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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 3:29 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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...and while I'll agree that most Fender Acoustics are sub-par, there are specific models that really standout waaaay above their pedigree.

I own two of the mid-80's F-series acoustic that were made in Korea.

I know what you're thinking:
Fender acoustic guitar.
Made in the 80's.
In Korea.

It should be crap.

But everybody who has played either of these guitars has agreed that they are great. Good, silky-smooth-yet-punchy tone, nice feel, rich bottom end, sparkly highs. Look nice, too.

The "regular" acoustic (Fender F-250) is richer sounding, and a bit smoother as well. The second of these guitars I own (Fender F-270CE) is a bit brighter, so it cuts through the mix in an acoustic circle a bit better...plus it has a pickup (with volume, tone and notch filter controls) that sounds pretty dang good and a cutaway.

I've had people sniff at or look down their nose at these guitars; I tell them, "Play it and then tell me what you think!" Nine times out of ten, they're pleasantly surprised at the quality of tone, feel and finish of these "cheap, cruddy" instruments.

I've played other Fender acoustics that were total crap...but these particular models seem to be pretty dang good.

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:00 pm
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I was hoping Fender would resurrect some of Guild's electric models again so I'm a bit sad about it. Guild's factory was in Rhode Island in recent years. The New Hartford, CT factory was an old mill building on the banks of the Farmington River that housed the original Ovation factory. I got a tour of it back in the early '70s and still have one of the Glen Campbell picks they gave me.

It makes me wonder if we aren't moving into another situation like we had in the 1980s. Synths became the instruments of the '80s and it almost brought down both Fender and Gibson. Today with the rise of electronic music like EDM, people are using inexpensive virtual instruments and soft synths to create music. The expensive synths of yesteryear can be had cheaply in the form of a software package and MIDI controller. Modern keyboards have much more capability than their predecessors and at a fraction of the price.

I'm not selling any of my gear because you just never know. Scary.


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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:14 pm
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I don't know. That music never really went away in Europe and it remained part of the underground Goth scene even here. Yet U2 saved a lot of the guitar music here in terms of pop back in the day, and I don't think guitar will ever truly fade away in this country. Blues, country and americana is still alive and well and I honestly think it always will be. Metal-core or post-hardcore and metal or whatever kids call the crap that passes for harder music now in place of punk and metal and the modern synth pop and sample stuff will come and go. That's fine, too. It has it's place. Hell early Big Audio Dynamite was cool stuff.

However, I think it always reaches a point where it gets too automated and it always strips itself back organically. If you're band has a position called "macbook pro" there is a good chunk of people who aren't going to take you seriously. Artistically I can give it it's space, but I'll never really call it musicianship and I'll never buy it. I'm not alone. The sky isn't falling. The storm clouds are just gathering, but this too shall pass.

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:21 pm
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I'm going to stick by my earlier statement regarding some of the lower end model lines. Maybe if the quality was better it would make a difference. I bought my grandson one of the modern player starcasters (semi hollow) used for 500 bucks, it wasn't terrible but it wasn't great. We gutted it, replaced the pots, switches, pickups and tail piece, it turned out pretty nice. We put around 200 dollars in it, the pickups were duncans I had, and it's really a nice guitar, aside from the headstock, an upcoming project. My point is if fender would have put a little higher quality parts in it, and put it out for $899 or even $999 they would have had a guitar that would appeal to the better player. Now that being said, I could be full of crap, but we like the crap out of it now. Just an opinion, Opinions are like a..holes, everybody has one, most of them stink.
Tom

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:33 pm
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456strings wrote:
I'm going to stick by my earlier statement regarding some of the lower end model lines. Maybe if the quality was better it would make a difference. I bought my grandson one of the modern player starcasters (semi hollow) used for 500 bucks, it wasn't terrible but it wasn't great. We gutted it, replaced the pots, switches, pickups and tail piece, it turned out great. We put around 200 dollars in it, the pickups were duncans I had, and it's really a nice guitar, aside from the headstock, an upcoming project. My point is if fender would have put a little higher quality parts in it, and put it out for $899 or even $999 they would have had a guitar that would appeal to the better player. Now that being said, I could be full of crap, but we like the crap out of it now. Just an opinion, Opinions are like a..holes, everybody has one, most of them stink.
Tom



Honestly, I haven't found anything below the Classic Series coming out of Ensenada to be consistently , giggably well made. However, that doesn't mean that there aren't diamonds in the rough. I played one of the old Squier Precision TB basses. I have to tell you I was seriously considering picking it up. It was a ton of bass for the money. That being said, within a couple of years I would have likely had to replace a jack or something. I've just reached the point where I'd rather pay more upfront and be happy with a bass from the get go. I think Fender just simply needs to scale back a lot across the board. The fact that the Chinese and MIM Fenders overlap with the Squiers at some price points is just nuts. There are a TON of basses at the lower rungs. Which is kind of ridiculous. If you look at the Squier and MIM Fenders there are THREE Mike Dirnt Signature models.... seriously?

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:38 pm
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A guy I know has a couple of the Newark Street Guilds and I had the opportunity to spend some with them. I thought they were pretty nice, he loves them. He has a starfire 4 and a s-100, I really liked the s-100. Didn't they go over very well?
Tom

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:42 pm
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Showing Dirnt some love.

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 6:39 am
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456strings wrote:
I'm going to stick by my earlier statement regarding some of the lower end model lines. Maybe if the quality was better it would make a difference. I bought my grandson one of the modern player starcasters (semi hollow) used for 500 bucks, it wasn't terrible but it wasn't great. We gutted it, replaced the pots, switches, pickups and tail piece, it turned out pretty nice. We put around 200 dollars in it, the pickups were duncans I had, and it's really a nice guitar, aside from the headstock, an upcoming project. My point is if fender would have put a little higher quality parts in it, and put it out for $899 or even $999 they would have had a guitar that would appeal to the better player. Now that being said, I could be full of crap, but we like the crap out of it now. Just an opinion, Opinions are like a..holes, everybody has one, most of them stink.
Tom

I played one if those Starcasters recently and was really disappointed with the tone.

It had a nice fit and finish and the playability was good, but it was very uninspiring, bland and generic in tone and sound.

Maybe it was the pickups, but after all the anticipation for this model, I expected more. A good pair of the Lollar Wide-Range clones might make it a usable axe.

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 6:57 am
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456strings wrote:
Showing Dirnt some love.



Don't get me wrong. Mike's a great guy, and I really like what he does. However, 3 sig models is a bit ... much. At least I'd think it is for a company that's facing the kinds of woes that Fender is going to be coming up against.

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 7:13 am
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guitslinger wrote:
I guess there really is something to the old adage that "A new broom sweeps clean." It didn't take long for the new CEO to start to trim the fat-or what he saw as excess weight from the company.I just hope that Cordoba is capable of turning out as good a Guild guitar line as Fender has been doing over the past few years and that they don't farm out the building of the Guild brand to the lowest bidder and turn it into an inferior low budget brand as Gibson had originally done with Epiphone,that would be a sad fate for what has long been a highly regarded guitar brand.I also hope that the new CEO doesn't start cutting out iconic models.With the large number of Strat and Tele models,especially,it wouldn't surprise me a bit if he starts cutting back on the number of "tribute" and "artist" guitars from these lines-for starters.I'm afraid that he'll start doing a slash and burn and start clear-cutting the recently resurrected models such as the Coronado and the new Starcaster reissues before they've really had a chance to become established-or before I've had a chance to buy one.I'm by no means a business man with any financial know-how but I just hope that he doesn't go overboard with his cutting back models etc. in order to boost the bottom line.




BINGO!! Same opinion here! It worried me when I read this today and learned in the process of reading the thread that Fender has a new CEO. Anytime someone else takes over something such as a legendary guitar brand like Fender, it worries me. While I'll admit that I'm not up to stuff about what happened during the much earlier years (50's - 60s) and don't know much about it, I try to stay informed about what's going on with them today.



I just hope that the time doesn't ever come when they cease production of the RI Paisley Teles..... :(

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 7:46 am
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Tony Trout wrote:
I just hope that the time doesn't ever come when they cease production of the RI Paisley Teles..... :(

But this kind of thinking is what has put Fender in the position they're in...by trying to address every single person's wants/needs/quirks, they've watered down their products.

As cool as the Paisley Telecasters are (and they ARE cool), how many of them are you gonna buy? One, probably...two at most? In your whole lifetime!
It's a limited-interest model that many/most musicians/consumers will not buy. Not because it's a negative thing, but because it's something unique that most players say, "Cool! Now give a butterscotch one..."

I love my Fiesta Red Stratocaster...but I also understand why that color is somewhat rare--not everybody likes it, and many of the people that DO like it wouldn't necessarily buy one, partially because of the garishness of the finish.

The smart thing (as far as unique or "different" finishes) is to periodically make small batches or special runs. That does two things--it makes that rare one more desirable (and valuable), and ensures that when they make that unique axe (every five-to-eight years), it will ACTUALLY SELL.

While Paisley Teles are cool, the fact that you don't see a ton of players with them should tell you something--

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 8:19 am
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See. As a P bass player who prefers vintage style 50's Ps this isn't really a scare for me. We don't get custom colors on the AVS 58P. Other than Black. :roll: So there's no real danger in losing anything. Guitar players have been spoiled. (as have J bass players to some extent) So the thought of Fender scaling back is a bit disconcerting. The reality is that if I want to see an American Made Vintage Reissue 58 P bass in any of the multitude of custom colors that get thrown at the guitar models every year I need to go to the Custom Shop. (Hell, even the Custom Shop runs generally use the same tired finishes unless you go to the Masterbuilds)

It's been like this for decades. So it's nothing new for me. When it comes to the P bass Fender seems to like churning out tons of options on low end junk, but charge an arm and a leg for a quality American made reissues with paltry finish options. It's ridiculous. Thinning the herd? No problem for me.

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Post subject: Re: Fender sold Guild !
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 1:16 pm
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Screamin Armadillo
The pickups made all the difference, a JB in the bridge and a jazz in the neck. If you want to get excited about a starcaster check out "mooncaster" bodies on the warmouth site. Their is one of those in my future. Also check out Trey Anastasio's (Phish) $15000 guitar.Starcaster wrapped in Koa, beautiful!!!!
Tom

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