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Post subject: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:43 pm
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I am certain that there are tons of forum members who have gone this route or in the opposite direction. I've been playing guitar since 1970, but I played orchestral double bass and dabbled in flute before that. I have always loved piano/organ/keyboard music, and I figured, shoot, I'm not getting any younger, it's time to learn, especially now that digital keyboards allow you to practice without driving the neighbors or housemates crazy!

What I would like to know is, what do you guys and gals consider a practical route towards learning decent keyboard skills? I'm leaning toward lessons, but I have no desire to learn classical piano or intricate technique, so I don't want to waste a lot of time in that direction. I just want to be able to play chords and arpeggios with the left and right hands so I can provide keyboard parts for guitar recordings. I am patient, methodical, and know the value of practice, but I do want to have some fun along the way (for instance, I'd be thrilled to be able to play the Fender Rhodes parts in Ray Charles' "What'd I Say", and the Doors' "Riders On The Storm"! :D)

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:36 pm
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Learn the notes first. It's really easy because all the flats or sharps are black notes.

If you want to play something in a major key, play it in C. All white notes.

If you want to play something in a minor pentatonic, play it in E flat. All black notes.

That should be enough to get you going for a while!

Good luck and let us know how it goes.


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:27 am
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How's your theory? I find when I sit down to play the piano theory knowledge is the only thing which lets me figure out where my hands are supposed to go.

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:29 am
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Roadie
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Learn chords and scales first, But first you have to start with a Hammond organ, because you have to build your confidence up!

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 10:21 am
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Apart from practicing daily, learning to read notes is likely what's going to help you the most. If you have some theoretical background in guitar, you may already know how to read G-clef notes, or at least have some exposure to them through tab sheets with sheet notation above the tabs.
But for piano, being able to read F-clef notes for the left hand is just as important. You can count the good one-handed pianists on one... Er..

The good news: Learning basic keyboard skills isn't that difficult.

The bad news: Unless you're an exceptional talent, you won't be able to play "Riders on the Storm" any time soon. It's not a hard piece, technically - there's only one section where finger placement is important to not run out of fingers. But the song requires being able to play different rhythm patterns with your left and right hand, and that usually takes practice.
A drummer would likely have an easier time with that than a guitar player.

You could get a synth wih a sequencer, and record one hand first, and then play the other on top of that. And that's not a bad learning technique either.


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:28 am
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Seems like you have some varied instrument experience. Just buy a good keyboard , and you will soon find your way around it , recognize notes and chords. Then you'll see if you need lessons , which is always a good thing , but not a must :)

I guess I was 8 years old when we got an upright piano in my home . Never played anything before , but soon found some simple melodies and chord patterns to use. No big deal. Later I was on for 4-5 years with classical training , one lesson each week. Got a used guitar at 14 (in -71) and fooled around with that the same way. Never took lessons (but later , actually worked as a guitar teacher for a while) Thanks to interest, passion and former theoretical knowledge.

I would recommend you to do most of your training with some acoustic piano sound. Good luck, you 'll make it :-D

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 8:36 pm
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So you play guitar and have played contrabass and flute.
Just get a used synth (Korg, Roland, Wurly) and a chord
book (with inversions) and I think with what you've already
done, you'll be playing those parts and more in a short time.

Good luck!

I started on a Chroma Polaris and now like the Korg sounds.

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:10 am
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Lessons, 2 credits a semester for private lessons, my instructor was excellent with the patience of a saint, twinkle twikle little star to mozart, awkwardly but mozart in a semester. I actually followed her instructions rehearsed daily final performace both semesters was for her eyes only I got an A. Grade point maintained. :D 8)

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:09 am
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Even though my mother taught me my first song on piano when I was 3 or 4,it wasn't until my teens that I got either bit serious about playing keys.I was totally self taught and since I knew what the notes were on both piano and guitar,I learned the piano chords by sitting at the piano and transposing the main or basic notes in a guitar chord to the corresponding notes on the piano.From that basic start I just played the chords with my left hand while playing the melody of accompaniment with my right,I don't know if anyone else ever tried or used this unorthodox method but it certainly worked for me.

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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 8:51 am
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Learn scales with 2 hands. One of the hardest things is develping the independence in each hand. That said, you should also try some simple songs in easy keys like C, G, F etc. You can't just practice scales itt will bore you to death. You need some balance. Thiis a start.


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 8:54 am
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Hi, yeah, I did the same thing. But I was always jealous of those who could play like Scott Joplin or Fats Waller. You know lots of left hand bass notes and chords. It always gave me trouble so I went back to guitar.


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:23 am
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Roadie
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I just want to thank everyone who replied for their suggestions. Every one of them seems like a good idea and doable, but, Nathan, I may have trouble running down a Hammond organ right away (seems like anybody who has one has already turned it into a head :lol: ).

Since the notes repeat themselves up and down the keyboard, they are proving easier to identify by sight than those on a guitar fretboard ever were! I'm going to take the chord-learning route, that should allow me to do what I want--Keith Emerson or Stevie Wonder, I don't ever intend to be...I do have two clients who are accomplished piano players who say they would be delighted to give me pointers and check my technique along the way so I don't get too far in the weeds!

Again, thanks, you guys. I'm going to go hard at it after Christmas!

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"If today was Christmas Eve, if today was Christmas Eve,
Tomorrow would be Christmas Day..."


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 9:13 am
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If going the chord route, beware of one major difference:
When playing guitar (with a pick), one almost always tries to get the bass note match the root of the chord. If you play an open D using a pick, you usually start with the D string, not the A string.

On a keyboard, this is not the case. You just as often start with the third or fifth, based on what's most convenient for fingering. If you need to emphasize the root note, you hit it harder.

Example: Play an open C: C-E-G
Now transition to F. If doing it the guitar way, you'd jump up (or down) to F-A-C. If doing it the piano way, you'll likely do C-F-A instead. You don't have to move your hand much.

So instead of learning chords based on the base note, try to learn all permutations of them (usually three for major and minors), and learn how to get from one chord to another. It will make it a lot easier to play fluidly.


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 9:18 am
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I've gone down this road. I've been playing guitar since I was about 10 (56 now). I started playing Piano in late 2004, and I never looked back. I was going however in the opposite direction, I was more interested in Classical and solo pieces than I was Blues/Rock and R&B.

I've no idea how much theory you have, but what ever you have accumulated from your years on guitar, you're going to take a lot of that with ya. you're just going to have to translate to piano.

If you don't already read, you will want to learn a bit on how to read music (C and G clefs of course...) you wont need to be a sight reader, but you're going to want to know what the notes are when you glance at a piece of sheet music and what the basic rules of the road are.

Set up a GOOD practice routine, starting out, shoot for 30/45 minutes a day... everyday.... If you're anything like me, I went nuts once I had some progress.. I could have easily spent two hours a day practicing.. I was glued to the bench for a lot of my first year. (I Still can get lost for hours on the piano, I just love the thing..)

If your shopping out a keyboard, and your "key interest" is piano.. Get an 88 key (weighted) board. The 66 , 76 keyboards with the non-weighted keys are going to be very limiting for you.

about lessons... I advise it.. They will help you avoid bad habits. I would take 6 months worth of lessons from, stop for 6 months, than go back for another 6 month stint. I did this for maybe 2 years. the 6 months of NO LESSONS help me digest all the stuff the previous 6 months OF LESSONS had. (He was good about writing everything out, and his theory knowledge was excellent.

For Challenges, there will be many,,

The hardest thing for me was left/right hand independence. I had to work hard on this, I suspect you will too, (as ya know, your hands are always working together on guitar,, on piano,, ha.. not so much)..

Patience will be your biggest ally

suggest that you get yourself a fake book, maybe even a beatles fake book, (something with songs you KNOW very well already) pick an easy tunes, find your way around the chord changes, learn your chord position and just work that one song, start to finish. Move on to the next.

For technique,
Learn the major scales as best you can (it's boring, but it will help) Start with C, then D, E all the natural keys,, then the flats. There's a book on preparatory exercises by Schmitt, that gives you all the "correct" fingerings (WICKED important), as well as some pretty advanced exercises, don't get bogged down with these, but spend some time with them, 5 ~ 10 minutes a day. Stick with it, it adds up.

I don't spend an abundance of time on them these days, but I did do this, and my hands know exactly where to go when I want to loosen up with some scale work (Muscle Memory is your friend!)

I'm glad I made this move, I'm now able to play as many songs on Piano as I want. In the cover band I work with, we have a keyboard player, but we collaborate and you wouldn't believe the stuff we can cover with two of us manning the keyboards for some songs,

Good Luck! It's an awesome instrument, to know both, would make you a serious DOUBLE THREAT!

/Ray


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Post subject: Re: Guitar Player Wants To Learn Keyboards--Advice?
Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 9:46 am
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KidBlast wrote:
The hardest thing for me was left/right hand independence. I had to work hard on this, I suspect you will too, (as ya know, your hands are always working together on guitar,, on piano,, ha.. not so much)..

+1
That was the biggest thing for me too. I still struggle a little, but always take it very very slow at first and work my way up.

Simplest song to learn left/right hand coordination: "These Eyes" by the Guess Who. Burton Cummings wrote a very easy piano intro in Dm, that anyone can play.

One of the neatest piano outros that I MADE myself learn over the years was "Layla" from EC in his Derek & The Dominoes days. I bought the sheet music and played it and played it and literally forced myself to learn it, until I was almost sick of it. Nowadays, I can jam on "Layla" on my Strat and right when I end the last solo on that "C" note, I quickly flick down the volume knob on the Strat, stand over the big Yamaha keyboard (in grand piano mode) and proceed with the famous outro to "Layla".

If I can learn keyboards and get my left hand to "talk to" my right hand, anyone can! :)


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