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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 1:36 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
I've been to clubs that looked and sounded like that.

… but I thought you said 432, not 423.

:wink:


Thanks for paying attention. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 2:24 pm
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Miami Mike wrote:
BMW-KTM wrote:
I've been to clubs that looked and sounded like that.

… but I thought you said 432, not 423.

:wink:


Thanks for paying attention. :wink:

I guess I should put in my numbers....442...as in Oldmobile 442. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 2:53 pm
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wferguson , you are twisted those southparkers are sick. :lol:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 3:11 pm
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Solid Body Love Songs wrote:
wferguson , you are twisted those southparkers are sick. :lol:

Simply a manifestation of the level of intellect, creativity, and sense of humor of their creators and the audience they play to.....Forum Members excluded....of course. :lol:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 3:04 am
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Wow all these different Hz, a simple search on youtube and you can have your DNA repaired, Chakra mended, Pineal gland activated / cleansed, and a host of other remedies through the wonder of Hz, just a tip though, don't listen to them in the same room as your buzzing fridge, something to do with hypnosis, 35hrs solid I've been glued to the screen, a backhander from the wife finally done the trick and broke me free :)


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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 7:50 am
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Found elsewhere on the interwebs (so it must be true :roll: )

"Pythagoras, the ancient Greek all-round smart person, was attributed a tuning with a reference of 432hz for an A now simply called Pythagorean Tuning. It is/was based on a tuning ratio of 3:2, whereas most Western musical tuning is based on a ratio of 1:1 (not really sure what means, but its an easily researchable topic).

Complicated tuning ratios and mathematics aside, the traditional 440hz scale looks like this (with the 432hz scale mentioned further down). The sound of the scale reportedly makes the sound of perfect 5ths sound harmonically rich and "smooth" while 3rds (particularly major and minor), which have relatively complex tuning ratios of 81:64 and 32:27 respectively, sound dissonant. To counter-act this problem with certain intervals, the Pythagorean Scale idea came along.

A Pythagorean Scale is simply put, any scale that is comprised entirely of perfect 5ths and octaves. An example would be that old chestnut, C Major. The dissonant intervals that arose from the Pythagorean tuning are known as "wolf intervals" due to their sound (presumably, it sounds like a wolf). This tuning and scale were thought to have been wide-spread in the ancient world, but now are both rarely heard about (bad pun) in modern music, mostly due to that wolf interval and modern music generally being more harmonically exploratory (in Pythagorean tuning, this approach would've caused the wolf interval to show up more).

The "Experiment"
A few months ago, I tested out the 432hz reference on my guitar, tuned to D standard and occasionally Drop C. I've been using this tuning up until right just now where I decided to try 440 again to see if there'd be any discernible difference. To test it out during recording, I did a cover of "Jane Doe" by Converge a month or so after I started to use the tuning. (Shameless self-promoting linkage). But turning back towards the point, overall I noticed a difference in the way things sounded: Individual notes played in a scale sounded relatively indifferent to each other, while the higher up the fretboard I played, the more noticeable a slight discrepancy in notation became, until the point where I was confused over if my intonation was out of whack or if it was just the tuning. I also noticed that an open A# perfect 5th power chord (as if there's any other type of power chord) sounded "clean", fully tuned and warmer than an open A#maj7 barre chord, which sounded slightly out of tune but with a lot of "colour" to it, if that makes sense (people with synesthesia will know more about that).

In comparison, another guitar tuned to 440 in E standard playing the same chords sounded flatter and duller overall, but with much less underlying dissonance, having more consonance. Even when tuning the strings to as close as 432 as possible, the dissonance was still there, and it changed the way I started writing riffs, where death metallish dissonance actually sounded nicer than playing melodies that used diatonic chord patterns. Another thing I sort of stumbled on, was that the guy who initially told me about this, had recently "converted" the entire "Periphery II" album from (what was apparently) 440hz to 432hz. All it needed was some editing in Audacity to change it. I heard the song "Racecar" (actually from the first album) in 440 then 432. The overall sound difference was noticeable, the 432 version sounding warmer, clearer and instantly sounded more listenable (given my opinion on Periphery, that's something, right?) but the 440 version felt tighter, with more aggressive energy.

You can actually try this experiment yourself (very thankfully, for free as free can be): Download Audacity, which is freeware, follow these steps in this video and discern whether or not there's any difference.
The Crazy Parts
Okay, so 432hz doesn't seem to be a big deal up until you understand why its suddenly been cropping up in places: Crazy conspiracy theories. According to the weird side of the internet, a torrent of reliable and factual information (haha, yeah right), during World War 2, a certain Mr Goebbels (crazy Nazi propaganda minister) was thinking of more and more ideas that allowed for complete superiority over the general populace (as if murdering people wasn't enough) when he stumbled upon the idea of changing standardized musical tuning to something that would cause stress or anxiety in casual listeners, hence the change to 440. He pushed this idea heavily but it was ultimately rejected once the war actually started. Then (internet reliability still in effect), the NWO (yes, really) implemented the change seemingly overnight because they felt like it, and now the supposed reason that the modern lifestyle is full of stress and conformity is because of a slight uptuning in instrumentation across popular music.

It's now safe to take off the tin foil hat. Crazy Nazi theories aside (without a mention of Hitler, until just now), there might be some weight to the "tunings make you feel different" idea. According to another internet page (which I lost the link to), 432hz is tied with the Music of the Spheres, where planets and celestial bodies (another name for planets, I think) generate their own frequency. Its not entirely ignorable: Science previously discovered that the static on your TV is actually the sound and energy of dying stars, and that anything producing energy actually produces some kind of sound, whether loud or quiet (that includes atoms vibrating). This possibly means that, given our knack for living on earth, we're "tuned" to the cosmic hum of the planets rotation (kind of a cool idea actually). And for some reason, this is believed to be in the tuning of 432hz."

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:57 am
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Oh. My.
That's the most complete misunderstanding of tunings and intonations I have ever seen.

I guess it's time for the crazies to come out of the woodwork, eh? Remember, it's okay to step on them, but you get your shoes dirty so it's usually not worth it.
They make a most satisfying sound, though. 442 Hz concert pitch, I think.


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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 9:57 am
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Solid Body Love Songs wrote:
wferguson , you are twisted those southparkers are sick. :lol:

That is a freaking funny clip :lol:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:27 am
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I prefer setting "A flat" as 432 hz.

Try it. Your car will run better, you'll get a raise, and your asthma will be cured.

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:28 am
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No more constipated conversations...Tune to 432...


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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 11:05 am
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Miami Mike wrote:
Found elsewhere on the interwebs (so it must be true :roll: )
Science previously discovered that the static on your TV is actually the sound and energy of dying stars, and that anything producing energy actually produces some kind of sound, whether loud or quiet (that includes atoms vibrating). This possibly means that, given our knack for living on earth, we're "tuned" to the cosmic hum of the planets rotation (kind of a cool idea actually)."


So if I'm reading this right, my tinnitus is causing me to listen to dying planets! If I hear a faint "help", and no one is around, should I just ignore it? :lol:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 11:18 am
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Drew365 wrote:
So if I'm reading this right, my tinnitus is causing me to listen to dying planets! If I hear a faint "help", and no one is around, should I just ignore it? :lol:


"I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced. I fear something terrible has happened."


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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:37 pm
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Miami Mike wrote:
Crazy conspiracy theories. According to the weird side of the internet, a torrent of reliable and factual information (haha, yeah right), during World War 2, a certain Mr Goebbels (crazy Nazi propaganda minister) was thinking of more and more ideas that allowed for complete superiority over the general populace (as if murdering people wasn't enough) when he stumbled upon the idea of changing standardized musical tuning to something that would cause stress or anxiety in casual listeners, hence the change to 440. .... Crazy Nazi theories aside (without a mention of Hitler, until just now), there might be some weight to the "tunings make you feel different" idea.

Mr Miami, I am not sure if you saw my post back a page but I mentioned that "my friend went on to explain that Hitler understood this principle of dissident tone and in fact de-tuned the engines on his bombers to wreak terror to those who where about to be bombed."

Drew365 wrote:
So if I'm reading this right, my tinnitus is causing me to listen to dying planets! If I hear a faint "help", and no one is around, should I just ignore it? :lol:

If this be the case I have been hearing a lot of dying planets---for years. And all this time I thought it was just loud music that did this too me! :?

arth1 wrote:
Oh. My....I guess it's time for the crazies to come out of the woodwork, eh? Remember, it's okay to step on them, but you get your shoes dirty so it's usually not worth it.

It's time? :lol: :lol: What do you been thinking has been happening throughout this thread! :shock: All except me that is... :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:52 pm
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Xhefri wrote:
Mr Miami, I am not sure if you saw my post back a page but I mentioned that "my friend went on to explain that Hitler understood this principle of dissident tone and in fact de-tuned the engines on his bombers to wreak terror to those who where about to be bombed."


Yes, I did see it Mr X. I'm just enjoying this thread for the entertainment factor. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 440hz - a conspiracy???
Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:04 pm
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Miami Mike wrote:
Xhefri wrote:
Mr Miami, I am not sure if you saw my post back a page but I mentioned that "my friend went on to explain that Hitler understood this principle of dissident tone and in fact de-tuned the engines on his bombers to wreak terror to those who where about to be bombed."


Yes, I did see it Mr X. I'm just enjoying this thread for the entertainment factor. :wink:

LOL, a nice break from arguing about some guitar finish..eh?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Do not miss that (shhhhh) :wink:

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