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Post subject: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:10 pm
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This is something I just can't understand. Guitars are one of the few things in the world that people seem to put more value into lack of restoration than full professional restoration. I just don't understand it. Would you pay more for a classic vintage automobile if it had corroded bumpers, cracked leather, missing parts and badly faded paint than a beautifully restored one with all of the correct original parts?

If you replace parts with the exact same new parts, why does that reduce value? Is this just some weird by-product of some unique guitar collectors culture or code? I am not in the market to resell my guitars but this situation sort of fascinates me. I try to make anything I buy come back to as beautiful as the day it left the factory yet I'm told doing that makes it worth less than some POS that's "played". Seems to me that unless it was played by Clapton, Beck or someone like that it's just a well traveled gig guitar that's the worse for wear. Maybe someone can explain this to me because it seems to be sort of a unique situation. Even art masterpieces are constantly restored by museums. But guitars seem to be an exception. Go figure...


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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:22 pm
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Mojo does have an allure to some. You mentioned autos, and there currently is a backlash against all of the over restored cars that were the norm for the past 30 years. Originality, if well maintained, is becoming more popular than pristine.
Since I just got my first significant chip in my Am Dlx Strat while at an audition this past weekend, I'm trying to stay calm and convince myself that the chip is now part of this guitars story. I can handle it! :shock:

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 6:53 pm
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matthewweisberg wrote:
This is something I just can't understand. Guitars are one of the few things in the world that people seem to put more value into lack of restoration than full professional restoration. I just don't understand it. Would you pay more for a classic vintage automobile if it had corroded bumpers, cracked leather, missing parts and badly faded paint than a beautifully restored one with all of the correct original parts?

If you replace parts with the exact same new parts, why does that reduce value? Is this just some weird by-product of some unique guitar collectors culture or code? I am not in the market to resell my guitars but this situation sort of fascinates me. I try to make anything I buy come back to as beautiful as the day it left the factory yet I'm told doing that makes it worth less than some POS that's "played". Seems to me that unless it was played by Clapton, Beck or someone like that it's just a well traveled gig guitar that's the worse for wear. Maybe someone can explain this to me because it seems to be sort of a unique situation. Even art masterpieces are constantly restored by museums. But guitars seem to be an exception. Go figure...
I'm with you. I hate beat up guitars and I don't care who played them. I never, ever buy a used guitar that has a bad ding on it, let alone a chip through the paint. I've got 70 guitars in the Music Room at the moment and there's some old ones in there, but not one beater in the batch! 8)

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 6:56 pm
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Have you ever heard of this thing called a hot rod?

Same concept, different thing.

Factory fresh looks cute, used looks bad $@!.

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 7:13 pm
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Buxom...you mean a Ratrod...those are the ones that are old and beat up, a Hotrod is restored and new looking.

T2

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 7:24 pm
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I don't mind honest wear, but accidental damage (dings, scratches) is a negative for me. And deliberate damage is the worst - that's like taking a sander to your brand new BMW. Or taking your girlfriend to the doctor to add wrinkles and a sag job.
Thankfully, "relic" has all the signs of being a fad, and that means that twenty years from now, people will look back at it and say "what were we thinking"?


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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 7:43 pm
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Being all original means something. In the car world all original barn finds are very disirable when found in good shape.


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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 7:46 pm
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tbazzone wrote:
Being all original means something. In the car world all original barn finds are very disirable when found in good shape.



As they say, they are only original ONCE!

T2

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 7:50 pm
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T2Stratman wrote:
tbazzone wrote:
Being all original means something. In the car world all original barn finds are very disirable when found in good shape.



As they say, they are only original ONCE!

T2

Exactly


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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:45 am
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I prefer beat up guitars, they tell a story that words can not describe. Like my beat up 2007 Squier, it has been thrashed around, Hendrix songs played on it etc it sounds better than a MIM fender

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:30 am
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I have been involved with music all my life but I have only been into guitars for a little over a year. I have to say the first time I saw a “relic” Custom Shop guitar on the rack in a store, and then saw the price, I thought “you have got to be kidding me!” I still don’t get it; to me it is fake damage. I do understand Mojo, but only if it is my mojo or someone I respect. I also would cherish and not change anything on a well maintained classic. I will admit I am impressed at how the Custom Shop can duplicate wear on a famous guitar. If you have an iconic instrument that is too valuable to take on the road, I would understand having them make a copy to use for performances. But, if a Relic is what floats your boat, then more power to you. Now when it comes to restoring a guitar, I think you should bring it back to the point that it functions well and leave it at that. Trying to re-finish an old piece of furniture will reduce its value, a guitar is the same.

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:08 am
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T2Stratman wrote:
Buxom...you mean a Ratrod...those are the ones that are old and beat up, a Hotrod is restored and new looking.

T2


When I think of either, I think of flat black paint, fatassed tires in the back, and a 350.

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:38 am
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I owned a '58 Strat which I send to Fender in '69 to be refinished. 25 years later I learned that they had REPLACED the body, not refinished it. :shock: :!: :!: Absent our preferences for pristine looking gear at the time, I'd currently be the owner of a highly valued relic. Hindsight is better than foreskin in this case. :oops: :oops:

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:02 am
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omar59 wrote:
Trying to re-finish an old piece of furniture will reduce its value, a guitar is the same.
Having spent a good 50 years in the antique business, restoring and refinishing antique furniture, I must disagree 100% with this notion. 99% of antique hunters much prefer a carefully restored and refinished piece to the ratty pile that came out of an old barn.

Guitars, yes. There your "serious" collector wants the original in whatever condition, myself excluded, of course. As stated above, I am into older guitars; I'm just not into beaters, no matter the origin of their beating.

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Post subject: Re: Restoration
Posted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:54 am
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CRGuitarMan wrote:
omar59 wrote:
Trying to re-finish an old piece of furniture will reduce its value, a guitar is the same.
Having spent a good 50 years in the antique business, restoring and refinishing antique furniture, I must disagree 100% with this notion. 99% of antique hunters much prefer a carefully restored and refinished piece to the ratty pile that came out of an old barn.


This is true. I do woodworking, and often, refinishing and other repairs are done to prevent further deterioration. But the restoration has to be benign, using accepted methods and materials. Too many pieces have been ruined by good intentions - either allowing deterioration to continue, or doing a "restoration" job that caused other problems down the road.


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