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Post subject: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:06 am
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Aspiring Musician
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I'm a horrible guitar player, IMO. Okay? Let's get that out of the way. I can basically do my cowboy chords and power chords. I basically know the pentatonic scale but I never practice scales seriously. I can make up solos kind of Cobain-ish (not as good) because I have not bothered to truly learn to solo in the blues scale. I sort of approximate it. I can't fingerpick and I've barely tried playing with a slide. The slide I bought is too big for my pinky so I've done it with my ring finger. I can play a lot of songs that I like, both Nirvana stuff and cowboy chord stuff using a capo. But because I still can't always nail a chord with one swift plant, I like to arpeggio, which sounds pretty, but really it's cheating because I have to do that while I get that last finger down. I took exactly 4 lessons about 2.5 years ago and then have been self-taught since then. That being said...

I finally found a new teacher closer to me and I took another lesson last night. I paid for 4 in advance. I’m not one of these smart aleck kids who thinks I have nothing to learn (see above paragraph). But I’m feeling pretty down right now, dudes, because basically the lesson was everything I feared: this guy has nothing to offer me. He can’t teach me anything I can’t learn on youtube. The youtube lessons, in fact, are clearer than his sloppy tab writing. After we spent 30 minutes jamming with me basically showing him what I know, and my telling him I’m an open book and I want him to tell me what to learn next, his answers was 7 chords. And he wants to teach me the Beatle’s song while my guitar gently weeps.

My point is: if I want to learn that, I can learn it from youtube and it’s up to me to simply practice it.

I need to keep practicing my chords. Practice my scales. Learn 7 chords if I feel motivated to do it.

Paying this guy $55/hour is not adding anything, in my opinion. All it did is force me to take my guitar out into the rain/humidity (in its case) and go into his cramped studio where he had a stool that was way too high and I couldn’t even tap my foot as I’ve learned to do to keep time.

Again, I know I have a lot to learn. I suck. My point here is that I think the world really has come to a point where a live teacher is outdated. And this guy won the award for “best teacher” in my local paper’s annual survey too. You really can learn ANYTHING you want to learn using youtube. Even if some guys don’t have it right. For any song, any chord, any scale, anything, you will find 50 competing videos. You can watch all of them and pick and choose the best of each.

If I want to learn while my guitar gently weeps, I don’t need this guy to show it to me. I can learn that using youtube like I learned the other 80 songs I know.

Just like I had no desire to learn smoke on the water or rock you like a hurricane that my first teacher taught me 2 years ago. I can look up any chord and learn it if I choose to do that. All a live teacher adds is his agenda—wanting to show you songs from 50 years ago that you might not have any interest in. With youtube I can learn what I want to learn.

Even jazz/classical stuff.

So I’m pissed at myself that I just gave this guy $220 in advance. That’s 25% of a nice guitar or amp.

Thoughts?


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:49 am
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My immediate thought is that a good guitar teacher will always have value if you want to improve your playing.

It sounds like the teacher you picked wants to teach by rote, and didn't really observe what might help you or help you to engage, despite you having shown what you think are you strengths and weaknesses and saying "help me be better at this stuff". It sounds to me like this teacher missed an open goal!

Having said that, there are absolutely hundreds of amazing guitarists who never had a lesson in their life. Some of them were even established guitar gods way before the guys that created youtube were born...

so maybe I know zip about this!

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:57 am
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Professional Musician
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Looks like you have the answer, youtube :) It's been working for me for many years.


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:30 am
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Her Wanna wrote:
I can look up any chord and learn it if I choose to do that.

Hello Her Wanna: but from what you say, you haven't looked up and learned many chords. Or much else, by your own account.

One of the important things a teacher does is encourage you to get on and do stuff and make progress, instead of noodling around with the same few things you can already do. A lot of us could do with that regular kick up the backside, so that's value for money all by itself.


Her Wanna wrote:
If I want to learn while my guitar gently weeps, I don’t need this guy to show it to me.

Was he showing you My Guitar Gently Weeps because he thinks it's a number you should know, or because it contains some technique or other he thinks you need to know? I'd want to ask him that, because it's an important difference. A lot of the time, when you're learning it can involve material you're not particularly interested in. But that's not necessarily the point.


Her Wanna wrote:
Thoughts?

Speaking as one of the millions of self-taught guitarists on this planet I can say from experience that the self-taught musician has a very ignorant teacher. I wish I'd been taught by someone who knew more than I did at the time.

Youtube's fine. It also has its severe limitations.

Cheers - C

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:56 am
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Ceri wrote:
Speaking as one of the millions of self-taught guitarists on this planet I can say from experience that the self-taught musician has a very ignorant teacher. I wish I'd been taught by someone who knew more than I did at the time.


Seconded by another completely self-taught guitarist (who now, ironically, teaches on occasion :lol: ) - I'd have made progress a lot faster with a teacher, but I was just a stubborn (insert expletive here) and did it myself anyway, teaching myself a LOT of bad habits along the way, which after you've been doing them for 20 years or so are an absolute pain in the (insert intimate area of anatomy here)!

The best thing a teacher can offer which no Youtube video can is honest feedback, assessment and criticism. Your friends, family and people on the internet will never be as honest with you as you really need to progress.

Even something as simple as seeing the way you hold a pick and saying "Hey, that's cool, but it's a lot easier if you do it like this..." can make a world of difference - that's coming from someone who to this day holds his pick in a rather odd way, and wishes someone had told him to change it many years ago. :mrgreen:

Also, learning something you don't want to and getting it perfect is a very valuable lesson for future playing, as you'll encounter it a hell of a lot if you're going to be out there playing in bands. :lol:


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:59 am
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I'm 62 and taking lessons. The reason is because I'm lucky enough to have a teacher who helps me realize how much I don't know. We're focusing on modes right now. It makes my head spin. But the value, when I finally conquer them, will be enormous. Being able to move between minor pentatonic, major pentatonic, mixolydian, dorian, and natural minor scales is something most guys won't successfully learn on their own. I know I wouldn't and I watch Youtube also.

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:33 am
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Man I really wish there was a guitar teacher near where I live. The closest one is nearly 50 miles away. Anyways, I think a guitar teacher would be a good idea because I believe you will be less prone to slack off if your teacher is expecting you to make some progress each week. That and I think it's a good to have someone who's been playing longer than you to point out if your doing anything wrong because right now I have no idea if I have poor technique etc.


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:43 am
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Aspiring Musician
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There are some songs that I just can't figure out(too fast, don't know the scale/mode). If there's a guy that happens to know the correct way to play those songs, it's worth a lesson from him/her on how to do so.


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:46 pm
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I think you answered yourself in your first 5 words. Why not give this guy a chance, if your way is not working that well. If you learn anything new consider it money well spent.

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:12 pm
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Ceri wrote:
Her Wanna wrote:
If I want to learn while my guitar gently weeps, I don’t need this guy to show it to me.

Was he showing you My Guitar Gently Weeps because he thinks it's a number you should know, or because it contains some technique or other he thinks you need to know? I'd want to ask him that, because it's an important difference. A lot of the time, when you're learning it can involve material you're not particularly interested in. But that's not necessarily the point.

THIS! +100
My guitar teacher often teaches me songs that I have little to no interest in, but there is always a reason. He knows what I like, and he knows what I can do, so he does his best to challenge me, and help my technique.
Also, don't forget that your teacher works for YOU. You pay him, therefore, you have every right to tell him how you want things to function.
Good luck!


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:31 pm
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I would never pay for lessons in advance. But since you did, you might as well take them. Talk to him openly and honestly about exactly what you want to learn and how you feel about the first lesson. Make sure he understands what it is you want to learn.

I got nowhere playing guitar until I found my current teacher. He has been playing guitar for about 40 years and teaching guitar for about 30 years. He will teach me anything I want to learn. He is a blues/rock/metal guy, but a while back he told me he was learning Lady Gaga songs because some of his younger female students wanted to learn them. He has taught me songs, lead licks, the easiest way to play certain things, technique, and even strange chords I never would have even dreamed existed. And YT cannot watch you play and correct your technique.

In the end, you have to decide what is best for you. But I recommend finding a very experienced, patient teacher who will teach you what you want to learn. And I would not pay in advance, let alone sign a contract.

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:32 pm
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There are many, dare I say most, Guitar players who are self-taught without the benefit of a Teacher.

But each of these is a unique case of varying Talent, Perseverence and Exposure. Their results are varying as well.

Everyone in the end is self-taught, the Teacher merely points you in the right direction and cuts the Learning Curve. But, you use what they impart to teach yourself.

And yes, Teachers also come in all grades. Do your research before taking a lesson from someone, and don't be afraid to switch if you feel it's not working out.

On that note, be sure sufficient time has passed to know whether the fault lies in the Teacher... or you. I suspect the one lesson you've had, or even the 4 you've paid for represents insufficient time.

Perhaps you're expectations are too high... the Teacher is not a Magician, and from what you're saying, neither are you !

I just don't see an argument against taking lessons, assuming you have the means and the opportunity.

I started mine a month ago and have progressed at a rate several months advanced of where I'd have been had I not taken lessons.

cheers!

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:43 pm
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Sounds like you closed your mind to lessons. You should get your money back. Or you should open your mind up an tell the teacher what you have in mind for what you want to learn and go with it. And an hour lesson is to much you should go 1/2 hr at a time and practice what your taught and enjoy it or maybe find a new teacher. I've been playin for 35 plus years and still enjoy taking lessons when I get into a rut.


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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:57 pm
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tbazzone wrote:
... And an hour lesson is to much you should go 1/2 hr at a time and practice what your ...


+1 !!

When I started, I asked my Teacher if we should do a ½ Hr. once a week, or 1 Hr. every other week.

He said the ½ Hr. once a week, that he didn't have anything to teach me for an entire hour.

Said that at my stage (beginner), everything was a progression... learn 'A', go onto 'B', etc. and that the last ½ Hr. would end up breaking down into expensive 'practice time'.

Now that I've had a few lessons, I see that he was right !

Cheers!

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Post subject: Re: Lessons. Why?
Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:20 pm
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Formal lessons or not, you should be trying to spend as much time as you can around as many people who have been playing longer than you have as possible.

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