and thus also the most confusing) view to Fender neck shapes

This is probably the best they've given us on the subject since the inception of the Forums. It's clear to me why I find the Clapton neck preferable.

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 10:22 am
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arth1 wrote:
teleric wrote:
Whats the difference in modern C vs regular C shaped necks?

Also, why do a lot of people say big hands wont work with 7.25? I have huge hands and came to the conclusion that I much prefer the 7.25/vintage fret combo instead of the 9.5/medium jumbo combo...

The nut is usually narrower too - 41.3 vs 42.8 mm. Big hands usually means big fingers too, and it becomes hard to do some chords without muting adjacent strings.
When I press my first three fingers together as tight as possible, and measure the three fingernails, I get 43 mm. I.e. I can press down all six strings with three fingers, and doing several of the open chords the "standard" way is impossible. And more so on a narrower neck.


I don't think big hands and fingers make it "impossible" to play chords on smaller necks, that statement makes no sense to me.

I have a 7.25/modern C/vintage frets and it is my favorite Fender combo. Even though my hands and fingers are huge, I have no issue playing a vintage neck. I prefer the smaller nut, neck, and frets!

I can't even go back to a 9.5 with medium jumbos and feel comfortable. The smaller neck and frets make my technique better and with the smaller frets the action just feels so smooooooth. When I play a standard Tele with 9.5 and medium jumbos it feels HUGE and makes it harder to play fast...which is annoying.

I guess everyone is different...


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 11:11 am
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teleric wrote:
I don't think big hands and fingers make it "impossible" to play chords on smaller necks, that statement makes no sense to me.


Take an open A chord as an example. if you cannot physically fit three fingers diagonally in the 2nd fret box of the 2nd to 4th string, even with perfect top-down fingertip position, that is a problem. How does that not make sense?

If you still can't see the problem, the next time you're at a guitar dealer, pick up a child sized guitar and try playing it.

There are always alternatives, like playing an open A with a single or two fingers, or a half barre with the pinky on the 1st string 5th fret. But when your first three fingers have as wide fingernails as many people's thumb nails, there's not much you can do with technique to make them fit.
Having a slightly wider neck can make a lot of difference.

Quite a few famous guitarists have rather small hands. Clapton and Blackmore are good examples. Gilmour has normal sized hands which look big because of small wrists and arms, but compared to the fretboard they're not big. Hendrix had bigger hands, and he also avoided many chords and found alternatives. Al King had big hands, and likewise played alternative styles.
You do what you have to do.


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 1:28 pm
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arth1 wrote:
...Quite a few famous guitarists have rather small hands. Clapton and Blackmore are good examples.

Carefully watch Clapton play on slo-mo. You'll note that the second finger of his left hand has a much longer reach than the third and will more often use that finger to fret a note which most others will use the third finger for. Most easily seen in pentatonic runs, and often when he's playing above the 12th fret where he does a great deal of his soloing, for the very reason you cited. Space. The carve of the neck on his signature Strat, which is taken from a favorite Martin acoustic, is likely an ergonomic advantage to him. It also lends support to the web area between the thumb and index finger for a player who wraps the thumb over the neck shoulder. Each of my five Strats have a different neck carve and the Claptons are my favorites for the unique shape of the neck.

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:05 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
a favorite Martin acoustic


The guitar you're talking about was used extensively during the 1970s; it was first seen during a gig at Nassau Coliseum in June 30, 1974.

Image

Image

Image

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 5:32 am
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On 'my dumb things I gotta do' list is finding that Martin EC acoustic at some dealer and checking out that neck.

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 7:54 am
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arth1 wrote:
teleric wrote:
I don't think big hands and fingers make it "impossible" to play chords on smaller necks, that statement makes no sense to me.


Take an open A chord as an example. if you cannot physically fit three fingers diagonally in the 2nd fret box of the 2nd to 4th string, even with perfect top-down fingertip position, that is a problem. How does that not make sense?

If you still can't see the problem, the next time you're at a guitar dealer, pick up a child sized guitar and try playing it.

There are always alternatives, like playing an open A with a single or two fingers, or a half barre with the pinky on the 1st string 5th fret. But when your first three fingers have as wide fingernails as many people's thumb nails, there's not much you can do with technique to make them fit.
Having a slightly wider neck can make a lot of difference.

Quite a few famous guitarists have rather small hands. Clapton and Blackmore are good examples. Gilmour has normal sized hands which look big because of small wrists and arms, but compared to the fretboard they're not big. Hendrix had bigger hands, and he also avoided many chords and found alternatives. Al King had big hands, and likewise played alternative styles.
You do what you have to do.


I see what you are saying but I guess I don't have this problem. Even with big hands I am able to fit three fingers and still play open A.

I love the vintage specs, for me its easier and faster to play on.


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:26 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
On 'my dumb things I gotta do' list is finding that Martin EC acoustic at some dealer and checking out that neck.


Best advice is to send an email to the manufacturer first. :idea:

This particular guitar was manufactured many years before slowhand became an official endorsee of their instruments.

Quote:
You'll note that the second finger of his left hand has a much longer reach than the third and will more often use that finger to fret a note which most others will use the third finger for. Most easily seen in pentatonic runs, and often when he's playing above the 12th fret where he does a great deal of his soloing, for the very reason you cited.


This technique can be seen on the 24 Nights DVD in the middle of the closing solo from Robert Cray's Old Love.



Last edited by chromeface on Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:34 am
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I prefer vintage radius always. On bass it has to be vintage Precision all the way. Early 50's preferable in terms of neck specs, late 50's is okay too. On guitar I prefer the neck on the 52 RI Telecaster. Vintage radius, fat U shape. Modern Fender radius' like the 9.5 doesn't work for me at all. Normally the 12 doesn't either, but something about the neck on the Classic Series 72 Tele Deluxe works really good. I think it may have to do with the fact that the string spacing is very wide for a guitar. So any difficulty I would normally have by the flatter radius is made up for by the fact that the strings are far apart which is more comfortable coming from a big P bass neck. Any other guitar I've ever tried with a 12" radius I've hated.

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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:00 am
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TheKingofPain wrote:
I prefer vintage radius always. On bass it has to be vintage Precision all the way. Early 50's preferable in terms of neck specs, late 50's is okay too. On guitar I prefer the neck on the 52 RI Telecaster. Vintage radius, fat U shape. Modern Fender radius' like the 9.5 doesn't work for me at all. Normally the 12 doesn't either, but something about the neck on the Classic Series 72 Tele Deluxe works really good. I think it may have to do with the fact that the string spacing is very wide for a guitar. So any difficulty I would normally have by the flatter radius is made up for by the fact that the strings are far apart which is more comfortable coming from a big P bass neck. Any other guitar I've ever tried with a 12" radius I've hated.

I've come to like the compound radius necks a lot. Having the top flatter means I can keep the action lower and still bend. And a lower action means less pressure, and I use a less of my fingertips, meaning they fit better on the high frets. Vintage frets help too.


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Post subject: Re: Modern C vs. Regular C shape neck - whats the difference
Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 6:04 am
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arth1 wrote:
TheKingofPain wrote:
I prefer vintage radius always. On bass it has to be vintage Precision all the way. Early 50's preferable in terms of neck specs, late 50's is okay too. On guitar I prefer the neck on the 52 RI Telecaster. Vintage radius, fat U shape. Modern Fender radius' like the 9.5 doesn't work for me at all. Normally the 12 doesn't either, but something about the neck on the Classic Series 72 Tele Deluxe works really good. I think it may have to do with the fact that the string spacing is very wide for a guitar. So any difficulty I would normally have by the flatter radius is made up for by the fact that the strings are far apart which is more comfortable coming from a big P bass neck. Any other guitar I've ever tried with a 12" radius I've hated.

I've come to like the compound radius necks a lot. Having the top flatter means I can keep the action lower and still bend. And a lower action means less pressure, and I use a less of my fingertips, meaning they fit better on the high frets. Vintage frets help too.



I think if I were ever to put down serious money on a guitar this is the way I'd go. Believe it or not the newer Vintage Hot Rod basses have this. Not really a feature I'd be after on a bass, but on a guitar I think it would honestly be perfect. 7.25-12" on a 50's style Tele neck? That seems like it might be perfect for me. I also agree on vintage frets. I don't like medium jumbos at all.

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