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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 3:39 pm
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Location: Dublin, Ireland
cvilleira wrote:
Ya but most places in Europe have no oil of their own. There is
enough oil in the U.S. they just wont let them dril for it. One
of the larget oil discoverys in the last 20 years has been found
in an area of the gulf. Test wells have been very good but they
can not tap due to regulations and Florida will not allow. I believe
the largest supllier of oil to the U.S. is Canada then Mexico
followed by Venesualia which just kicked all the oil companys out
and took the wells over themselfs


You're actually wrong. In Europe we have plenty of oil, we just keep the prices of fuel high (in US standards) to keep a good economy.

In Ireland a US gallon of petrol in approx. $7.20 US.


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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 3:41 pm
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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 3:57 pm
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I had to get rid of my Suburban. Man I wish for gas prices back in the 70's - gas crisis and all.


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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 5:18 pm
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Ya but it is not just gas it everything have to do with energy. I live
in one of the most taxed states there is. We have been run by democrats
for over 50 years exept for 4 year we had a republican gov. and
they would not pass anything of his. They allow deregulation of
the utilities to happen which the dems. pass in 1999 but to take
effect in 2005 with no way to stop it then blamed the republican gov.
who was in office so the dem. would get elected because he said he
would fix it, well he did our gas eletric bill went from 150 a month to
an average of 325 a month in one year. Md the rip u off state car tags
170. 2yrs. and income taxs just increased again. Heck my property tax
brakes down to over 300 a mounth and they just added 1 percent more
to the sales tax and they are talking about raising the gas tax. They are
even talking about a road tax on the amount of miles you put on your
vehicle to be charged to you after you go in for you emission check
or should I say rip off every 2 yrs.


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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 6:10 pm
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Location: I don't even know that!
I am only 14 and looking at the gas prices now, I don't thin I want to drive in another years. By the time I can drive, the gas prices will be insane!


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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 6:22 pm
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Ain't it funny, where somebody in a $5000 suit and $750 shoes, doing the 'talking head' thing on a TV Business program or network (and I'd bet you'd know which network I'm talking about), is complaining about how the consumer and/or the economy is letting THEM down?


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Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 8:33 pm
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JPD wrote:
At this rate we`re going to see more people riding bicycles like in China. Today here in NY the price was 4.05 a gallon. ... It cost about 3 cents to refine a gallon of oil, the rest is all tax.


Think again, the average tax is only about 40 cents per gallon (see the link below where it's given by state AND don't forget to add in the Federal tax of 18 cents) ...

http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp

So I'd say most of it is PROFIT.

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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 6:24 am
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The gas prices are getting so high now that a lot of companies are offering work from home a couple of days a week program to help offset the price of going to work. The company I work for is doing it now.


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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 6:35 am
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Warpfield wrote:
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I remember the gas shortage of the 70's and we knew problems were coming but did nothing to lessen the worlds dependence on oil. That gas shortage turned out to be a great big lie. This one will too. Once we've been gouged to the point that the futures market starts dropping, oil prices will stabilize again.


That shortage was a direct result of Carter's socialistic price controls. Congress had several oil executives in a hearing last week to discuss the high prices for oil and gas. Be aware that this same thing could happen again if we get a democrat president in office having the backing of a democrat controlled Congress.


By the way, I think the chances of a Dem president instituting price controls are more then slim. Which is good because we're going to have a Dem president shortly.

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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 8:18 am
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I hope the high prices teach a nation that being over reliant on fossil fuels should be a thing of the past.
Hopefully, Americans may now get more fuel efficient automobiles like us in Europe have been doing for quiet some time.
I cant believe I am reading of people with vehicles with fuel consumption of 12 mpg- is America aware of climate change?

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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 10:00 am
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Paulie G wrote:
I hope the high prices teach a nation that being over reliant on fossil fuels should be a thing of the past.
Hopefully, Americans may now get more fuel efficient automobiles like us in Europe have been doing for quiet some time.
I cant believe I am reading of people with vehicles with fuel consumption of 12 mpg- is America aware of climate change?


Wasn't it President Bush who denied that global warming was real for years? Didn't three of the Republican presidential candidates raise their hands at a debate when asked if they didn't 'believe' in evolution? They might also have raised their hands on 'Who here doesn't believe in gravity?' but we can only speculate. :)

People in England can't get too snitty here. They encountered a similar situation with 'fossil fuels' (i.e.: Coal) in the mid to late 1800's. Industrialization requires energy and energy requires some form of conversion process of some form of fuel. Unfortunately, the only well-known alternative to coal was oil and natural gas (after years of fiddling with them that is).

Biofuels are an interesting contemporary alternative as these fuels are replenishable unlike coal/oil/gas which require millions and millions of years to form (sorry to the three who raised their hands). One problem is that processing to turn the biological matter into fuel is expensive. This one could be overcome. Another problem is that it takes a lot of biological matter - in the form of crops - to make the fuel. This means diverting crops from food resources as well as using more land to grow the crops. I'd imagine that if we were to attempt to completely replace gas with biofuel, we'd need to turn the entire planet's land surface into a field and starve. This is a problem that may require some advanced bio-engineering (i.e.: genetics).

Wind generators, hydrothermal, solar energies are low-yield. Fission-fusion reactors would be ideal but we're a looooonnnngggg way from a viable fission-fusion reactor. And these currently don't cover the small, mobile fuel systems - just large, fixed generators of distributed energy.


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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 10:35 am
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Kuroyume wrote:
Paulie G wrote:
I hope the high prices teach a nation that being over reliant on fossil fuels should be a thing of the past.
Hopefully, Americans may now get more fuel efficient automobiles like us in Europe have been doing for quiet some time.
I cant believe I am reading of people with vehicles with fuel consumption of 12 mpg- is America aware of climate change?


Wasn't it President Bush who denied that global warming was real for years? Didn't three of the Republican presidential candidates raise their hands at a debate when asked if they didn't 'believe' in evolution? They might also have raised their hands on 'Who here doesn't believe in gravity?' but we can only speculate. :)

People in England can't get too snitty here. They encountered a similar situation with 'fossil fuels' (i.e.: Coal) in the mid to late 1800's. Industrialization requires energy and energy requires some form of conversion process of some form of fuel. Unfortunately, the only well-known alternative to coal was oil and natural gas (after years of fiddling with them that is).

Biofuels are an interesting contemporary alternative as these fuels are replenishable unlike coal/oil/gas which require millions and millions of years to form (sorry to the three who raised their hands). One problem is that processing to turn the biological matter into fuel is expensive. This one could be overcome. Another problem is that it takes a lot of biological matter - in the form of crops - to make the fuel. This means diverting crops from food resources as well as using more land to grow the crops. I'd imagine that if we were to attempt to completely replace gas with biofuel, we'd need to turn the entire planet's land surface into a field and starve. This is a problem that may require some advanced bio-engineering (i.e.: genetics).

Wind generators, hydrothermal, solar energies are low-yield. Fission-fusion reactors would be ideal but we're a looooonnnngggg way from a viable fission-fusion reactor. And these currently don't cover the small, mobile fuel systems - just large, fixed generators of distributed energy.


That may be true about England, coal was used excessively because people did not know any better, thankfully we do now-or do they in America?Doesn't look like judging by the petrol consumption
By the way, when I mentioned Europe in the preceeding message, I did not mention England. Europe does not mean England

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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 10:45 am
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Kuroyume wrote:
Paulie G wrote:
I hope the high prices teach a nation that being over reliant on fossil fuels should be a thing of the past.
Hopefully, Americans may now get more fuel efficient automobiles like us in Europe have been doing for quiet some time.
I cant believe I am reading of people with vehicles with fuel consumption of 12 mpg- is America aware of climate change?


Wasn't it President Bush who denied that global warming was real for years? Didn't three of the Republican presidential candidates raise their hands at a debate when asked if they didn't 'believe' in evolution? They might also have raised their hands on 'Who here doesn't believe in gravity?' but we can only speculate. :)

People in England can't get too snitty here. They encountered a similar situation with 'fossil fuels' (i.e.: Coal) in the mid to late 1800's. Industrialization requires energy and energy requires some form of conversion process of some form of fuel. Unfortunately, the only well-known alternative to coal was oil and natural gas (after years of fiddling with them that is).

Biofuels are an interesting contemporary alternative as these fuels are replenishable unlike coal/oil/gas which require millions and millions of years to form (sorry to the three who raised their hands). One problem is that processing to turn the biological matter into fuel is expensive. This one could be overcome. Another problem is that it takes a lot of biological matter - in the form of crops - to make the fuel. This means diverting crops from food resources as well as using more land to grow the crops. I'd imagine that if we were to attempt to completely replace gas with biofuel, we'd need to turn the entire planet's land surface into a field and starve. This is a problem that may require some advanced bio-engineering (i.e.: genetics).

Wind generators, hydrothermal, solar energies are low-yield. Fission-fusion reactors would be ideal but we're a looooonnnngggg way from a viable fission-fusion reactor. And these currently don't cover the small, mobile fuel systems - just large, fixed generators of distributed energy.


...You're right about England, but that was 200 years ago! .....and Bush might not believe in Global warming, but that doesn't mean that nobody else should.

...We might need to make space to grow bio-fuels, but it's either that or our planet will turn into a giant desert.

I'm not trying to jump down your throat Kuroyume, I just thought I had to comment on the things in your post.


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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 11:22 am
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Paulie G wrote:
I hope the high prices teach a nation that being over reliant on fossil fuels should be a thing of the past.
Hopefully, Americans may now get more fuel efficient automobiles like us in Europe have been doing for quiet some time.
I cant believe I am reading of people with vehicles with fuel consumption of 12 mpg- is America aware of climate change?
Quote:
Climate change has been ongoing since the begging of time. We have had
cold and hot spells many times over its the cycle of life. Can't just
blame it on cars. Not everyone wants to ride around in a shopping
cart with a lawnmower motor. It is nice to have that 20ft.long pickup
at times 12mpg or not I also have my little Honda 38mpg and my
midsize Honda 28mpg.. I be willing to bet they all pollute less then
most of cars built 10 years ago.


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Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 11:27 am
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Paulie G wrote:
That may be true about England, coal was used excessively because people did not know any better, thankfully we do now-or do they in America?Doesn't look like judging by the petrol consumption
By the way, when I mentioned Europe in the preceeding message, I did not mention England. Europe does not mean England


By the end, England was getting the hint. This is one reason why they ramped up expansionism towards the end (see Iraq).

I think that people ignore rather than not know better. We know that everything is limited. Although trees are replenishable, if you cut down entire forests for fire wood without consideration for how long it takes for trees to replenish, you are ignoring the problem (general 'you' here of course).

America is ignoring the supply/demand here - demand is rising but supply is dwindling. We 'knew' this back in the 1970's - see how much progress was made in finding alternatives. ;)


Last edited by Kuroyume on Wed May 28, 2008 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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