It is currently Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:03 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
Post subject: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 3:44 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 6:10 pm
Posts: 2261
Location: Elay
I know I should have asked this question BEFORE I ordered my parts, but I'll put it out there anyway.
I ordered a new Egnater Renegade 65w head. (I know Shimmilou is shaking his head)
I plan on putting together a 1X12 and a 2X12 cabinet to use with it. I've already ordered an empty 1X12 off of ebay as well as a Celestion G12M-65 Creamback speaker which is rated at 65w to put into the 1X12.
I seriously doubt that I will ever crank the amp all the way and blow the speaker. Is there any other reason I would have been better off getting a higher wattage speaker? I figure if I ever want to push the speaker a bit, I can raise the main and lower my input volume, to see what I get.
Should I have played it safe and left more headroom?

_________________
'10 American Deluxe HSS Sunset Metallic
'10 JA-90 Thinline Telecaster
'15 Music Man JP-15 Blueberry Burst
'07 Les Paul Standard Faded LCPG #82
'14 Carvin ST300
'12 Carvin CS424S
'66 Guild Starfire IV w/Bigsby
'14 Warmouth Partscaster Daphne Blue


Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:13 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:50 pm
Posts: 7998
Location: ʎɹʇunoɔ ǝsoɹ pןıʍ
There are different schools of thought on that issue.
I've known guys who won't go with anything less than 200%.
Meaning the speaker can handle twice what the amp puts out.
Many of or local amp gurus on this board recommend 150% (50W amp, 75W speaker).
I've never had a blown speaker using 110% (minimum) as my guideline. (50W amp, 55W+ speaker)

Thing is ... you say you're not going to dime your amp but then you dime your amp.
Guitar amps are supposed to be dime-able.

_________________
Image
Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:36 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 6:10 pm
Posts: 2261
Location: Elay
Thanks, I'm going to install it and see how it sounds. I can always put it into the 2X12 if I want to play it safe. Do you think I will get speaker breakup if I start to push it with the master volume up? It's probably not a sound I want for what I play. But I'm curious.

_________________
'10 American Deluxe HSS Sunset Metallic
'10 JA-90 Thinline Telecaster
'15 Music Man JP-15 Blueberry Burst
'07 Les Paul Standard Faded LCPG #82
'14 Carvin ST300
'12 Carvin CS424S
'66 Guild Starfire IV w/Bigsby
'14 Warmouth Partscaster Daphne Blue


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:54 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:10 pm
Posts: 5646
Location: Gateway to the West
Drew365 wrote:
Thanks, I'm going to install it and see how it sounds. I can always put it into the 2X12 if I want to play it safe. Do you think I will get speaker breakup if I start to push it with the master volume up? It's probably not a sound I want for what I play. But I'm curious.


Drew365...sure you're not going to dime the amp :P BMW-KTM is correct about going at LEAST 110%. You might be happier and get a fuller tone with a 2x12 configuration and you'll also be safe wattage wise :!:

T2

_________________
-----------------------------------------------------------
What time is it? It's Fender Time.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:57 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:50 pm
Posts: 7998
Location: ʎɹʇunoɔ ǝsoɹ pןıʍ
The Creamback has a fairly nice breakup to it but whether you find it depends on how you set your amp. It's a decent speaker that will still be of value to you somewhere but I think I would suggest you find a higher rated speaker if your plan to explore where the speaker's breakup begins. This is what I meant in my first post. You say you won't push it but then you push it. Everyone does.

_________________
Image
Just think of how awesome a guitar player you could have been by now if you had only spent the last 10 years practicing instead of obsessing over pickups and roasted maple necks.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:56 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:52 am
Posts: 3840
Location: Colorado Springs
Drew365 wrote:
I ordered a new Egnater Renegade 65w head ... I plan on putting together a 1X12 and a 2X12 cabinet to use with it. I've already ordered a Celestion G12M-65 Creamback speaker which is rated at 65w to put into the 1X12 ... Is there any reason I would have been better off getting a higher wattage speaker?

With your head, you will be applying that 65w to BOTH cabinets in parallel. That means if the impedance of each cab is the same, that 65w Celestion will only see 32.5w if you are all dimed out on the head. But even if you ran with only the Celestion 1x12 cab, it is unlikely you would run into any problem.

Just make sure you do a proper "parallel impedance" calculation on your two cabinets, and set the impedance setting on the head to match the what your parallel impedance is. If you end up disconnecting the 2x12 cab, remember to change the impedance setting on the head accordingly.

Congrats on the cool gear!

_________________
Laughing out loud with fear and hope, I have a desperate plan ...


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:53 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:20 pm
Posts: 9640
Location: Indiana
Keep in mind that many amps wattage ratings are based on a low distortion output (clean), and when the amp is cranked, the distortion can cause the output wattage to exceed the amps stated rating. I think this is why many like to have a much higher wattage speaker that has some margin for error.

Drew365 wrote:
...I ordered a new Egnater Renegade 65w head. (I know Shimmilou is shaking his head)...


:lol:

_________________
---> "The amp should be SWITCHED OFF AND UNPLUGGED before you do this!" <---

Por favor, disculpe mi español, no se llega a la práctica con mucha frecuencia.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 8:06 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:50 pm
Posts: 4602
Location: ˚ɷ˚
shimmilou wrote:
Keep in mind that many amps wattage ratings are based on a low distortion output (clean), and when the amp is cranked, the distortion can cause the output wattage to exceed the amps stated rating. I think this is why many like to have a much higher wattage speaker that has some margin for error.

True, but it's not just the amp's stated rating and risk of burning out elements or blow a fuse, but how well the amp can control the speaker. If it's turned up to eleven, it might send the speaker cone out with enough force that it doesn't have the power to pull it back in again a few milliseconds later.

There are three remedies for this:
1: Use a sturdier speaker element.
2: Use a more powerful amp. This may sound counter-intuitive, but a 60W amp has less risk of damaging speakers than a 30W amp when played at the same volume. Of course, if you crank it up to even louder because you can, that goes out the window, which brings us to:
3: Don't crank it up that friggin' high.


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Amp Wattage - Speaker Wattage
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 8:30 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 6:10 pm
Posts: 2261
Location: Elay
I think I will send the G12M-65 back and not risk blowing it, because I have other plans for the 2X12 and don't want to put the Creamback in it. Celestion makes a G12M-75. That would give me about 115% margin. I don't think AMS carries that speaker though.
Vox makes a Neodymium 80w. I have one in my AD60VTX. I'd love to use that and save some weight, but I'd have to buy a Vox cabinet to get it and I already ordered my 1X12 empty cabinet.
What place online has a good selection of speakers for sale?

_________________
'10 American Deluxe HSS Sunset Metallic
'10 JA-90 Thinline Telecaster
'15 Music Man JP-15 Blueberry Burst
'07 Les Paul Standard Faded LCPG #82
'14 Carvin ST300
'12 Carvin CS424S
'66 Guild Starfire IV w/Bigsby
'14 Warmouth Partscaster Daphne Blue


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: