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Post subject: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 6:07 am
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Any of you "Keefer'' followers have a handle on the percentage of songs he's used his flat-tuned/5 string setup for and whether or not this goes for Ron Wood as well, both in the studio and live?

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 7:41 am
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I can't quote percentages...it is probably very large, but possibly still in the minority given just how many songs he's written in the last 50 years.

There are other forums/sites with lists...such as this (usual disclaimer on links):

http://www.iorr.org/talk/read.php?1,682940,682959

I can't say I agree with the list and all the conversation, but it is food for thought. Scroll down for a short interview segment and typically-Keith responses...

afaik, he's used mostly the same tunings live and in the studio, and Ron/Mick/Brian did most of their lead work in standard tuning.

There are exceptions, of course...Some songs are in Open D or E (or Csus4), and sometimes different live/studio, but Open G is part of his signature sound.

Sort of makes you want to take up the Banjo...

Cheers.

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:21 am
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[quote="HeyJoe42Sort of makes you want to take up the Banjo...Cheers.[/quote]
Thanks for the informative response. It more than gives one pause as to whether or not it is worth setting aside one guitar exclusively for that setup. Makes my VG Strat an even more flexible toy. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:44 am
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I have a lot of fun in open G. I find it takes quite some time to tune to Open G with my strat with it's floating bridge, so I use my SG as it is easier to tune, stop tail bridge and I leave my 6th E on just avoid it while playing. I must say a lot of the times it is very stones sounding other times I get a Led Zep, George Thorogood and even The Black Crowes vibe and maybe a little of my own sound, sorry didn't mean to get off subject. I not sure of the exact percentage though they sure do use it a lot, so I am no help here
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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:14 pm
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I use open G a lot--almost 40% of my playing time in total, and about 85-90% of my slide playing.

I don't know what Keef uses (if it's any different than Open G without the big E or little E), but Ronnie used to use open A a lot in the Faces and early in his tenure with the Stones...either that, or they capo'd up from Open G.

I love Open D, too--that can be a lot of fund licks and riffs...

The thing that really makes jazzy, dark or minor-key songs ring true is Open Gm or Open Dm...mmm, mmm, MMM that's cool! 8)

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:39 pm
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A video I stumbled upon piqued my curiosity about that tuning. I'll have to dig out my VG Strat and noodle around with it in G tuning. I knew there was a reason I held on to that guitar. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:00 pm
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Screamin Armadillo wrote:
I don't know what Keef uses (if it's any different than Open G without the big E or little E)


-0-G-D-G-B-D, I think.

Screamin Armadillo wrote:
I love Open D, too--that can be a lot of fund licks and riffs...

The thing that really makes jazzy, dark or minor-key songs ring true is Open Gm or Open Dm...mmm, mmm, MMM that's cool! 8)


Try D-A-D-F-A-D


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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:59 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
Any of you "Keefer'' followers have a handle on the percentage of songs he's used his flat-tuned/5 string setup for and whether or not this goes for Ron Wood as well, both in the studio and live?


Ha, you can't even begin to touch Keith Richards or emulate anything about him, pff! :P


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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:05 pm
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Cheap shot ad hominem attacks occur when one has nothing intelligent to add to a discussion. On the plus side, it does allow us to take the measure of a (wo)man.

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:17 pm
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modwiz wrote:
Cheap shot ad hominem attacks occur when one has nothing intelligent to add to a discussion. On the plus side, it does allow us to take the measure of a (wo)man.


It wasn't a cheap shot, it was just reality, in that you're Joe Blow and he is Keith Richards and you want to even that disparity. :lol:


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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:25 pm
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I have also wondered when Keith got into the open G was Mick Taylor playing in standard tuning for all his fills?


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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 6:59 am
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The open G tuning came from the blues guys who were a big influence (thanks Mr. Obvious!!) early on.


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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:22 am
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LeftyBlues wrote:
The open G tuning came from the blues guys who were a big influence (thanks Mr. Obvious!!) early on.

I guess that's right .
I am no big Stones- fan, although I like a lot of their songs. I've heard that it was Ry Cooder that first presented this tuning for the Stones in the late 60s. And they immediately fell in love with it, Keef especially .
That might be correct - from that period and further on, that sound of that tuning with a couple of chords , are almost the signature sound of the Stones

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:39 am
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Good article, Doc :

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/george-ra ... 72201.html

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Post subject: Re: 'Keefer Tuning'
Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 12:40 pm
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Congratulations for most impossible question ever posted on the forum (Mr. Richards himself couldn't do it...).

But seriously, folks, it's a not a bad idea to have a guitar reserved for open tuning, saves a lot of hassle (unless we'd be talking about drop-D, of course).

This quote below is from the iorr.org link HeyJoe42 posted - I'd never read it, and maybe someone else is interested, too.
Quote:
MUSICIAN: For years I went through a lot of frustration trying to get that ringing chordal sound you get on guitar. Finally, someone who worked with you told me the secret was that you used only five strings on your guitar and a special open tuning. What's the advantage of that kind of tuning and where'd it come from?
RICHARDS: The advantage is that you can get certain drone notes going. It's an open G tuning, with the low E string removed and there's really only three notes you use.
My favorite phrase about this style of playing is that all you need to play it is five strings, three notes, two fingers and one (here the forum automatically censors Keefs word - guess it: Equus asinus + Courtney Love's band) , [general merriment]
Actually, it's an old five-string banjo tuning that dates back to when the guitar began to replace the banjo in popularity after the first World War. It's called a Sears Roebuck tuning sometimes because they started selling guitars then. The blacks used to buy them and just take the bottom string off and tune them like their banjos. It's also very good for slide work.

MUSICIAN: Are there only a limited number of chord shapes to work with?
RICHARDS: Obviously there's not as many shapes as in concert tuning, but there's an amazing number of augmented and diminished things you can do and basically still keep the same chord going and a lot of the notes ringing,
It's roughly the same principle as the sitar without having the sympathetic strings, because you have the possibility, especially when you electrify an open G, of having those hanging notes that go through all the chord changes and still ring. [picking up guitar] See, if I remove this low E and retune from the bottom or fifth string, it's G, D, G, B, D.

MUSICIAN: Why'd you start using it - boredom?
RICHARDS: Yeah, in a sense. After playing just about every night for five years, I was no longer getting any "happy accidents." I knew my way around the guitar enough that I was starting to get locked into playing like myself.
So open tuning was a kind of therapy in which I had to teach myself the instrument again in a new way.

MUSICIAN: What was the first thing you wrote in an alternate tuning?
RICHARDS: I started precisely around the time of Beggar's Banquet.
"Street Fighting Man" was an early one and just before that " Jumpin' Jack Flash," [plays riff on guitar, shifts it slightly into Chicago blues-style vamp] The Everly Brothers got "Bye Bye Love” from working with that kind of riff, too.


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