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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 5:16 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
... Vanity distinguishes us from the lower-order primates.

:lol:

Arjay


That... and BEER !! :D :D :D :D

cheers!

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 5:21 am
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Screamin' Armadillo wrote:
GilgaFrank wrote:
Now more than ever the guitar world is full of dreamers who desperately want to believe that one magic mod or one piece of gear can transform them into the great player they want to be.

True, a capacitor won't make a person a better guitarist, but changing key components can make a specific guitar better...or at least closer to what the user is searching for...and while one single cap might not make a huge difference, a set of caps, coupled with specific or unique pickups and a particular type of potentiometer can and does add up to a different sounding guitar.

...and remember, some of the greatest tinkerers and inventors had their own equipment set up in ways we might find peculiar.

Did anyone ever hear of a guy named Lester Polsfuss? His personal guitars were rarely like his average namesake production model, especially at the end of his life...and, even into his 90's, he never stopped searching/chasing "that" tone...I betcha he soldered a few caps in his time, just to be trying something new.

Quote:
In my part of the world we call a spade a spade, not a geomorphic sectioning implement.
And we don't pay 1500 times the price for it just because the manufacturer says it digs better holes.

...while I assume you are being facetious, I'll take the bait on this one; I've dug a few holes in my time, and not all spades are created equal. The right type of tool (in this case, a shovel) for the job (I.e., a hole) can be the difference between a job completed quickly and neatly or a long, arduous mess.

I'll allow everyone else to make the correlation to guitar components.


Dont think he is coming back...
He has got a rude wake up call again to how much he really doesnt know.
He does the same thing when anyone mentions kOhms, he has learned one catch phrase from Bill Lawrence.
He is kind of mental.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 1:55 pm
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I wouldn't say he's mental. There are others who believe the same thing. I think the sound charts actually support most if what he's saying.

Is there a technical difference in sound between the different types of caps? Probably. Those charts do show a difference. But how much if it can the human ear actually hear? Going by those charts, I'm guessing you'd have to be a dog to hear that much of a difference.

I still believe that I could hear a difference in clarity by using an orange drop as opposed to stock poly. But I get the same result by dismantling the tone pot altogether, and the pickups appear to be unrestricted and display a slightly higher output. So why bother with any of it? Of course that's my personal choice. I just don't bother with tone pots anymore.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 2:17 pm
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Jah Soldier wrote:
I still believe that I could hear a difference in clarity by using an orange drop as opposed to stock poly. But I get the same result by dismantling the tone pot altogether, and the pickups appear to be unrestricted and display a slightly higher output. So why bother with any of it? Of course that's my personal choice. I just don't bother with tone pots anymore.

Or you can do like I did on my Tele and install a Fender No-Load Tone Pot...turn that baby all the way up and the pot "clicks" itself out of the circuit...handy-dandy and sounds so nice!

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 2:27 pm
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Screamin' Armadillo wrote:
Jah Soldier wrote:
I still believe that I could hear a difference in clarity by using an orange drop as opposed to stock poly. But I get the same result by dismantling the tone pot altogether, and the pickups appear to be unrestricted and display a slightly higher output. So why bother with any of it? Of course that's my personal choice. I just don't bother with tone pots anymore.

Or you can do like I did on my Tele and install a Fender No-Load Tone Pot...turn that baby all the way up and the pot "clicks" itself out of the circuit...handy-dandy and sounds so nice!



Yeah those are popular lately
I like the sound of the cap in the circuit like Lou.
So there is no need to change my pots.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:30 pm
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I mentioned that I'd done that in an earlier post. If one of my guitars doesn't have a pickguard, it's one of the options I use. Particularly if it's a recording guitar like my Tele which,incidentally, does have one. But no need for my live guitars. It would just be a waste of time and money for me.

I don't expect people to really follow my taste for doing things. I'm quirky about my ways and guitars. I have some for live, some for recording, some for practice. I'm at about 27 guitars right about now, they all serve their purpose in one way or another.

So I do have a few guitars that still have orange drops in them, and by now, the only reason would be that it's kind if a waste of time to take them out of those particular ones. If they're no- load, then again, what's the difference.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:47 pm
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I'm listening to the Black Keys right now. I hear a lot of awesome fuzz and licks, but I don't hear no pots and I don't know what that even is. Ah hmmmm how how how.


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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:53 pm
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Her Wanna wrote:
I'm listening to the Black Keys right now. I hear a lot of awesome fuzz and licks, but I don't hear no pots and I don't know what that even is. Ah hmmmm how how how.


I think your supposed to do something with the pot while listening not sure.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 8:44 pm
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Let me just add something to this mess. Many of the more expensive caps tend to be more consistent in their values. Just because a cap is supposed to be .047 does not mean thats what it is. Test them you will find many variances. .
I've had .047 ceramics test at .043 an.044 on the old Fluke meter but not seen a oil/paper with that much variance.

So there is a difference in caps of the same value because most likely they are not. Think quality.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:14 pm
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cvilleira wrote:
Let me just add something to this mess. Many of the more expensive caps tend to be more consistent in their values. Just because a cap is supposed to be .047 does not mean thats what it is. Test them you will find many variances. .
I've had .047 ceramics test at .043 an.044 on the old Fluke meter but not seen a oil/paper with that much variance.

So there is a difference in caps of the same value because most likely they are not. Think quality.



Exactly what we all but GigaFrank already know. He is the village idiot but we love him :)

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:18 pm
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It's a fun fact I guess. But once again, splitting hairs.

Anytime I've seen someone use their tone knob, it seems rare for them to go anywhere below 5. When using a .047 cap, anything under 4 is basically unusable. It's a muffled murky mess of a sound if you ask me.

If the .047 value is a treble cutting property or amount, then what exactly is the real point behind that fact? That with a more tolerant cap you can reach the unusable point at about 4 instead of 3?

Technically, that may be correct. But I'll leave that one to the ears of the beholders of those who believe that tight tolerance is necessary for their own reasons.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:44 pm
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I'm on the fence with this- I like what my ears tell me and I like my own preferences.. However, I ain't gonna buy in to any mojo hype. If you can really tell the difference blindfolded and you could tell if it was changed out without knowing prior, then all the better for you.
If there were any other capacitors that gave the same result as the said orange or nos capacitors (I'm sure there must be) they would be just as good.

My opinion.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 6:20 am
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I'm also ambivalent here. I think the most important thing is whether something sounds good, and then check what sounded good. Not the other way around.
And, also keep in mind that quality isn't just base specs, because those are going to be for new caps only, at a specific temperature. Take ice cold equipment into a hot place, and I assure you that caps not designed for it will not perform as expected.

But ultimately, what's far more important to the sound is the player. Spending an extra day picking instead of agonizing over which caps to get and having them replaced is likely going to have a bigger positive impact.


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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 8:57 pm
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Tried a .022 Orange Drop in my American Standard its more Scrinchy sounding.
Tried the .022 PIO in the American Deluxe it is smooth and toney I like both.
I like that they sound different.
Very Impressed with the PIO though wow what tone.
Anyone that says there is no difference and you cant hear it really has not installed and compared them.
Basically they gotta just be talking out their bottoms because wow is there ever a difference.
It is very cool to hear.
I now have a Les Paul and Strat with PIOs and a Les Paul and Strat with Orange Drops.

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Post subject: Re: Capacitors, can you handle the truth?
Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 9:56 am
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I guess I am a little late for this rodeo, I just saw this on the Gibson page think I am going to try two in my Epi SG that I have instaled a 57 and A 57 PLUS into and hear what happens
http://www2.gibson.com/News-Lifestyle/Features/en-us/Orange-Drops-Busting-Tone-Control-Capacitor-Myths.aspx?utm_source=iContact&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Gibson%20Guitar%20Corp.&utm_content=Editorial+eBlast+-+February+6%2C+2014


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